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BTW...what is a Pro..??


JTUK
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[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1418758569' post='2633060']
Hear the line, 'pro player' used here by many and I wonder what most people think it means..?
To me, all it means is that someone earns most of their wage playing music..
It is not necessarily anything to do with the standard that they play at...
[/quote]

That would be my definition too.

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[quote name='lojo' timestamp='1418759527' post='2633080']
I'm not a pro, don't know theory and have a limited skill set, but sometimes get paid quite well for playing covers whilst people dance and enjoy themselves , this seems to piss off some pros.
[/quote]

I am in this category if indeed a category exists for such a player.

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[quote name='lojo' timestamp='1418759527' post='2633080']
I'm not a pro, don't know theory and have a limited skill set, but sometimes get paid quite well for playing covers whilst people dance and enjoy themselves , this seems to piss off some pros.
[/quote]
Unlike a plumber or a nurse etc a musician falls into the category of 'the arts' which has no legal requirement to be a grade 8 or anything, as long as your diary is full you are doing ok although the more strings to your bow the better obviously :)

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Slightly more seriously, I think it should be a player who earns their living from playing music - I would personally exclude teaching from this, as to me that is a completely different skill set and many great teachers would not necessarily make it as pro players just as many pro players will be awful teachers. There are of course many notable exceptions.

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[quote name='Mykesbass' timestamp='1418761272' post='2633126']
Slightly more seriously, I think it should be a player who earns their living from playing music - I would personally exclude teaching from this...
[/quote]

Why? If they're making a living from the bass then does it not count? What about luthiers and builders? They can make a living from the bass too, but not from actually playing it. What about retailers? What about the people at Bass Direct? What about Andy Baxter?

What about the children? WON'T SOMEBODY THINK OF THE CHILDREN??

Edited by discreet
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[quote name='discreet' timestamp='1418761543' post='2633131']
Why? If they're making a living from the bass then does it not count? What about luthiers and builders? They can make a living from the bass too, but not from actually playing it. What about retailers? What about the people at Bass Direct? What about Andy Baxter?

What about the children? WON'T SOMEBODY THINK OF THE CHILDREN??
[/quote]

But the OP was about Pro Players - hopefully a huge percentage of the teacher's time will be not playing! Also, their profession is Teacher - absolutely nothing wrong with that but I still think it does not make somebody a pro player.

Professional children - now there's a thought!!

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When I was learning I asking my tutor if that was all he did for a living. "That and gigging most nights of the week" was his answer. "Wow. So you're a professional musician then" I replied (I was easily impressed at the time). He thought about it for a second and said, "Well yes, I suppose I am". He genuinely seemed to have never thought about it before.

I think being a pro is more a state of mind. Just like there are executives who still consider themselves working class, I'm sure there are people who might strictly be semi-pro that consider themselves professional musicians.

Edited by Musky
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OK, to clarify here, I was mainly responding to Discreet's post "Making a living from teaching and/or gigging and/or recording the bass,"

If the person is earning exclusively from teaching then to my mind they will not be a pro player. If they mainly earn from teaching with the odd gig, then still probably not a pro player. Surely a pro player apart from anything else needs to be able to commit to recording sessions, gigs, shows, tours and therefore not be available for regular teaching?

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A musician who makes all their money from composition and none from playing fails the most obvious test for 'pro player' but, it seems to me, easily passes a test for 'pro musician'.

The so-called 'pro player' also passes the 'pro musician' test but may fail the 'pro composer' test.

So, being a 'professional musician' is not restricted to 'players', nor restricted to 'composers'

Or is the OP only asking about 'pro players'? The thread is entitled simply BTW .. What is a Pro..??

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We get a lot of 'pro' players in the shop. Their general definition of themselves is that they make the bulk of their income from playing (or composing) music.

Quite a few teach (in fact our highest profile regular customer teaches but at a very high price and very infrequently).

We do have a lot of teachers and, to the best of my recollection, they all gig and/or record as well.

I'd say that anyone who makes their core income from playing in some form or another is a pro regardless of whether it's huge income or just 'getting by'.

We also know some people who can earn serious money from gigging and are fabulous musicians but have a day job that pays more in total. I don't think any of them regard themselves as 'pro' players.

To a professional standard yes but not a pure pro.

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I posted as a lot of people often say in a post they aren't a pro player as though it implies a certain standard.
I certainly know quite a few people who earn their living from playing music but I also would not say they are
of a certain standard or would use the term 'pro' in regards to them. They just are in the situation.
By the same token I know a fair few 'semi pros who are easily of a very good standard.

This thread seems to suggest that the term pro relates to earning, but that isn't the way
many people here who use the term pro as in not being one, actually mean it, IMO. They seem to mean it implies
a certain standard.
I found myself asking ..too many times... what do THEY mean..?

I think it really should be both...full time player earning their living and certain standard but it so obviously doesn't.. IMO.

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[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1418758569' post='2633060']
Hear the line, 'pro player' used here by many and I wonder what most people think it means..?
[/quote]

If I use the term 'pro' on this forum, I use it to differentiate that this individual earns their living though playing bass. If you have to do other things to supplement this income to make a living, then I don't mean you, to me this is 'semi pro'.

Others may have different views, the above is mine.

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