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Rickenbacker pickups question


stega
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Hi,[/size]
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I've been struggling getting my Ricky 4003s to sit nicely in the mix when playing with the band, so have come to the conclusion that the bass isn't for me, and that I'd be better off going back to a P-bass.[/size]
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Thing is, I love the feel of the thing! Really like the neck, think it looks lovely, and I am more than happy with the sound when practicing, just been struggling with getting the sound to sit in the mix with a band.[/size]
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I have tried flats - again, nice sound when practicing, but didn’t sit in the mix with the band.[/size]
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I was wondering if there are any pickups out there I could pop in it that might give me a warmer, fatter sound?[/size]
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Im playing through an Ampeg PF-500 into a BF SuperTwin, and I play a range of stuff from reggae to motown to c86 style indiepop, using both plectrums and fingers.[/size]
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I’m guessing the answer is just stick with my p-bass, but thought id ask here before moving it on, just in case.[/size]
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Thanks for any suggestions/thoughts![/size]
[size=3]
Stephen[/size]

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What is it that isn't sitting nicely? I've used my 4003s with my 80s covers band, a blues gig and a Pink Floyd gig and it seems fine (a little push in the mids on the amp's EQ and the neck p/up just backed off ever so slightly).

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[quote name='Chiliwailer' timestamp='1483356780' post='3206422']
I had a similar issue when I needed to use short scales for a few years. I used preamp pedals to sort it out and although the tone never came close to my P Bass, it got me a better tone I was happy with.
[/quote]

Hm.. hadn't thought of that. Definitely a simpler solution to swapping out the pups. What preamp pedal were you using?

[quote name='ezbass' timestamp='1483357088' post='3206430']
What is it that isn't sitting nicely? I've used my 4003s with my 80s covers band, a blues gig and a Pink Floyd gig and it seems fine (a little push in the mids on the amp's EQ and the neck p/up just backed off ever so slightly).
[/quote]

Its just that my P fills up all the low end space, and lets the guitars sit nicely on top. I find the rick occupies a similar space to the guitars, which works well for some of our noisier songs, but Im wanting to pad out the low end more for others.

[quote name='buff' timestamp='1483357657' post='3206432']
[url="http://www.retrovibe.co.uk/parts/pickups.html"]http://www.retrovibe...ts/pickups.html[/url] Ive got a set of high gains in my greco faker, sound a lot more ballsy than my proper 4003.
[/quote]

Didn't know Retrovibe were doing pickups now! Had one of their basses a while back - remember getting on well with it.

Ta for the suggestions!

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A P typically has more in the way of low mids. Try re-Eqing with this in mind. Alternatively use your tone and volume controls, as there are a lot of different sounds available if you experiment. If I want a more in-the-mix, less up front sound, I tend to back off my tones to about half or less (although I do the same on Ps too). If you really want to try new pickups you could fit HB1s as per the 4004, but it may simply be that the P does what you prefer.

Having just read your comment about it sitting in the same space as the guitars, try backing off the tones as above.

Edited by 4000
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[quote name='stega' timestamp='1483368910' post='3206560']


Hm.. hadn't thought of that. Definitely a simpler solution to swapping out the pups. What preamp pedal were you using?
[/quote]

At the time it was a Sans Amp Bass Driver as not much else was available years ago. I still use one of those when I want that particular sound, but only occasionally as they can be tone suckers. These days I mostly use an Aguilar Tonehammer when I need one, great pedal.

I'd recommend trying a few, you may need one that colours the sound, rather than one like the MXR which keeps the natural tone mostly the same. Buying second hand on here is always good as you can flip it for the same money if it doesn't work for you.

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Is the problem on stage, FOH or both? I find my 4003 can lack balls for the on stage sound unless I'm in front of the cabs and the guitarist has problems picking me out in the onstage sound. Out front the sound is fine, sits nice in the mix. I usually go middle position with both pups full on in terms of tone and vol.

I'd agree with above regarding the DI, on occasion I've used the MXR M80 with the Rick, it does give some useful punch if needed.

Edited by martthebass
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[quote name='stega' timestamp='1483368910' post='3206560']
It's just that my P fills up all the low end space, and lets the guitars sit nicely on top. I find the rick occupies a similar space to the guitars, which works well for some of our noisier songs, but Im wanting to pad out the low end more for others.
[/quote]I'd lower the height of the bridge pickup or just back it off a bit using the volume control and see how you fare with that.

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Before I got my Sansamp VT500s I always had to do the tone roll back thing as my sound clashed with the guitars (you'd be surprised how much difference such a simple thing can make; please try it before committing to anything else, just in case).The VTs mean that's no longer necessary. Much prefer them to my old BDDI. I like them so much I bought 2 heads and a pedal.

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My understanding of Rics is that they're fickle beasts, they can sound fantastic (one of the best live bass tones I've heard was on a Ric), but you have to think about the whole band mix, rather than just the bass.

This means that your guitarist(s) might have to change their tone to accommodate you having a decent sound, of course how willing they are to do this is down to their experience and personality........

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Thanks everyone for the input and suggestions.

[quote name='Chiliwailer' timestamp='1483369319' post='3206572']
At the time it was a Sans Amp Bass Driver as not much else was available years ago. I still use one of those when I want that particular sound, but only occasionally as they can be tone suckers. These days I mostly use an Aguilar Tonehammer when I need one, great pedal.
[/quote]

Heard good things about the Tonehammer. Do you have any experience of the amp? Wondering whether the head would offer the same tone shaping/colouring that the pedal offers, or whether the pedal goes a bit further.

[quote name='martthebass' timestamp='1483369981' post='3206589']
Is the problem on stage, FOH or both? I find my 4003 can lack balls for the on stage sound unless I'm in front of the cabs and the guitarist has problems picking me out in the onstage sound. Out front the sound is fine, sits nice in the mix. I usually go middle position with both pups full on in terms of tone and vol.
[/quote]

You're right - out front it seems to sit fine, its just on stage and at practice that I struggle.

[quote name='GreeneKing' timestamp='1483382819' post='3206741']
A passive bass with a mid scoop may benefit from boosted low mids.
[/quote]

All this seems to be pointing to an EQ issue, with possibly particular preamp or maybe a different amp (or even a different band!) needed to get around it (I have tweaked my pf-500 amp to bits without much joy). I think I might take the bass out to some shops and try a few different pre's and heads, see how they effect the sound. Will let you all know how I get on.

Appreciate all the feedback people - lovely forum this one.

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[quote name='stega' timestamp='1483391351' post='3206832']
Thanks everyone for the input and suggestions.



Heard good things about the Tonehammer. Do you have any experience of the amp? Wondering whether the head would offer the same tone shaping/colouring that the pedal offers, or whether the pedal goes a bit further.


[/quote]

The TH amp is great too, but for you're needs I'd strongly suggest pedal + amp, so that the amp gets a fuller and more personally EQ'd tone to enhance.

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[quote name='martthebass' timestamp='1483369981' post='3206589']
I'd agree with above regarding the DI, on occasion I've used the MXR M80 with the Rick, it does give some useful punch if needed.
[/quote]

I'd suggest the MXR M80 too. My amp is mainly EQ'd for my active Ray so on the few songs where I use my passive jazz with a pick, I use the M80 to fatten it up. If you like a little bit of grit in your sound then the distortion channel on with gain fully down and blend at about 10 o'clock is very punchy but still very full in the lows and sounds great in the mix too.

Edited by Painy
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