NorthSands Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 Finally picked up an RD after many years of waiting for the right one - bit of a project bass, but it was priced accordingly so that's fine by me. Anyway, I was aware it had the Moog circuitry removed at some point, but strangely enough it still seems to be active, ie it won't work without a 9V battery connected. Here's a pic of the wiring, can anyone make any sense of it? Not had a chance to check the pickups, but assuming they are the original Gibson ones. [attachment=205201:IMG_5862.JPG] It sounds great, but will be returned to stock configuration at some point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neepheid Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 Bit of a small pic but it looks like it's been done VVTT to me and the switch furthest from the pots is pickup selector (wired after the volume pot). Future irritation for you (apart from sourcing an RD Moog board of course) - the pickups connect to the original board with connectors which have been cut off yours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthSands Posted November 17, 2015 Author Share Posted November 17, 2015 (edited) [quote name='neepheid' timestamp='1447753722' post='2909949'] Bit of a small pic but it looks like it's been done VVTT to me and the switch furthest from the pots is pickup selector (wired after the volume pot). Future irritation for you (apart from sourcing an RD Moog board of course) - the pickups connect to the original board with connectors which have been cut off yours. [/quote] Shrunk the image as an attachment for some readon - try this: 'Scuse the electrical ignorance, but what do you mean by VVTT? There's a board on ebay US at the mo, would that be all I need? I'm assuming I can work around the lack of connector by joining the relevant wires, or is it more of a complex situation? Cheers! Here's the link: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Gibson-RD-Artist-1978-1979-1989-Moog-Electronic-Control-Pots-Harness-Wiring-/321914666413?hash=item4af39bfdad:g:nZwAAOSwo6lWPlm4 Edited November 17, 2015 by NorthSands Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulnb57 Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 (edited) VVTT is Volume, Volume, Tone, Tone... So, volume and tone for each pickup and a selector switch... Edited November 17, 2015 by paulnb57 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthSands Posted November 17, 2015 Author Share Posted November 17, 2015 [quote name='paulnb57' timestamp='1447755030' post='2909968'] VVTT is Volume, Volume, Tone, Tone... So, volume and tone for each pickup and a selector switch... [/quote] Of course, thanks!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neepheid Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 [quote name='NorthSands' timestamp='1447754779' post='2909965'] Shrunk the image as an attachment for some readon - try this: 'Scuse the electrical ignorance, but what do you mean by VVTT? There's a board on ebay US at the mo, would that be all I need? I'm assuming I can work around the lack of connector by joining the relevant wires, or is it more of a complex situation? Cheers! Here's the link: [url="http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Gibson-RD-Artist-1978-1979-1989-Moog-Electronic-Control-Pots-Harness-Wiring-/321914666413?hash=item4af39bfdad:g:nZwAAOSwo6lWPlm4"]http://www.ebay.co.u...ZwAAOSwo6lWPlm4[/url] [/quote] Sorry, VVTT == Volume Volume Tone Tone. The board looks good, and pretty much complete. If you haven't already seen it then there's a mine of information at Fly Guitars - http://www.flyguitars.com/gibson/bass/RDartist_techinfo.php - stuff about the board, schematics, the pickup connectors I was talking about, all good stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neepheid Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 Ahh, careful though! That board is for guitar, not bass. According to Fly Guitars that causes a headache with the pot shafts (the ones which are soldered to the board), the guitar ones are a 1/4" shorter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthSands Posted November 17, 2015 Author Share Posted November 17, 2015 [quote name='neepheid' timestamp='1447756070' post='2909982'] Ahh, careful though! That board is for guitar, not bass. According to Fly Guitars that causes a headache with the pot shafts (the ones which are soldered to the board), the guitar ones are a 1/4" shorter. [/quote] Well spotted!! Thanks for that - wil give this one a miss. That Fly Guitars site has been well visited over the past few years, ha - great resource. Any thoughts on my existing wiring though, this looks like it may have something to do with the active circuit: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthSands Posted November 17, 2015 Author Share Posted November 17, 2015 There's a closer up view of it - I'm not familiar with active electronics at all so any thoughts welcome: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neepheid Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 A small booster preamp of some sort? Would explain why the bass only works with a battery in. Only 4 wires going into a sealed unit - +ve (red), -ve (black), signal in (yellow), boosted signal out (white)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthSands Posted November 17, 2015 Author Share Posted November 17, 2015 [quote name='neepheid' timestamp='1447759846' post='2910024'] A small booster preamp of some sort? Would explain why the bass only works with a battery in. Only 4 