No lust in Jazz Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 If playing a cover, there will be a part to play and I'll endeavor to play it as accurately as I can. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weststarx Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 [quote name='blue' timestamp='1422332121' post='2671262'] A musician might notice, a non musician in the audience doesn't even know that your playing bass. Blue [/quote] What Blue said... And like others have said if a song has a distinctive bass line (e.g My Generation by The Who) its probably worth learning but if you're playing anything else I dont think anybody notices or even cares. Bass is a support instrument at the end of the day... I think it also depends on the song and how 'famous' that bass line is...We play You Oughta Know by Alanis Morrisette and I have completely dumbed that down to root notes and octaves as the bass line is all over the place, plus with two guitars it sounded plain messy, so we 'made it our own' and its one of my favourite songs we play. A fellow bassist who knows the song will notice I'm playing it differently but I seriously doubt anybody else does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimR Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 [quote name='Pete Academy' timestamp='1422308551' post='2671088'] If you play cover songs with [b]specific[/b] bass lines, do you think the majority of the audience would notice or care if you just root-noted everything? [/quote] Sorry missed the 'specific' part. Yes. However, we're doing Boys are Back in Town - Thin Lizzy. That has a pretty stand out walking bass line during the verse. Although, maybe it was only me that thought that because I scat learned it to get by while we trialled it with the intention of fully learning it if we decided it worked. I mentioned this to the other guys and they hadn't noticed and said to keep it as is. I listened to the live version and the whole lot is missing, just root notes. This is due to Phil having to sing and play at the same time. It's always worth listening to a live version of any complex tune. Sometimes a faster, livlier, live version sounds cluttered with a bass line that's too busy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truckstop Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 That's an interesting point. Sometimes bands play songs that wouldn't necessarily work with their line up originally. Changing the bassline to allow extra instruments (extra guitar, keys etc) makes perfect sense. Truckstop Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weststarx Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 (edited) [quote name='TimR' timestamp='1422359552' post='2671512'] Sorry missed the 'specific' part. Yes. However, we're doing Boys are Back in Town - Thin Lizzy. That has a pretty stand out walking bass line during the verse. Although, maybe it was only me that thought that because I scat learned it to get by while we trialled it with the intention of fully learning it if we decided it worked. I mentioned this to the other guys and they hadn't noticed and said to keep it as is. I listened to the live version and the whole lot is missing, just root notes. This is due to Phil having to sing and play at the same time. It's always worth listening to a live version of any complex tune. Sometimes a faster, livlier, live version sounds cluttered with a bass line that's too busy. [/quote] I must admit I never noticed the walking bass line in it either... But for me thats a song that I feel nonone cares what the bass player is doing as they are all waiting to sing along to that big chorus. Edited January 27, 2015 by Weststarx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimR Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 [quote name='Weststarx' timestamp='1422363308' post='2671595'] I must admit I never noticed the walking bass line in it either... ... [/quote] Best answer so far Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KevB Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 It's not strictly a 'walking' bassline in the sense that a jazzer would think of it but it has bits that are in that style and it's certainly busier than the live version. I'm not sure how accurate the vs I used to play with the house band at jams but I doubt I could sing it as well (gtr used to sing it and I'd do bv on the choruses). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
synthaside Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 (edited) My guitarist has a nickname for me ... the cover police , He's more than happy for me to find the roots carry the groove and show off when i want to ... But he has to regularly tell me ... that i cant ask to drop a song because i cant nail the part to my satisfaction . At the end of the day we obsess over our stuff to the level that most people who aren't analyzing it wouldn't even know, and we are re-interpreting songs with different vocalists ,key's or time signatures ... getting the Feel is sometimes better than getting it perfect. Edited January 27, 2015 by synthaside Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybertect Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 (edited) [quote name='Truckstop' timestamp='1422362821' post='2671577']That's an interesting point. Sometimes bands play songs that wouldn't necessarily work with their line up originally. Changing the bassline to allow extra instruments (extra guitar, keys etc) makes perfect sense.