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Downsizing options


Al Heeley
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I'm looking to downsize my rig to a more portable option and am interested in comments and recommendations;
Currently gigging a Peavey 450 tour head, 4 x 10 Hartke XL cab + 2 x 10 Hartke VX cab,
Music is a mix of punk, indie, new wave, ska, I like a lot of punch from my jazz bass and sit pretty high in the mix with 1 guitarist, singer, drummer, playing medium sized pubs and clubs.
It took me a while to get a sound I liked from the Peavey/hartke but what helped a lot was a little spectra comp bass pedal that remains on all the time. I found the lower bass often a bit flabby and boomey no matter how I tweaked the EQ on the amp.
Volume wise the peavey has been nearly full tilt at times, with the red limiter light flashing every now and then at bigger or outdoor venues - don't have PA fit for DI so it all comes out the Hartke cabs.
The 4x10 is a heavy beast and its doing my back in. So I want a smaller lighter setup being quite impressed with 2 pals recent purchases of markbass and TC electronics mini setups, both went for two 2x10 cabs and a mini head. Would 500W be enough for larger clubs?
Any opinions re the mini heads from TC and Markbass? Any other options to consider around the £500 range?
I'm assuming I need to be paying around £450 each for lightweight 2x10 cabs?

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tc and markbass amps are very different beasts but both good, i personally dont get on with markbass stuff but ran a tc rh750 for a couple of years with a barefaced cab (which i cant recommend enough) and it is a great piece of kit, super versatile, built to to a high quality and loads of headroom.
i would advise try before you buy if possible.

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I've bought and sold a lot of amps, combos and cabs over the last 5/6 years. Ashdown, Fender, TC electronic, Hartke. I now have my favourite combination for max power and min weight. Which is a GK MB500 and a Barefaced compact. The MB is very, very loud and punchy and the Barefaced can take every bit of power it gives out.
All the other amp cab combinations ended up maxed out to keep up with a loud drummer. I don't know what the max is with this combination, because I've never been there.

The MB 500 fits snugly in my gig bag pocket and the Barefaced cab is a one finger lift. Both were bought on Basschat secondhand and cost me about £700 in total.

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I've ended up with a Markbass LM3 and a Shroeder 212pl. Cab is rated at 800 watts and 4ohms so will take anything the MB throws at it and is very light. MB goes in a laptop case with my Spectracomp, tuner and radio receiver. Did an outside (open ended marquee) gig with no PA support and my gf said I was way louder than the other bassists that played earlier. Strangely I've just added a Hartke vxl pedal to get my tone!! Another big up for Barefaced though, I had a Compact and it was a one finger lift and punchy as hell, skintness forced me to sell!

Edited by barneyg42
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[quote name='Al Heeley' timestamp='1481644370' post='3193970'] Would 500W be enough for larger clubs?
Any opinions re the mini heads from TC and Markbass? Any other options to consider around the £500 range?
I'm assuming I need to be paying around £450 each for lightweight 2x10 cabs?
[/quote]

I play similar music to you, and I also use a Jazz bass. Having tried a lot of gear in the last five years or so, I have ended up with (and am very happy with!) a Markbass LM2 and a second generation Barefaced Compact. Even though the Compact is rated at 8 ohms and the amp will "only" be putting about 350W max through it, I have never been even remotely pushed for volume. I won't mention the "heft" word (oops, looks like I just did!) but I feel that my set-up has this too. I paid around £600 for the amp and cab (both from the Basschat Marketplace).

Depending on where you are in the "North" you are welcome to pop over (I'm in Newcastle) and give my rig a try! B)

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If I had to start again, I honestly don't know what I'd do as the market has a bewildering amount of options.

I know others may disagree, but personally if I was playing fairly aggressive / fast music (especially like I was back when I played more punk a few years back) I'd want a cabinet that does have an adjustable tweeter of some sort. Purely because I personally like the ability to dial in clean grind and treble sheen....and I turn it right down or off for more fuzzy/driven tones.

