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Which Preamp / Pedal is best for Metal?

CamdenRob

By CamdenRob,
in Guitar Effects

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CamdenRob Mentor

CamdenRob

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Posted

OK yes I actually went there... I've gone and asked "what's best for metal?" on basschat...

Please forgive me but it's a genuine question.

As an aside to my bass playing projects, I've recently decided to set up a hardcore metal band (Haymaker era Throwdown, early Will Haven etc) Always used to love this sort of stuff but I stopped playing it years ago, mainly due to being a bass player and wanting to play styles where I have more freedom and space with my basslines. Which I am continuing to do, this is very much a side project.

However I've never quite managed to shake off wanting to play hardcore... So my solution is to play guitar instead for this project and write all the material myself.

The tracks are tuned to straight B and I'm using a new Schecter 7 string. I'm going to go down the lightweight power amp and 2x112 route as I need a rig I can jump in a taxi with and be a one man lift into venues etc with my guitar on my back.

So... I need to know what sort of preamps / pedals I should be looking at to get that massive Mesa style high gain distortion I'm looking for.

Any advice appreciated as I'm way out of touch with guitar gear and what's available.

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Annoying Twit Proficient

Annoying Twit

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I don't know the answer to your question, so here I am wasting your time (see username for explanation). After reading your post, and having played around with some of the guitar amp models in Logic Pro X this evening, I had a look around.

Here's a guy going on about pedals, he's quite amusing and forthright in his opinions. [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BUABS0LWByM&spfreload=10[/media] He's now talking about the Marshall Jackhammer, which is interesting. I have a Marshall Guvnor Plus and IMHO it does a good job at getting rock sounds. At least 'as far as I know', which isn't very far. He says that the Jackhammer can be bought for £20 on ebay. I paid £17 for mine as a shop 'floor' model.

Here's an ultimate guitar thread where people are discussing your question. [url="http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/archive/index.php?t-1281261.html"]http://www.ultimate-...?t-1281261.html[/url] Some boutique pedals recommended. Homerecording.com similar. http://homerecording.com/bbs/equipment-forums/guitars-and-basses/distortion-overdrive-pedals-mesa-boogie-sound-362926/

I don't know how much it matches the 'Mesa' sound, but after I accidentally bought a Harley Benton Bass Graphic EQ and enjoyed it, I'm thinking about adding another inexpensive pedal to my next Thomann order. Listening to the samples, there's something about the HB Extreme Metal pedal that I like, though for me it's the 'Rock' sound sample that really catches my attention. The pedal, compared to the same music being played through other pedals, has a clearer top end, IMHO. The metal sound sample sounds very much like ... metal to me. More so than some other distortion pedals I listened to. This may not be the sound that you want. [url="http://www.thomann.de/gb/harley_benton_extreme_metal.htm"]http://www.thomann.d...treme_metal.htm[/url] EDIT: I had a bit more of a look around for sound samples. The only other pedal that gave the clear high end response that I heard there was the Boss Metal Zone 2 itself. Is the HB a clone?

On other threads (your post prompted me to look around a bit) people are recommending the AMT pedal, here's a youtube video.

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sOs9Mux5oDA[/media]

Hopefully someone who actually knows what they are talking about will be along to give you some proper information.

Edited by Annoying Twit
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CamdenRob Mentor

CamdenRob

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Posted (edited)

[quote name='Annoying Twit' timestamp='1428535229' post='2742299']
I don't know the answer to your question, so here I am wasting your time (see username for explanation). After reading your post, and having played around with some of the guitar amp models in Logic Pro X this evening, I had a look around.

Here's a guy going on about pedals, he's quite amusing and forthright in his opinions. [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BUABS0LWByM&spfreload=10[/media] He's now talking about the Marshall Jackhammer, which is interesting. I have a Marshall Guvnor Plus and IMHO it does a good job at getting rock sounds. At least 'as far as I know', which isn't very far. He says that the Jackhammer can be bought for £20 on ebay. I paid £17 for mine as a shop 'floor' model.