[/quote] Or the other way round. When I'm playing with my rhythm guitar-bass-drums trio, I'll sometimes use the bass to fill in parts originally played by other instruments. Otherwise, playing the original bass line can often provide a 'lift'. [i]Penny Lane[/i] or [i]With a Little Help From My Friends[/i] by the Beatles work a lot better with Macca's bass lines. I've been told it gives everyone else in the band more confidence about the number while they're playing. Then again, it's not entirely unknown for the singer to send me a set of chords by email a couple of hours before a gig and I have to busk my way through it on stage playing roots and whatever else comes into my head in the moment Edited January 27, 2015 by cybertect Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Admiral Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 [quote name='Weststarx' timestamp='1422358520' post='2671498'] What Blue said... And like others have said if a song has a distinctive bass line (e.g My Generation by The Who) its probably worth learning but if you're playing anything else I dont think anybody notices or even cares. Bass is a support instrument at the end of the day... I think it also depends on the song and how 'famous' that bass line is...We play You Oughta Know by Alanis Morrisette and I have completely dumbed that down to root notes and octaves as the bass line is all over the place, plus with two guitars it sounded plain messy, so we 'made it our own' and its one of my favourite songs we play. A fellow bassist who knows the song will notice I'm playing it differently but I seriously doubt anybody else does. [/quote] Your post prompted me to listen this and you are right - all over the show. Nicely done, but I can't see it being missed when done live. Pumping out the big shouty chorus without the widdly fills isn't going to be a problem for most audiences. It was played by Flea from the Chilli Peppers on the record, so it was always going to be a nice line. Dave Navarro on guitar too. There is a YouTube video of the isolated bassline for those interested. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norris Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 I try to get it as accurate as I can. Being in a trio I have to fill out a bit but usually in a way that most punters wouldn't notice. Once you've played a song a few bazillion times it tends to take on a life of its own anyway Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigRedX Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 When I first joined the covers band I learnt all the songs as close to what was on the recording as I could hear. Sometimes though it just didn't work especially if the instrumentation was different to our line-up of two guitars bass and drums. When we came to add some new songs to the set I took a different approach which was to make myself totally familiar with the recording and then work out a simple bass line that followed the basic chord changes. I'd then add to the bass line after hearing what was missing from the arrangement with the simple bass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimR Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 Yes. Sounds like a good approach. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lozz196 Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 [quote name='Dad3353' timestamp='1422311735' post='2671159'] Such as Clash's 'London Calling', for instance, or the Floyd's 'Another Brick In The Wall, Part Two'..? Yes, I think they'd notice. Would they care..? Maybe not, really, but some could be disappointed, although not enough to throw rocks, I'd hope. [/quote] Yep, some songs such as those above, Eton Rifles, Nice & Sleazy, Peaches, well without some attempt the songs wouldn`t sound right. I go and see a punk covers band who do some Jam songs and the bassist, well lets say he`s a bit economical with the basslines yet no-one seems to notice - apart from me I suppose. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 [quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1422314495' post='2671194'] I have a different take on this. The band is playing for the audience, I'm playing for the band. What the audience notices isn't my main concern. My job is to fire up the rhythm section and drive the front line, with the aim that we can impress the audience. I know audiences hear me loud and clear because they tell me but I have to make it work for the band. Root notes or not, the band has to like what I play. A pat on the back from them means good job done. [/quote] If you feel your job is to fire up the rhythm section, your concerned about what the audience notices. Blue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 [quote name='FuNkShUi' timestamp='1422348143' post='2671336'] Totally agree. Where we are concerned about the bass we are playing, the cabs we use, the amp, effects etc, all the audience care about is hearing the song IMO If they can hear the singer, and they can make out the hook, they are happy. Ive played in bands before that were absolutely awful. I can look back and see this now, but we ALWAYS went down well, and were booked up a year in advance because our singer was brilliant. [/quote] I can be playing my but off front stage, grooving all up in the pocket and look out in the crowd and they're all staring at our female lead guitarist soloing. And rightly so, she's good. To the crowd as a bass player I don't exist. It's just the way it is. Blue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubit Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 [quote name='RhysP' timestamp='1422314298' post='2671192'] 99% of audiences wouldn't notice or care if there was a bass player or not. [/quote] This