mcnach Posted October 19, 2014 Share Posted October 19, 2014 [quote name='Annoying Twit' timestamp='1413673505' post='2580884'] Are you sure you could tell the difference if your baby had actually been made by a different body wood? [/quote] ha! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyfisher Posted October 19, 2014 Share Posted October 19, 2014 Even if wood can be shown to have a perceptible effect on the sound of a bass guitar, what would anyone do with that knowledge? Indeed, what [u]could[/u] they do with it, given that wood is an organic material and that every single piece will have have some unique characteristics, even pieces from the same species and quite probably even pieces from the same tree! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bolo Posted October 20, 2014 Share Posted October 20, 2014 [quote name='flyfisher' timestamp='1413759646' post='2581678'] Even if wood can be shown to have a perceptible effect on the sound of a bass guitar, what would anyone do with that knowledge? Indeed, what [u]could[/u] they do with it, given that wood is an organic material and that every single piece will have have some unique characteristics, even pieces from the same species and quite probably even pieces from the same tree! [/quote] They would market materials for different types of music. Just like today, but with science on their side so you don't need to use your own ears or judgement anymore. You'd be a fool to disagree with SCIENCE! Science..ience..ence.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annoying Twit Posted October 20, 2014 Author Share Posted October 20, 2014 (edited) [quote name='flyfisher' timestamp='1413759646' post='2581678'] Even if wood can be shown to have a perceptible effect on the sound of a bass guitar, what would anyone do with that knowledge? Indeed, what [u]could[/u] they do with it, given that wood is an organic material and that every single piece will have have some unique characteristics, even pieces from the same species and quite probably even pieces from the same tree! [/quote] It would depend on how much variation there is in the one within species compared to between different species. If the intra-species tone variation was small, and the inter-species tone variation was large, then it would be sensible for instrument designers to choose the body wood species that has the desired tone. However, since the best information we have to date is that wood species doesn't make a significant difference, they shouldn't. [quote name='Bolo' timestamp='1413782507' post='2581709'] They would market materials for different types of music. Just like today, but with science on their side so you don't need to use your own ears or judgement anymore. You'd be a fool to disagree with SCIENCE! Science..ience..ence.. [/quote] The huge amount of audio woo out there (e.g. 'audiophile USB cables') shows that leaving things up to people's own ears and judgement is a recipe for widespread superstition and myth. I prefer facts. The AudioAsylum forum has banned discussion of double blind / ABX trials in some of their forums. http://www.audioasylum.com/cgi/d.mpl?audio/faq.html I bet they are very happy in their foolery. Edited October 20, 2014 by Annoying Twit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyfisher Posted October 20, 2014 Share Posted October 20, 2014 [quote name='Bolo' timestamp='1413782507' post='2581709'] They would market materials for different types of music. Just like today, but with science on their side so you don't need to use your own ears or judgement anymore. You'd be a fool to disagree with SCIENCE! Science..ience..ence.. [/quote] True. Just like they market signature basses so that we can all sound like our heroes as well as fancy cables and a million effect pedals, not to mention celebrity endorsements. Perhaps most musicians are not confident enough to want their own sound, or even know what they want it to be, and therefore strive to sound like someone else? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discreet Posted October 20, 2014 Share Posted October 20, 2014 (edited) [quote name='flyfisher' timestamp='1413801888' post='2581967'] True. Just like they market signature basses so that we can all sound like our heroes as well as fancy cables and a million effect pedals, not to mention celebrity endorsements. Perhaps most musicians are not confident enough to want their own sound, or even know what they want it to be, and therefore strive to sound like someone else? [/quote] It's a massive GAS-based delusion, though. Even if you had a 100% identical set-up to (insert name of hero), there is no way you are going to sound like him (or her) due to a hundred different parameters such as upbringing, education, musical background and influences, physical attributes, style, X-Factor, and so on and so forth. The whole deal about 'well, (hero) has got one of these so now I can play like them,' is spurious at best. But you knew that already. Having said that, I only bought a Hayman so I could sound like, er... ah... um. And obviously I bought a G&L SB-2 so that everyone would think I'm as good as... ah... thingy. You know. Edited October 20, 2014 by discreet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annoying Twit Posted October 20, 2014 Author Share Posted October 20, 2014 (edited) Edit: Re: sounding like heroes I've had a number of people say I must be a good player because I own basses with more than four strings. Never quite worked that one out. Edited October 20, 2014 by Annoying Twit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discreet Posted October 20, 2014 Share Posted October 20, 2014 [quote name='Annoying Twit' timestamp='1413809823' post='2582125'] I've had a number of people say I must be a good player because I own basses with more than four strings. Never quite worked that one out. [/quote] Using that logic, Anthony Jackson must be a genius! Oh, wait... