Fender decal damage - replace of leave it alone?

[Grangur]

Hi all,

This question is following on from another, where a new guy has asked if a "Fender" is genuine or not.

I have a nice MIM p bass. It plays well and it's probably a keeper. The only real "problem" is when I got it the headstock looked like this:



I'm a bit of a perfectionist and this will not do. So to make it "right" I've done what might be the unthinkable and scraped off the decal and made another:

So, as you can see, the serial number is the same. If I work on it well and make sure to smooth the edges, I'm hoping I'll get away with it.

Have I done the right thing?

Edited November 22, 2016 by Grangur

[scrumpymike]

I would say so as you're not trying to pass it off as something it's not. I'd maybe use better-matching fonts if poss.

[Grangur]

The fonts are those used in the decal as I bought it. The only one I've done is the serial number. I guess the original one is slightly serifed. Mine is probably too clean.

Maybe "Serial Number" is too big too

Edited November 14, 2016 by Grangur

[KiOgon]

I have a Mexican Jazz with even less of the original remaining, which I'll be selling soon. I was thinking of leaving as is - maybe I'll wait and see what the outcome of this is

Yes agree the 'serial number' is a bit big + the font could be better, but no harm in replacing it IMO.

Edited November 14, 2016 by KiOgon

[Twincam]

I kinda think it looks cool the way it is.

[Grangur]

What surprised me in a way was that the waterslide they use covers the whole of the headstock. But from a production POV it makes sense I guess.

[NancyJohnson]

I can't actually understand why Fender don't/didn't clearcoat over the headstock after the transfer has been applied.

[Grangur]

[quote name='NancyJohnson' timestamp='1479194874' post='3174574']
I can't actually understand why Fender don't/didn't clearcoat over the headstock after the transfer has been applied.
[/quote]
Yes. This is what makes me laugh when folk talk about Fender as being a "quality manufacturer". They aren't. What they did do, in the beginning, was bring instruments into a mass-production environment and make cheap instruments available to the masses. They are still successful in that. This is just the same; it's done on the cheap. If Fender wasn't all about "cheap" then the quality would be high enough that folk wouldn't want to upgrade them.
Thankfully the construction method makes them easily upgraded.

[karlfer]

I've got one in a similar state and I'm now inspired, thank you Grangur.

How, what did you use to scrape the damaged one off with?

Where did you get the replacement decal, particularly with serial number?

Cheers in advance,
Karl.

[Grangur]

[quote name='karlfer' timestamp='1479196503' post='3174582']
I've got one in a similar state and I'm now inspired, thank you Grangur.

How, what did you use to scrape the damaged one off with?

Where did you get the replacement decal, particularly with serial number?

Cheers in advance,
Karl.
[/quote]
I scraped the old one off with a Stanley knife blade. Take it out of the holder and holding the blade almost upright and flat on the wood, scrape the blade down the grain and it'll cleanly take off the waterslide and any lacquer.

I bought a decal in a set of 4 from a guy in Spain. I then scanned the image and edited it to make the serial number the correct one for my own bass. The originals were all for a bass from 2009-10. This one is from 2003-4. So I wanted to keep it true to the bass.

What I have found is the original was definitely silver. The decals you buy, and my own, look silver/grey on the print. When you actually apply the decal it looks grey/gold. This is because the colour of the wood is coming through. What I'm planning to do on mine is using a silver pen to colour in the silver part and make it look more like the original.

If anyone wants one like mine, PM me and I'll can make these for anyone. I also have a fair stock of watersilde paper, so I'll do them at a price to cover costs.

[Grangur]

If anyone is wondering about my scathing comments about Fender and their cheap production, watch this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mVmFlzksMCE

I notice he doesn't talk about bubinga, swamp ash, wenge.. so this is aimed at the mass production market.
Don't get it wrong, it has it's place.

[karlfer]

[quote name='Grangur' timestamp='1479197214' post='3174587']
I scraped the old one off with a Stanley knife blade. Take it out of the holder and holding the blade almost upright and flat on the wood, scrape the blade down the grain and it'll cleanly take off the waterslide and any lacquer.

I bought a decal in a set of 4 from a guy in Spain. I then scanned the image and edited it to make the serial number the correct one for my own bass. The originals were all for a bass from 2009-10. This one is from 2003-4. So I wanted to keep it true to the bass.

What I have found is the original was definitely silver. The decals you buy, and my own, look silver/grey on the print. When you actually apply the decal it looks grey/gold. This is because the colour of the wood is coming through. What I'm planning to do on mine is using a silver pen to colour in the silver part and make it look more like the original.

If anyone wants one like mine, PM me and I'll can make these for anyone. I also have a fair stock of watersilde paper, so I'll do them at a price to cover costs.
[/quote]

Many thanks for that Richard, much appreciated. A job for the weekend whilst the wife is with [s]the Coven[/s] her mother and sister.
Then a little PM methinks.
I won't hold you accountable for the severed fingers.
Kind regards,
Frank Spencer

[gary mac]

Looking good Rich. I suppose for the serial number, I would have gone for the same typeface as the original.

[BigRedX]

That decal doesn't look anything like the one it is replacing

Just from a quick glance the "Serial Number" text is too big and doesn't have enough leading.