Here's an ultimate guitar thread where people are discussing your question. [url="http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/archive/index.php?t-1281261.html"]http://www.ultimate-...?t-1281261.html[/url] Some boutique pedals recommended. Homerecording.com similar. [url="http://homerecording.com/bbs/equipment-forums/guitars-and-basses/distortion-overdrive-pedals-mesa-boogie-sound-362926/"]http://homerecording...e-sound-362926/[/url]

I don't know how much it matches the 'Mesa' sound, but after I accidentally bought a Harley Benton Bass Graphic EQ and enjoyed it, I'm thinking about adding another inexpensive pedal to my next Thomann order. Listening to the samples, there's something about the HB Extreme Metal pedal that I like, though for me it's the 'Rock' sound sample that really catches my attention. The pedal, compared to the same music being played through other pedals, has a clearer top end, IMHO. The metal sound sample sounds very much like ... metal to me. More so than some other distortion pedals I listened to. This may not be the sound that you want. [url="http://www.thomann.de/gb/harley_benton_extreme_metal.htm"]http://www.thomann.d...treme_metal.htm[/url] EDIT: I had a bit more of a look around for sound samples. The only other pedal that gave the clear high end response that I heard there was the Boss Metal Zone 2 itself. Is the HB a clone?

On other threads (your post prompted me to look around a bit) people are recommending the AMT pedal, here's a youtube video.

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sOs9Mux5oDA[/media]

Hopefully someone who actually knows what they are talking about will be along to give you some proper information.
[/quote]

Thats brilliant, thanks for putting all that together it's much appreciated :) I've read through the reviews and I'll check out the vid tonight (no soundcard in the works PC unfortunately). Another one I've been looking at is the Empress Heavy.

To be honest I'm torn between these kind of reviews and the "Valve is best and everything else is rubbish" stance... I was wanting to go down the lightweight power amp and preamp route for portability and ideally I'd still like to do that but now I'm looking at the mini rectifier and wondering if it's the answer to what I'm looking for... Mesa tone, 25 watts, tiny footprint and 5kg. The sort of venues where this sort of music is played always have full PA support, so masses of headroom isn't really a requirement, so long as its loud enough for rehearsal.

It's a strange feeling scouring the web for reviews etc... I'm so confident on what I want from bass gear having played for years and tried just about everything out there, but I'm a real newbie for guitar gear, having only played guitar as an accompaniment to my bass pieces in the past.. I know what I want to achieve but I've no idea what kind of setup will get me there!

Edited by CamdenRob
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ezbass Grand Master

ezbass

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Posted

A Suhr Riot, wide open is pretty nifty as it it doesn't go to mush and keeps it nice and tight IMO. However, it ain't cheap and so the Joyo Us Dream steps into the clone breach, a snip at £39 from Coda Music.

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Annoying Twit Proficient

Annoying Twit

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I've been using your thread as a prod to look at various ways of achieving

This is a demo of the Mesa Mini Rectifier. IMHO this is an awful review, and I decided early on I wasn't going to waste 18 minutes of my life on it and FFWD'd through it a lot. The digital 'Rectifier' models I have use huge amounts of gain, so much so that I can't use it all as I don't practice in a quiet (electrically) enough environment and there is silly amounts of noise when gain is high. I was surprised how non-metal the demo sounds of the Mini Rectifier are:

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MKJnzV8JdFU&spfreload=10[/media]

I had a look at the Suhr Riot. Listening to this demo, it seems that the Suhr does the distortion pedal thing fine, and I like the sound. Though, is this a distinctive sound? It sounds a bit like a fairly generic distortion pedal. Nothing wrong with the sound, and it does cover quite a few bases, but I'm not hearing anything unique here. Am I missing something?

