Angling the cab

[ras52]

I've had a TC BC210 (driven by a Classic 450) for a while but, not being in a regular band, have only used it rarely - only for occasional rehearsals and at home. Today I went to an audition/rehearsal and was finding it a bit dull, which I'd suspected was due to the high-end going into the back of my legs. There was another cab in the room, so I perched mine on top: what a difference!

So now I'm shopping for one of those angle-your-cab type thingies.... I know Mark Bass do one, but before I rush out to get one, are there any other solutions worth considering?

Cheers!

[Marvin]

Tight lines

[discreet]

I bought one of [url="http://www.stringsdirect.co.uk/accessories-c2/stands-and-hangers-c70/stagg-stagg-low-professional-amp-monitor-floor-stand-p6954"]these[/url]... compact, adjustable and stable. Works well.

Edited March 21, 2015 by discreet

[JTUK]

Dull.... ?? making a cab less dull by pointing it at your ears on tilt isn't going to remedy a dull sound going out to the audience unless
you run FOH and engr it, so all you've done is improve your 'dull' sound for your purposes. It will still likely be dull outfront,
I'd sort out the dull sound.

[Bill Fitzmaurice]

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1426974363' post='2724408']
Dull.... ?? making a cab less dull by pointing it at your ears on tilt isn't going to remedy a dull sound going out to the audience
[/quote]He did just as he should have, as with the cab on the floor aiming straight out the audience is within the cone shaped midrange and high frequency dispersion pattern, while he is not. Tilting it back both he and the audience will be within said cone.

[Phil Starr]

[quote name='Bill Fitzmaurice' timestamp='1426975282' post='2724416']
He did just as he should have, as with the cab on the floor aiming straight out the audience is within the cone shaped midrange and high frequency dispersion pattern, while he is not. Tilting it back both he and the audience will be within said cone.
[/quote]

Spot on. The problem is that outside the cone he wasn't hearing what the audience heard.

[JTUK]

If he sorts out the sound of the cab so it isn't dull then positioning wont matter too much...

[ras52]

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1427031798' post='2724850']
If he sorts out the sound of the cab so it isn't dull then positioning wont matter too much...
[/quote]

I sorted it out by repositioning it...

[JTUK]

[quote name='ras52' timestamp='1427033088' post='2724871']
I sorted it out by repositioning it...
[/quote]

Understand that, but I have the sound working from anywhere so don't have to worry about Gammas
or positioning etc etc ... and we all know positioning isn't always kind to bass players.
I just saying that a good sound that cuts thru is a Major advantage. IMO

[ras52]

[quote name='discreet' timestamp='1426972990' post='2724391']
I bought one of [url="http://www.stringsdirect.co.uk/accessories-c2/stands-and-hangers-c70/stagg-stagg-low-professional-amp-monitor-floor-stand-p6954"]these[/url]... compact, adjustable and stable. Works well.
[/quote]

What size cab do you use it with? And do you lose any low end by not being in contact with the floor?

I was looking at one of these: http://standback.net/



but I'm a bit sceptical regarding its stability - my cab would need to be over 45 degrees back to shift the centre of gravity to behind the rear edge,

[discreet]

[quote name='ras52' timestamp='1427569249' post='2731874']
What size cab do you use it with? And do you lose any low end by not being in contact with the floor?
[/quote]

A Schroeder 21012L. [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]49lb (22kg), [/font][/color][color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]23.5 X 23.5 X 16" (60 X 60 X 40 cm).[/font][/color]
No low end lost - it's on castors when not on the stand. It supplies shedfuls of low end anyway.



That Folded Standback looks like an accident waiting to happen. I think it's more for g**t*r amps.

Edited March 28, 2015 by discreet

[Luulox]

[quote name='Marvin' timestamp='1426969220' post='2724323']
Tight lines
[/quote]
could well be comedy genius there. Have a like on me 😀

[Bill Fitzmaurice]

[quote name='ras52' timestamp='1427569249' post='2731874']
And do you lose any low end by not being in contact with the floor?[/quote]You would not, as being in contact with the floor has no effect on the low end anyway. You have to lift the cab a matter of a few feet to lose any boundary reinforcement, but that's caused by proximity, not contact.