in heaps! I recently quoted in another thread about a gig we did last year in a barn. The electrics were terrible and all during the first set, my valve amp kept cutting out. There would be bass one minute, then half a song with nothing. My performance suffered immensely. As soon as we took a break, I set up a DI so I could bypass my back line, then once satisfied, I went for a drink. Loads of people came and told us, that was great. We even handed out cards and were asked to play at a festival. Just last week, we got a call from the organiser asking us to do his wedding! All from this gig with hardly any bass! So I agree, most audiences, musos excepted, wouldn't notice that you are playing a bass that is different to what the other guys are playing and if they hear guitar and drums, they are happy. It's all a bit annoying when you have dedicated your life to playing bass! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 (edited) True story; I remember trying to teach a old girl friend that would come to my shows with me. [i]"I am the guy playing the bass guitar. It's the instrument with 4 strings. Look, you'll see 4 tuning heads. The guitarist has 6 strings, see, 6 tuning heads"[/i] Several gigs later, [i]"What do you play again?"[/i] I'm just sayin. Edited January 28, 2015 by blue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpaceChick Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 [quote name='Dad3353' timestamp='1422311735' post='2671159'] the Floyd's 'Another Brick In The Wall, Part Two'..? Yes, I think they'd notice. Would they care..? Maybe not, really, but some could be disappointed, although not enough to throw rocks, I'd hope. [/quote] [quote name='tauzero' timestamp='1422313140' post='2671177'] Must try that with "Money". [/quote] Oi, stop pinching my set People only notice the bass when something goes wrong or it stops. FACT! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubit Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 [quote name='SpaceChick' timestamp='1422427352' post='2672425'] Oi, stop pinching my set People only notice the bass when something goes wrong or it stops. FACT! [/quote] But that's what I'm saying, bass was starting and stopping. Some songs had none and NO ONE. Noticed. They were all up dancing and having a ball. All they were interested in was the beat and the melody and obviously, the vocals, which I supply too, so I was powerless to do anything about it as I was trying to keep the show rolling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybertect Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 [quote name='ubit' timestamp='1422431524' post='2672449']But that's what I'm saying, bass was starting and stopping. Some songs had none and NO ONE. Noticed. They were all up dancing and having a ball.[/quote] TBF, given the time signature, dancing to Floyd's [i]Money[/i] could be an interesting exercise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassjon Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 [quote name='SpaceChick' timestamp='1422427352' post='2672425'] People only notice the bass when something goes wrong or it stops. FACT! [/quote] Totally true! I was playing a gig once and my jack lead died. I went from being invisible to have a crowd of pikeys jeering at me in about 0.0004 of a second! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weststarx Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 [quote name='blue' timestamp='1422424639' post='2672417'] True story; I remember trying to teach a old girl friend that would come to my shows with me. [i]"I am the guy playing the bass guitar. It's the instrument with 4 strings. Look, you'll see 4 tuning heads. The guitarist has 6 strings, see, 6 tuning heads"[/i] Several gigs later, [i]"What do you play again?"[/i] I'm just sayin. [/quote] I've been with my girlfriend for 4 years and she still asks me that question... I always tell her to go and stand in the toilet and she will notice the bass in there haha. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weststarx Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 [quote name='The Admiral' timestamp='1422386774' post='2672061'] Your post prompted me to listen this and you are right - all over the show. Nicely done, but I can't see it being missed when done live. Pumping out the big shouty chorus without the widdly fills isn't going to be a problem for most audiences. It was played by Flea from the Chilli Peppers on the record, so it was always going to be a nice line. Dave Navarro on guitar too. There is a YouTube video of the isolated bassline for those interested. [/quote] Yeah it certainly is interesting! I guess if you knew your scales it would be easier to just improvise over it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 [quote name='blue' timestamp='1422421651' post='2672408'] ....If you feel your job is to fire up the rhythm section, your concerned about what the audience notices.... [/quote] I'm concerned with all aspects of the band especially how they relate to audiences and promoters, but I said "main" concern. I've seen bands with great front lines die a death because the rhythm sections weren't good enough. I don't agree with "...the audience can't hear the bass, so it doesn't matter what the bass plays...." type remarks, because the band will always hear the bass and they will play better or worse depending on the job the bass player does. They are the ones I try to support and inspire to greater heights so the audiences love "the band". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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