mantekka Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 I'm trying to amplify my double bass for recording. I'm finally making the move from electric standard to upright. At the moment I'm working with a cheap Thomann kontrabass, and K&K Twin Pickup. After a bit of moving around and testing, the adhesive on the two pads is wearing off so I used some gaffer tape to keep the stuck to the bridge! I tried a few different placements too and found the pictures positioning best so far. I also have worked on the EQ on my amp to get best sound. I'm getting a bit much grating from changing notes and moving fingers. Any advice based on my attempts so far and looking at the picture of my pickup placement? Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRev Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 Are you using a pre-amp between the pickup and the desk/your amp? I'd recommend getting some double sided sticky tape for the pickup discs, they need firm contact with the bridge to get the best sound and the gaffa tape probably isn't providing enough pressure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mantekka Posted March 12, 2015 Author Share Posted March 12, 2015 Direct to amp at the mo. I have a fishman pro EQ, but I haven't been able to configure it to sound better than direct! I would have thought adhesive tape would be worse as it goes between the pickup and the bridge, but I must try some and see if it improves things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRev Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 Preamp use is a matter of taste - if your amp input can handle the impedance difference then it won't make any difference to the sound. An impedance mismatch will make your sound nasal and scratchy. In my experience, the K&K disc-type pickups need good firm contact with the bridge to get the best out of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mantekka Posted March 12, 2015 Author Share Posted March 12, 2015 OK, yes nasal and scratchy is what I'm getting most of the time. But sometimes it clears up and sounds ok! Can't identify what causes it to change. Not too sure on the impedance front, I'll have to look into it. Would some superglue be a bad idea?? Also, does the positioning of the pads really matter? Once they have good even contact with the wood I guess that's the main thing? Thanks for the help Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabbie Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 If you say you are "trying to amplify your double bass for recording" you may have to rethink the issue altogether. Using any amp to record a double bass is not ideal as you won't sound like a double bass at all. Put a half decent mic in front of the bridge, about a foot away and its job done (mic placement is an art which is probably for a different thread). Pickup-wise I am not criticising your setup (I had a BP100 for a long time), but however well you fix that pickup to the bridge, you may get a usable sound, but not the sound of your bass. Please don't use superglue. All the very best to you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mantekka Posted March 13, 2015 Author Share Posted March 13, 2015 Sounds good, I'm hoping the engineer at the recording session will know what to do! I recorded with the pickup last night, and yes I guess I'm trying to get the same sound that I hear when playing acoustically which is just not going to happen! I'll have to use the pick-up for live playing, but must look into using a mic instead. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TPJ Posted March 13, 2015 Share Posted March 13, 2015 If that pickup is a BP100, they are hard to get a good sound out of IME. They usually have clips that help secure the paddles to the bridge. Try a google search for images of BP100 and you'll see. Also, even something like a pedal tuner will help with the impedance matching. What amp are you plugging into? Try to find the specs online for the input impedance. If it's below 1m ohms then you might think about using something to help the impedance matching. When we record, I send a pickup signal, a close mic and a room mic and then the engineer does his magic with a mix of those. The last recording I tried the old "wrap a Shure SM58 with foam and jam it in the bridge feet" trick and it sounded great. These aren't hard and fast rules. Everyone hears differently and everyone's basses are different, but there are a few common denominators that will help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mantekka Posted March 13, 2015 Author Share Posted March 13, 2015 It's not a BP100. Looks very similar, just that it doesn't have the clips, but flat round discs that stick to the bridge. The clips look handy. My amp is Markbass CMD 151P http://www.markbass.it/product_detail.php?id=71 Impedance of 8ohms. Not sure where that leaves me?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beer of the Bass Posted March 13, 2015 Share Posted March 13, 2015 (edited) I've seen a few threads on Talkbass about the BP100 recommending supergluing it to the flat side of the bridge rather than using the clips. Some say the sound is improved this way. You'd want to be fairly sure of the positioning and use a very small drop of thick superglue on each element. I've mounted piezo elements inside other instruments this way, and though it's semi-permanent you can usually prise it off with a single-edged razor blade without damage if you wanted to try something else later. If superglue seems like a little too much commitment, a thin double-sided adhesive tape is the best thing to use, like the stuff that K&K supply with these. But with a Markbass amp you may want to try a preamp too. IIRC they have around 500K ohms input impedance, while ideally you want an input impedance of 1M ohm or higher for most piezos. Too low an input impedance will tend towards sounding harsh and scratchy. Edited March 13, 2015 by Beer of the Bass Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
symcbass Posted March 13, 2015 Share Posted March 13, 2015 Definitely what Roberto said about a mic for recording . I've seen folks using that pickup sandwich the two discs with cork and put them in the E side wing slot of the bridge, sounded much better so they said, worth a try maybe? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted March 14, 2015 Share Posted March 14, 2015 I've given up with the piezos, schaller 411 mag and fishman live, microphone for recording. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artisan Posted March 15, 2015 Share Posted March 15, 2015 (edited) [quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1426349267' post='2717222'] I've given up with the piezos, schaller 411 mag and fishman live, microphone for recording. [/quote] I'll be joining you shortly Pete,I have a Krivo mag & a K&K fingerboard clicky on the way plus a set of low tension Blast Cult Low Life's . I will still leave a piezo on for the quiet gigs but the loud ones will be with the mag. Edited March 15, 2015 by artisan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted March 15, 2015 Share Posted March 15, 2015 The reviews for the Krivo are really good I would still like one at some point, I like the Schaller for now though, ok I'm not going to play Symphony Hall with it but for New York New York or some swinging Blues down the local pub or small scale wedding/party gig it's great, in a full electric band with a drumkit to me it sounds as close as a piezo but without the constant feedback, I guess the Gibson Les Paul, Marshall Stack and 2000 watt PA system was 'less popular' when the Bull fiddle was first invented! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artisan Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 [quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1426454674' post='2718242'] The reviews for the Krivo are really good I would still like one at some point, I like the Schaller for now though, ok I'm not going to play Symphony Hall with it but for New York New York or some swinging Blues down the local pub or small scale wedding/party gig it's great, in a full electric band with a drumkit to me it sounds as close as a piezo but without the constant feedback, I guess the Gibson Les Paul, Marshall Stack and 2000 watt PA system was 'less popular' when the Bull fiddle was first invented! [/quote] lol i'll let you know what it sounds like when i unleash it through my 750w rig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 I'm gonna guess, epic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artisan Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 [quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1426533884' post='2719045'] I'm gonna guess, epic [/quote] hope so I I have a gig this weekend so will try it out & report back Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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