wires going into a sealed unit - +ve (red), -ve (black), signal in (yellow), boosted signal out (white)? [/quote] Yeah, I think that may be the answer - done a bit of reading up and apparently without the Moog board the output of the pickups alone is pretty weak, so the preamp booster was a common(ish) mod. Here's the rest of it - I didn't really want a maple one, but sometimes you have to go with what fate decides. It's definitely growing on me! Plays and sounds great, maybe due a setup to lower the action a little but otherwise I love it: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neepheid Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 Very nice, almost the same as mine, but mine is the post late '79 model with the two mini toggle switches for the Moog stuff instead of the single three way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billy Apple Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 Was there something up with the Moog stuff that made people take them out? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brensabre79 Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 (edited) [quote name='Billy Apple' timestamp='1447864066' post='2911063'] Was there something up with the Moog stuff that made people take them out? [/quote] They were pretty complex and experimental electronics. Originally I think they had a built in Compressor for the neck pickup, Expander for the bridge pickup (both just turned on/off by the same switch), plus a treble boost switch. the controls were VV plus treble and bass (the opposite way around to a MusicMan). All powered by one 9v battery - which didn't last long. To the OP, as above, looks like you have a very simple pre-amp circuit in there, which is because the original pickups were very low output (so as not to overdrive the Moog circuit). Good luck finding a board to go in there though, I don't think there is any difference between the two versions (3 way switch / 2x toggle switch) it's just the wiring that goes in to them. Also, as mentioned above, when you get a circuit board, don't solder the pickups straight on to it because you'll more than likely overheat the ICs on the board. Lovely Bass btw Edited November 18, 2015 by brensabre79 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billy Apple Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 Maybe look at another active circuit that is better, simpler and more readily available? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neepheid Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 [quote name='Billy Apple' timestamp='1447864066' post='2911063'] Was there something up with the Moog stuff that made people take them out? [/quote] I really don't understand why people felt the need to rip it out - you don't [i]have[/i] to use the Moog stuff (expansion/compression/bright) and on its own it's a perfectly workable, 2 band EQ active bass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthSands Posted November 18, 2015 Author Share Posted November 18, 2015 [quote name='brensabre79' timestamp='1447867079' post='2911106'] They were pretty complex and experimental electronics. Originally I think they had a built in Compressor for the neck pickup, Expander for the bridge pickup (both just turned on/off by the same switch), plus a treble boost switch. the controls were VV plus treble and bass (the opposite way around to a MusicMan). All powered by one 9v battery - which didn't last long. To the OP, as above, looks like you have a very simple pre-amp circuit in there, which is because the original pickups were very low output (so as not to overdrive the Moog circuit). Good luck finding a board to go in there though, I don't think there is any difference between the two versions (3 way switch / 2x toggle switch) it's just the wiring that goes in to them. Also, as mentioned above, when you get a circuit board, don't solder the pickups straight on to it because you'll more than likely overheat the ICs on the board. Lovely Bass btw [/quote] Cheers for that, most useful! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthSands Posted November 19, 2015 Author Share Posted November 19, 2015 (edited) [quote name='neepheid' timestamp='1447878893' post='2911235'] I really don't understand why people felt the need to rip it out - you don't [i]have[/i] to use the Moog stuff (expansion/compression/bright) and on its own it's a perfectly workable, 2 band EQ active bass. [/quote] I'd love someone to do a side by side comparison of an RD with and an RD without the Moog board to see how different they sound! Edited November 19, 2015 by NorthSands Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brensabre79 Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 [quote name='NorthSands' timestamp='1447891949' post='2911356'] I'd love someone to do a side by side comparison of an RD with and an RD without the Moog board to see how different they sound! [/quote] Well you'll be in a perfect position to do this if you can find a new board for yours... let us hear before and after. Or should that be after and before..? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthSands Posted November 20, 2015 Author Share Posted November 20, 2015 [quote name='brensabre79' timestamp='1447954020' post='2911823'] Well you'll be in a perfect position to do this if you can find a new board for yours... let us hear before and after. Or should that be after and before..? [/quote] Ha, good point! Will do... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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