No wonder music shops close.

[Prime_BASS]

I can't say I've had that kind of trouble from music shops but since they a thin on the ground here I've almost always brought online.

HotRox in Nottingham I by far the best I've ever been. Actual instument stock is poop but everything else they are excellent, they know what they are on with and never had trouble with them in regards to trying stuff out. Even had special stock brought in for me and they rang me back to say its in.

[Weststarx]

Has anyone been to Supatone in Norwich that has opened recently? Would like to check them out!

[mentalextra]

This isnt just about music shops though. Time and time again local shops think 'service' is being able to process payments quickly

[flyfisher]

[quote name='Diablo' timestamp='1397978166' post='2429067']
Shops blame online competition, but I don't see that really. It is how the customer perceives the service and how you stock and present goods the customer wants to buy.
[/quote]

Customer service is about the only competitive advantage a shop has compared to online selling. If they don't excel at it then what else can they offer?

Perhaps music shops are surviving on the business of inexperienced customers buying instruments and gear for the first time and therefore not really sure what they want or who can't tell when they are being fobbed off. I'd guess most BCers are beyond that stage and are more knowledgable and, therefore, more critical. Let's face it, everyone gets annoyed at sales assistants who can't actually help because they know less about things than the customer - in all branches of retailing.

[flyfisher]

[quote name='mentalextra' timestamp='1397988525' post='2429176']
This isnt just about music shops though. Time and time again local shops think 'service' is being able to process payments quickly
[/quote]

Agreed, not just music shops, the same issue is everywhere. John Lewis is a notable exception in my experience.

[Musicman20]

[quote name='flyfisher' timestamp='1397989137' post='2429187']
Agreed, not just music shops, the same issue is everywhere. John Lewis is a notable exception in my experience.
[/quote]

I agree with that. John Lewis are great, and they give very generous warranties with their electrical items.

[uncle psychosis]

[quote name='Diablo' timestamp='1397978166' post='2429067']

Shops blame online competition, but I don't see that really. It is how the customer perceives the service and how you stock and present goods the customer wants to buy.

[/quote]

Indeed.

Shops can't compete with the internet on stock or price, so they have to compete on service. Sadly most of them don't seem to have worked that out yet.

[Evil Undead]

[quote name='discreet' timestamp='1397980105' post='2429080']


This made me LOL, Mel - [size=4]I suppose they're OK for animals, though? [/size]
[/quote]

Especially horses

[mep]

The last music shop in Torquay closed recently. TBH I have only bought a few thing in there and would generally buy online. Now the nearest shop is Mansons, which I like but can't always justify the 40 mile round trip very often. I have most of what I need bass wise any buy strings in bulk online. I need a few PA things occasionally and that is online too.

[mentalextra]

[quote name='uncle psychosis' timestamp='1397989934' post='2429202']
Indeed.

Shops can't compete with the internet on stock or price, so they have to compete on service. Sadly most of them don't seem to have worked that out yet.
[/quote]

Yes, and there seems to be a general, local shop attitude of "you've done the research and you've just turned up to take away the box". Interesting, that supermarkets are offering free home delivery, local shops were doing that 50yrs ago!

[Annoying Twit]

As I see it, the primary advantage that a local shop has is that you can try the actual instrument out and see what you think of it. I find that there's enough variation in the same make and model that it's a big plus. Also, with lower and mid-priced instruments, if the shop sets them up properly before purchase, that's another big bonus which I would pay +delta for.

[Bassmonkey]

I recently found a Harvest Bass Case at a uk retailer. Was on their website. Contacted them to buy they wouldn't ship. I offered to pay extra. No, only available if I went in. Being 200 miles away, I declined and bought direct from Germany. Good luck staying in business guys!

[flyfisher]

[quote name='Annoying Twit' timestamp='1397994997' post='2429281']
As I see it, the primary advantage that a local shop has is that you can try the actual instrument out and see what you think of it. I find that there's enough variation in the same make and model that it's a big plus. Also, with lower and mid-priced instruments, if the shop sets them up properly before purchase, that's another big bonus which I would pay +delta for.
[/quote]

But you have a legal right to return anything bought online if you don't like it, so would you prefer an hour or two in a shop or a few days at home?

Fair point about set ups. That could be a service differentiator for shops that offered a free set up to the customer's exact requirements. Wouldn't be much use for gear and accessories though.

[Guest FretNoMore]

I think the main reason for me to buy locally is my impatience; if it's in stock I can even take a higher price. I will however probably not order from the shop since it usually is both more expensive and takes longer to get here. I understand it must be very costly for stores to have a large stock, especially of more expensive gear, but that's the catch 22 they need to deal with. Have hard to sell things in stock that they risk losing money on, or don't sell at all. Which is why you'll usually only find top-10 selling low end stuff in stock.

Edited April 20, 2014 by FretNoMore

[skej21]

[quote name='mentalextra' timestamp='1397994478' post='2429272']


Yes, and there seems to be a general, local shop attitude of "you've done the research and you've just turned up to take away the box"
[/quote]

Ironically, the reason for this is the Internet again. The more people buying online pushes prices down and means that retailers save money on staffing by hiring cheaper staff who have less knowledge and get less training.

This results in a shift towards a 'the more people who come in to pick up a product after hours of researching online, the better' attitude because it means they can still make money without spending lots on staff! It's the retailers way of trying to exploit the Internet researchers but in such a naive way that it's doing more damage to them.

Edited April 20, 2014 by skej21

[molan]

About half of all sales through the shop I work in are online and about half of these are international so we see quite a few different sides of the modern instrument retailing market.