You could 'probably' replace that cabinet setup with a high end lightweight 2x12 and be done. Then power it with a decent amp. There are cabs from Barefaced, Bergantino and Genzler.

E.g.

http://www.genzleramplification.com/product/MG-212T/MAGELLAN-212T.html?cid=17

The new Peavey Lightweight bass amps are meant to be great.

Lot's of options for lightweight amps, like Aguilar, TC, Markbass, Darkglass, Genzler (and second hand Genz Benz amps)....the list goes on.

I would probably not recommend the LM3...because for the money they charge for a fairly 'old' design, you may as well opt for a new design with greater headroom (you might need it if you play fairly loud and get a very high end cabinet).


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If you are regularly at or close to maximum output with 450w into a 610 speaker configuration you might want to be looking at 800w heads if you are considering class d. My personal experience is that class ab heads have less brutal (for want of a better word) limiting when you get close to maximum output. Peavey, Ampeg and GK make fantastic (by all accounts ) 800w+ class d heads which should suit your music choices. Although not light (at 54lbs each approx half the weight individually of your 410XL ), I can recommend two Bergantino hd210 cabs as small format extremely capable punchy rock set up. Oh, and they have heft💪.

Edited by Sparky Mark
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[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1481668918' post='3194255']
You could PM Lozz196 and talk to him.

He's playing Punk through a Barefaced Big Twin and (what's it now?) an Aguilar TH500?
[/quote]

Yep Barefaced Big Twin II and either an Aguilar Tonehammer 500 or AG500, Chris.

The difference in using the BT2 compared to other cabs is pretty amazing. A couple of weeks back I used an Ashdown 410 cab, loved the sound, but my volume was about 12 o`clock, and the clipping light was coming on throughout most of the set. Similarly I used a Hartke VX115 a few weeks back and again my volume was 12 o`clock, if not more. With the BT2 I have the volume on about 9 or 10 o`clock and the clipping light never shows. I play some pretty large stages - all with FOH/monitors, but I prefer to not have my bass in the monitors, and my set-up is plenty for what I do.

So I`d look at higher efficiency cabs here, that Peavey 450 should be plenty enough with an efficient cab (cabs). There was a Barefaced BT2 on here for about £900ish, great deal that, and at 50lbs it`s an easy cab to shift. I have a bad shoulder/upper back and the design of this 2x12 makes it so easy to move around.

If the Peavey 450 is too heavy, well many different amps to go for, an idea of whether you like clean or gainy sounds will help us to advise.

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Everyone wants to go class D these days, and I get it to a certain level. In my opinion, unless you are running an ampeg svt all valve head, you should be able to manage your amp weight wise (think gallien Krueger rb, hartke kilo or heaven forbid a trace Elliott. Yes it is cool to carry your amp into a gig in a handbag, BUT in my experience, there is a certain extra something in a transformer power section as opposed to switch mode electronics. Again, just my experience.
CABS is where you can really save your back, look for new cabs in either 4x10 or 2x12. My old rig was an rb1001, with a neo 212 and 115. Punch and headroom for days and more than happily kept up with a bloody loud drummer and 2 guitars

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Agreed, my AG500 in a shallow-rack case is easiliy doable, as are the GK RB amps. I also agree that they do have a bit more substance to the sound. My TH500 is a great amp, and probably one of the meatiest sounding class D amps I`ve had - and there have been many - but against the AG500 there is a difference.

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I'd go for a 4 ohm 2x12 cab for starters. I reckon the one I have now is louder than a 1x15 & 4x10 setup I've had in the past. Take your pick of class D heads since anything from 350 watts up will have plenty of power. My 500w Tecamp head is very loud at around 30% of available power. I also find the 2x12 much louder than the Barefaced Compact I had for a while.

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[quote name='Japhet' timestamp='1481799136' post='3195193'] I also find the 2x12 much louder than the Barefaced Compact I had for a while.
[/quote]

Interesting. I tried a few different 2x10s and 2x12s, and when I came back to the Compact I found it louder (and, for me, [b][i]better[/i][/b]) than any of them!

Horses for courses I guess :)

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