[Beer of the Bass]

The Standback is excellent with most guitar combos, but not great with most bass gear due to the deeper cabinets. The proportions just aren't right for it. It supports your cab at a set angle, and it will only work if your cab wants to fall backwards at this angle, not if it wants to fall forwards.

[ras52]

Thanks for all the input, I'll give the Stagg a go.

[Marvin]

[quote name='Luulox' timestamp='1427570709' post='2731900']

could well be comedy genius there. Have a like on me 😀
[/quote]

Thank you ☺

[BassBunny]

[quote name='Beer of the Bass' timestamp='1427617930' post='2732258']
The Standback is excellent with most guitar combos, but not great with most bass gear due to the deeper cabinets. The proportions just aren't right for it. It supports your cab at a set angle, and it will only work if your cab wants to fall backwards at this angle, not if it wants to fall forwards.
[/quote]
+1. I bought one and it wouldn't work with any of my cabs. Resorted to a MarkStand.

[MOSCOWBASS]

http://www.ampwedge.com/ I looked at this, but decided to try using some "plastic" packing foam. It worked well with a wedge under the front of my BB2....so well i didn't see the point in buying the Ampwedge......and it's lighter and fits in my gig bag. Getting the front end of the cab wedged up does make a difference with smaller cabs.

[Bass Culture]

For rehearsals I use a Mark Stand either under or behind my Barefaced BB2 (depending on the angle required), but I turn the cab on its side so I can locate the feet of my amp (TC Staccato) against the handle to stop is sliding off the back. Works well.

Edited March 31, 2015 by Bass Culture

[ubit]

Why not raise it instead of tilting it? If it's tilted, the audience are going to be hearing the dull sound you encountered when you were outside its cone of pleasure.

I had this problem until I bought a 6x10 which cured all stage sound problems for me. Our guitarists both raise their cabs too.

[intime-nick]

Picked up an Eden D210MBX from work a couple of weeks ago to try the angled cab solution. Seems to do the job very well but of course, my rack doesn't fit on the top !. I use it mainly for small stages and either have it firing back at me like a stage monitor or behind me depending on where we are playing.

I should add that we play with PA support all the time so this only really functions as a stage monitor.

Edited March 31, 2015 by intime-nick

[Bill Fitzmaurice]

[quote name='ubit' timestamp='1427790603' post='2734159']
Why not raise it instead of tilting it? If it's tilted, the audience are going to be hearing the dull sound you encountered when you were outside its cone of pleasure.
[/quote]Not necessarily, since the midrange and high frequency pattern is cone shaped. The picture below shows +/- 30 degree dispersion, which is about average in the upper mids from a bass cab. In the upper frame the cab flat on the floor puts the audience within the dispersion pattern, but not the player. In the lower frame with the cab tilted both the audience and player are within the dispersion pattern.


The issue with lifting the cab is that if you lift a small cab high enough off the floor to hear the mids at close range you will lose boundary reinforcement in the midbass. That can be beneficial, if the room is boomy, as that will reduce the output in the boom frequencies. But in a dead room you may not want that reduction in the midbass. If you want to be ready for any contingency have the ability to either tilt or lift the cab to suit the room.

[discreet]

[quote name='Bill Fitzmaurice' timestamp='1427804483' post='2734399']
Not necessarily, since the midrange and high frequency pattern is cone shaped. The picture below shows +/- 30 degree dispersion, which is about average in the upper mids from a bass cab. In the upper frame the cab flat on the floor puts the audience within the dispersion pattern, but not the player. In the lower frame with the cab tilted both the audience and player are within the dispersion pattern.
[/quote]

Great post. A picture is worth a thousand words.

[ras52]

[quote name='discreet' timestamp='1427804690' post='2734409']
Great post. A picture is worth a thousand words.
[/quote]

+1. For a moment I considered sketching something on the back of a napkin and taking a phone photo of it....

[discreet]

[quote name='ras52' timestamp='1427805010' post='2734415']
For a moment I considered sketching something on the back of a napkin and taking a phone photo of it...
[/quote]

You still can - especially if it's something crude and inappropriate.