We get some people who absolutely refuse to buy without an extensive period of in-store trial (our longest is someone who drove to the store overnight, slept in the car park and stayed all day!) and others who buy online without asking a single question beforehand. In fact we sold a custom bass yesterday to a customer in Slovenia who didn't ask a single question about it.

Conversely some online customers have mail trails that reach into the hundreds - one guy sent 54 emails in a day asking about multiple instruments and potential custom builds.

We aim to treat in-store and online customers the same in terms of both service and pricing. I'm sure we're by no means perfect but we do the best we can. We definitely believe that service is important but realise we can't really charge much of a premium for it.

It's interesting to watch the online pricing strategies of the really big retailers. I track a number of lines across two particular suppliers and the biggest of these has been quietly pushing prices up over the last 18 months. I'd initially thought some of his was currency fluctuation stuff but I've noticed that both € and £ prices have risen. I've discussed this with distributors and manufacturers and there's definitely a view that prices are quietly increasing on some key product lines.

It seems that the bigger they get, and as their completion stutters and fails, the more they are able to dictate market prices. Unsurprisingly they seem to be using their dominance to increase their operating margins. It'll be interesting to see how things develop as traditional bricks and mortar businesses fail.

Basses are, essentially, quite a niche market compared to those that have most obviously been a success online. If we end up with just a couple of really large online retail outlets I'd surmise that prices will rise rather than fall and that range of stock will reduce because profits will be easier to maximise from a limited stock holding.

Might be good news for custom builders who compete on more than just price. . .

[Hutton]

To be fair to iiMusic I have had a pm from the boss of the main branch in Edinburgh who is a basschatter. He made profuse apologies and didn't try to offer any silly excuses. He has also taken steps to rectify the situation with the Aberdeen staff and so hopefully things will improve. So fair play to the guy for taking on board the criticism and doing something about it. I certainly hope things improve as we're a bit short of decent stores up here.

[Thunderbird]

I admit I do the online thing now as my 1 small local shop is hopeless no basses pretty crap attitude blah blah blah I am all for supporting small shops but most of the time they are there own worst enemies

[lou24d53]

[quote name='Kev' timestamp='1397947682' post='2429001']
With exception to Bass Direct and maybe a couple of others I have not frequented, this seems to be the norm these days
[/quote]

I keep reading on here about how good Bass Direct are, but in my experience, they are not the 'holier than thou' retailer they are painted to be on here. I've only ordered online from them twice, but on both occasions, I have had to chase up my order.

The first time, it took three emails from me to chase up the correct speakon cable I had ordered along with with a Genz Benz 1x12" Focus cabinet, with me having to send the initial incorrectly sent cable back to them AT MY EXPENSE. The second order, I had to chase up my Darkglass Vintage Microtubes pedal two days after I placed the order, despite being told it would be posted the day I placed it.

I'm sure Bass Direct are one of, if not THE, best bass retailers in the UK, but they also are not without fault.

Edited April 20, 2014 by lou24d53

[lou24d53]

[quote name='mentalextra' timestamp='1397988525' post='2429176']
This isnt just about music shops though. Time and time again local shops think 'service' is being able to process payments quickly
[/quote]

Completely agree with that.

Popped into House Of Fraser in Glasgow last week with my wife to return some clothes she had ordered for her holiday in a few months time, we ended up having to trail through various departments and queue up at THREE different desks in order to return the stuff.

Their whole returning of goods experience has obviously been set up for the sole benefit of House Of Fraser and not the customer. Very poor.

God, I like a good ol' moan..........fnarr, fnarr.......

[ash]

I use Promenade Music - just down the road in Morecambe. Despite doing a lot of business online they always have a decent stock of good quality basses thanks to Gary who works there and happens to be a bassist himself. I can't fault the staff and service there and there's none of that elitist rubbish of many shops - they welcome beginners and established pro musos equally - as indeed it should be. Guess we are spoilt here!

[Musicman20]

[quote name='ash' timestamp='1398004014' post='2429420']
I use Promenade Music - just down the road in Morecambe. Despite doing a lot of business online they always have a decent stock of good quality basses thanks to Gary who works there and happens to be a bassist himself. I can't fault the staff and service there and there's none of that elitist rubbish of many shops - they welcome beginners and established pro musos equally - as indeed it should be. Guess we are spoilt here!
[/quote]
+1

I've used Promenade for puchases and Gary is fantastic.

[steve-bbb]

Add it to google as a review

[MB1]

ash'
I use Promenade Music - just down the road in Morecambe. Despite doing a lot of business online they always have a decent stock of good quality basses thanks to Gary who works there and happens to be a bassist himself. I can't fault the staff and service there and there's none of that elitist rubbish of many shops - they welcome beginners and established pro musos equally - as indeed it should be. Guess we are spoilt here!

MB1.
+Twelvety!
Great Service and most helpfull.

[discreet]

I have to do all my shopping online, because living as I do in the wasteland that is Inner London there just aren't many alternatives. [size=4]Er... ha, ha! Actually it's because I get 'shop fatigue' very quickly and can't make proper decisions unless I'm poring over things on a screen with all the pics, specs and stats immediately to hand. [/size][size=4]Sad and disturbing, really.[/size]

[size=4]I get 'museum fatigue' and 'gallery fatigue' as well - there are just so many things to look at I can't look at any of 'em and go straight to the caff for cake. [/size] [size=4]I'd rather see the Mona Lisa in my own time online, or as a print in a book, rather than jostle with a load of tourists to see the real thing for about ten seconds. [/size][size=4]That's where they get you, y'see - real life just doesn't measure up to the genuine online experience... [/size]

Edited April 20, 2014 by discreet