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EBS_freak Posted October 23, 2014 Share Posted October 23, 2014 Just been catching up on this thread... And was intrigued about the age of wood being a factor. Whilst I am still convinced that body wood age doesn't make a significant difference to electrics, I got out my Taylor acoustic 412ce that I bought 10 years ago. When I bought it, it sounded great plugged in but pretty naff acoustically. Real thin and toppy. The wood is really pale and anaemic looking. Funnily enough I got it out the other day and in the 7 or 8 years since I've played it, it has changed colour significantly and is a more honey coloured shade now. I even got old photos out to make sure I wasn't going mad. Playing it acoustically, it seems a lot more mellow than it was. It still has a very bright sound but there's significant more mids and lows than I remember. Would I say it's now a killer sounding acoustic? Probably not... But I wish I could reliably compare the now and then sounds. As for old fender basses sounding better than new... I still say that's down to the pickups. I would like to be able to reliably compare brand new pickups and how they sound to how they sound after sitting in a bass for fifty years. I reckon the breakdown of the magnet is a key component here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Telebass Posted October 25, 2014 Share Posted October 25, 2014 Indeed, magnets age. They get weaker over time, abd this must affect the output. For a start, it must decrease a bit. If you then adjust the pickup closer to get more output, it will likely change the tone. Or if you were able to compare the sound, unadjusted and years apart, the magnets would account for most if not all of the change. Movement and drying of wood, particularly if the finish is largely gone a la Rory Gallagher, might also change things a little. But I can't imagine it having a great effect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annoying Twit Posted October 25, 2014 Author Share Posted October 25, 2014 If we think logically, then we can think up reasons why wood drying and finish wearing off might change the tone. But that doesn't help us answer the most important question, which is whether it makes enough of a difference that we can actually notice it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Telebass Posted October 26, 2014 Share Posted October 26, 2014 Precisely. Even the nagnets aging takes decades. You'd need a time machine to chevk on the sound difference, and then it wouldn't be great. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andyjr1515 Posted October 26, 2014 Share Posted October 26, 2014 [quote name='Telebass' timestamp='1414288005' post='2587953'] Precisely. Even the nagnets aging takes decades. You'd need a time machine to chevk on the sound difference, and then it wouldn't be great. [/quote] ...and during that time, your hearing shifts anyway. Mmmm...a tricky conundrum this one... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beer of the Bass Posted October 26, 2014 Share Posted October 26, 2014 (edited) [quote name='Telebass' timestamp='1414288005' post='2587953'] Precisely. Even the nagnets aging takes decades. You'd need a time machine to chevk on the sound difference, and then it wouldn't be great. [/quote] It's not hard to degauss alnico magnets through other means than waiting a few decades though, so the difference is actually well understood and easily recreated. There are quite a few pickup makers out there who have measured the strength of the magnets from vintage pickups and charged the magnets in their new pickups to the same level. Personally I think that ageing is a bit of a red herring when it comes to electric guitars and basses. So many of our benchmark recordings of what are now considered vintage instruments were made when the instruments were no more than 10 or 15 years old. Edited October 26, 2014 by Beer of the Bass Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Telebass Posted October 26, 2014 Share Posted October 26, 2014 Oh indeed. I personally think the obsession with all things vintage is a bit of a joke, not unlike when Eric Johnson used to obsess about the right carbon - zinc batteries in his pedals! Even he wised up eventually. Find instrument that suits you. Play it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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