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ueg5KRW80Ng&spfreload=10[/media]

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CamdenRob Mentor

CamdenRob

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[quote name='Annoying Twit' timestamp='1428624098' post='2743284']
I've been using your thread as a prod to look at various ways of achieving

This is a demo of the Mesa Mini Rectifier. IMHO this is an awful review, and I decided early on I wasn't going to waste 18 minutes of my life on it and FFWD'd through it a lot. The digital 'Rectifier' models I have use huge amounts of gain, so much so that I can't use it all as I don't practice in a quiet (electrically) enough environment and there is silly amounts of noise when gain is high. I was surprised how non-metal the demo sounds of the Mini Rectifier are:

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MKJnzV8JdFU&spfreload=10[/media]

I had a look at the Suhr Riot. Listening to this demo, it seems that the Suhr does the distortion pedal thing fine, and I like the sound. Though, is this a distinctive sound? It sounds a bit like a fairly generic distortion pedal. Nothing wrong with the sound, and it does cover quite a few bases, but I'm not hearing anything unique here. Am I missing something?

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ueg5KRW80Ng&spfreload=10[/media]
[/quote]

Yeah I saw that review of the mini rec... it's rubbish, really hard to tell anything from video reviews anyway as there are so many variables between the actual sound coming out of the amp and the end device / headphones you're listening to it on. I have this issue with the stuff I record for the BC compo comp. My bass through my rig sounds exactly how I want it yet recorded and played back from soundcloud it sounds dull and lifeless, no doubt due to my limited recording knowledge.

I did see a youtube review of a guy A/Bing the mini rec and a Orange dark terror, that wasn't to bad, clearly showed the vast difference between the two.

I made my decision after getting down to demark street and having a go through some options, whilst some of the various pedals sounded good, for me the tone of an actual rectifier still had the slight edge for me. But bare in mind I am going for a very specific sound... and to my ears it's a sound mesa do best :)

Edited by CamdenRob
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Annoying Twit Proficient

Annoying Twit

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There is a Harley Benton micro-pedal specifically intended to do 'Boogle' sounds.

http://www.thomann.de/gb/harley_benton_micro_stomp_boogie_master.htm

However, I must admit that I don't like the sample sounds. As you say there are many variables in sample sounds for distortion pedals, but I have nothing else to go on concerning that pedal.

I did personally very much like the sound of the full Mesa amp/cab in the Suhr riot pedal review when it was being driven by the pedal, even when the pedal was off.

Edited by Annoying Twit
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  • 2 weeks later...
roman_sub Enthusiast

roman_sub

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i'm a big fan of hughes & kettner stuff for guitar... if you want "mesa" tones in a box, I personally recommend the original tubeman pedal. they crop up second hand at around 80 quid and sound killer (i guess reissues are OK but ideally mk1 is the one to go for). with this you can plug into an amp head or even straight into a mixing desk (i just finished tracking a demo and the tube man actually stands up as a second rhythm track to an expensive half-stack thru a sm57 ;-)). otherwise, if you do want a portable head solution, try tubemeister18 - plenty loud for gigs. PM me if you want more info. cheers, Roman

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CamdenRob Mentor

CamdenRob

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[quote name='roman_sub' timestamp='1429463490' post='2751604']
i'm a big fan of hughes & kettner stuff for guitar... if you want "mesa" tones in a box, I personally recommend the original tubeman pedal. they crop up second hand at around 80 quid and sound killer (i guess reissues are OK but ideally mk1 is the one to go for). with this you can plug into an amp head or even straight into a mixing desk (i just finished tracking a demo and the tube man actually stands up as a second rhythm track to an expensive half-stack thru a sm57 ;-)). otherwise, if you do want a portable head solution, try tubemeister18 - plenty loud for gigs. PM me if you want more info. cheers, Roman
[/quote]

I looked at the H&K stuff. A guitarist in a recent rock band I played with had one of the new ones (not sure which model - clear perspex all valve head with switchable wattage) and it sounded great.

I went for a Mesa Mini Rectifier stack in the end and I'm very pleased with it... so much so that I've bought a Sansamp US Steel, which is an emulator of the rectifier to take to rehearsals when I can't be bothered to lug my amp there...

The Mesa rectifier stuff is a bit of a one trick pony but I bought it specifically for that trick and for my money none do it better.... very pleased :)

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