The ® for both Fender and Precision Bass are the wrong typeface and wrongly positioned.

The Precision Bass text doesn't look like the right typeface either.

[Grangur]

Yes, BRX, many thanks for the helpful observations. What you're seeing, apart from the serial number is the decal I bought. It's useful for the "Fender" artwork. I'm now working on it. Regrettably, I'm no graphics artist though, so I don't have a massive number of fonts to choose from. With any luck I will, hopefully come up with something that looks more like the real thing.

The grey/silver in the "Fender" is too dark as well. Maybe I'll have something better to show you later.

[gary mac]

[quote name='Grangur' timestamp='1479220391' post='3174835']
Yes, BRX, many thanks for the helpful observations.
[/quote]

No sitting on the fence with his opinion, was there mate?

[Grangur]

[quote name='gary mac' timestamp='1479222440' post='3174851']
No sitting on the fence with his opinion, was there mate?
[/quote]

No, you're not wrong there. I can see this becoming a case of "if I'd known then what I know now... I'd never have kicked this hornets' nest".

All that aside. I actually value BRX's honesty and keen observation. What is frustrating is the pathetic font options I have to chose from to do the artwork.

[BigRedX]

You could try drawing up the letter forms. In fact if fender are using a bespoke custom font, that's what you might have to do.

[Grangur]

Not perfect, but getting closer



TBH when you look closer, the edges of the black round the "Fender" aren't exactly great. I'm getting it better, but it'll take time.

Here's a good one, I guess

Edited November 22, 2016 by Grangur

[BigRedX]

Is that second photo a genuine Fender decal?

If so the typeface for most of it looks like variations of Helvetica. The actual serial number is two different typefaces: a serif face for the MZ6 and a sans serif for the rest of the numbers.

And apologies for the bluntness of my initial post in this thread. I was under the impression that the decal you were showing was one that you had bought from somewhere I was somewhat shocked that such a poor imitation was being passed off as an acceptable substitute.

BTW what program are you using to create you artwork?

Edited November 15, 2016 by BigRedX

[Grangur]

[quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1479236019' post='3174976']
Is that second photo a genuine Fender decal?
[i][b]It's a picture I found on the web of a Fender Headstock - Can't put hand on heart and say it's genuine. I've no idea[/b][/i]

If so the typeface for most of it looks like variations of Helvetica. The actual serial number is two different typefaces: a serif face for the MZ6 and a sans serif for the rest of the numbers.
[i][b]Yes, I noticed the variations in that, but if you look at the picture below of mine, this too has variations in the serial number font. (Fender can't even get that straight-forward.[/b][/i]

And apologies for the bluntness of my initial post in this thread. I was under the impression that the decal you were showing was one that you had bought from somewhere I was somewhat shocked that such a poor imitation was being passed off as an acceptable substitute.
[i][b]Can't say I'm thrilled at having paid out for it. I don't mind your bluntness. I think we know each other well enough to know that good intentions were meant.[/b][/i]


BTW what program are you using to create you artwork?
[i][b]Gimp - it's a Freeware program. It's quite effective though.[/b][/i]
[/quote]



Thanks BRX for your thoughts. TBH I'm making enquiries with another supplier. There comes a time when my time is worth more than the cost of a crummy decal.

BTW, BRX, you have a good eye for fonts. I'm impressed and appreciate the input.

Edited November 15, 2016 by Grangur

[BigRedX]

[quote name='Grangur' timestamp='1479238374' post='3174998']
BTW, BRX, you have a good eye for fonts. I'm impressed and appreciate the input.
[/quote]

Thanks! Although as I'm a typographer (amongst other things) in my day job, I really ought to know my typefaces!

I see what you mean about the serial numbers, but even on your example the MZ3 are a slightly different serif typeface to the rest of the serial number. I suspect it's down to the way that the original decals are produced, and I wouldn't be surprised if the second part of the serial number is laser printed

Gimp is a great program, although I would suggest that if you are still up for doing this yourself, then it might be worth downloading a trial copy of Adobe Illustrator CC and getting to grips with bezier curves.

[Grangur]

As the MZ3 denotes the year, having that on the waterside and the rest laser printed wouldn't be a surprise.

[Norris]

Inkscape is good for vector drawings (Bezier curves, etc) and is free

[Ghost_Bass]

I use pixlr.com for artworks. It's like an online photoshop, free. The only problem is that it doesn't allow you to save a work in progress, only as a picture. There's a way to go around this, just save each layer individualy and then open them by order in another program.

There's also a lot of free fonts around the web, with a bit of googling and time to spend you should get close to the real deal.

In honesty i don't think that Fender decals are that faithfull from bass to bass, in the same production run. They seem to get them outsourced and the final product will depend of the company contracted. Example:

[quote name='Grangur' timestamp='1479231693' post='3174946']

[/quote][quote name='Grangur' timestamp='1479238374' post='3174998']


[/quote]

If we look at the word "BASS" between both decals we can see that the MZ6 has less spacing between letters and appears to be bolder. If Fender had a template for the decals and used the same suplier they should all look the same. This is all to say that if the finished logo looks a bit off the initial it won't be a problem, the most important thing is there and that's the correct serial and model.