anzoid Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 Got a Gotoh 201 bridge installed on my Fender P-bass fretless - the saddles are down as low as possible, I've trimmed the nut to within an inch of its life and still the action is a little too high. Neck relief is about right, I just can't get the strings lower. Would swapping out the Gotoh for a Wilkinson (or even a cheapish BBOT) give me an extra mm or so - i.e. anyone know exactly how thick the plate is on a Wilkinson bridge (the one with brass saddles). Saddles diameter would also be useful. The saddles on the Gotoh are 9mm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3below Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 I suspect either a neck shim or neck tilt adjust is required rather than a bridge replacement. [url="https://www.premierguitar.com/articles/19686-guitar-shop-101-how-to-shim-a-bolt-on-neck"]https://www.premierguitar.com/articles/19686-guitar-shop-101-how-to-shim-a-bolt-on-neck[/url] guitar related but you will get the idea. If you are lucky (depending on the era your bass was made) you will have a micro tilt adjust. Makes the job even easier. [url="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ekS4KBMpVY"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ekS4KBMpVY[/url]. . My brand new Fender (1977) was very poorly set up, after getting the 'manual' from Fender customer support I sorted it myself easily. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HowieBass Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 I'm with 3below on this - try shimming the neck first - quickest fix is a partial shim at the back of the neck pocket. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anzoid Posted February 12, 2017 Author Share Posted February 12, 2017 (edited) Cool, thanks guys. I had it in my head that shimming was [a] a desperate last resort and [b] that you used a flat shim to raise the whole neck (which would in this case have required a rather thick shim...). Just read through BOD2's "How to shim" ([url="http://basschat.co.uk/topic/49897-how-to-shim-a-neck/"]http://basschat.co.u...to-shim-a-neck/[/url]) a neck and it looks doable so will give that a go. My P-bass is a 1998/99 MIM so no tilt adjustment - though interestingly the tilt mechanism presumably creates an air gap and "disconnects" the neck somewhat from the body? Which the full length shim people seem to think is unacceptable... but guess it works Edited February 12, 2017 by anzoid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3below Posted February 12, 2017 Share Posted February 12, 2017 Shims at one end of the neck (rather than full length) have been factory fitted. Quite a few of my (too many) basses and guitars have the micro tilt. Does not seen to affect the sound either way. Plastic cut from bottles or TV dinners provides readily available shim material in varying thicknesses. I have also used cardboard and folded cooking foil. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LITTLEWING Posted February 13, 2017 Share Posted February 13, 2017 Cut a postcard or an old small Xmas/birthday card to the size of the whole neck pocket then cut it in half, put one piece into the neck pocket right up against the end as snug as it will go and make two new holes in the card where the screw holes are. Refit the neck (making sure the card stays in place) and as you introduce the long screws turn them anti clockwise and with a light pressure you will feel a slight clunk as they find the thread in the neck heel. This ensures you don't start off a new thread and weaken the existing one. Now start to turn them in by hand and eventually use a snug fitting Philips to take them home just tight enough, and before final tightening, check the strings are sitting equally and not too far over to one side of the fretboard (simply grab the headstock end and push either way until they look good) and finally nip them up, not too heavy handed.You'll now be amazed how low the strings are and instantly have loads of adjustment on the saddles. If it turns out to be too much, it's a simple task to take the neck off again and replace the piece of card with something slightly thinner. Experiment. Have fun while you're gaining experience!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anzoid Posted February 15, 2017 Author Share Posted February 15, 2017 (edited) Well, tonight has been shimming night... I used some thin pieces of wood veneer with some very thin double sided tape. First piece didn't make much of a different at all... So, put in two more pieces, one next to the first and one on top of it to make a step type effect. Neck back on, tuned up... and the strings were flat on the fretboard. Which meant I could actually use the saddles as intended and get some adjustment going. I think it's pretty much there - definitely way lower than before - however, I would like it a bit lower (never satisfied...) but if I lower the saddles back down, the strings choke on the body end of the neck when I play above the 12th fretline... So, have I leaned the neck back too much, or is this something where adjusting the relief would be better? The neck is pretty flat at the moment with a very very slight bow forwards. If I can't get the action any lower I'm still a very happy bunny I've learnt so much in the process - the main thing being that it's worth having a go cause it's tough to screw up a P-bass Edited February 15, 2017 by anzoid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anzoid Posted February 15, 2017 Author Share Posted February 15, 2017 Should also say - thanks for all the advice!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HowieBass Posted February 16, 2017 Share Posted February 16, 2017 Sounds like you've got a little too much neck angle... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anzoid Posted February 18, 2017 Author Share Posted February 18, 2017 Hmmm, oh well, gives me an excuse to muck around some more with it. I'll see how it plays tomorrow and go from there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grangur Posted February 18, 2017 Share Posted February 18, 2017 If you're using a veneer, then a piece approx 60mm x 7mm tucked right up the bridge end of the pocket should be enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markdavid Posted February 23, 2017 Share Posted February 23, 2017 (edited) [quote name='anzoid' timestamp='1487200839' post='3238079'] Well, tonight has been shimming night... I used some thin pieces of wood veneer with some very thin double sided tape. First piece didn't make much of a different at all... So, put in two more pieces, one next to the first and one on top of it to make a step type effect. Neck back on, tuned up... and the strings were flat on the fretboard. Which meant I could actually use the saddles as intended and get some adjustment going. I think it's pretty much there - definitely way lower than before - however, I would like it a bit lower (never satisfied...) but if I lower the saddles back down, the strings choke on the body end of the neck when I play above the 12th fretline... So, have I leaned the neck back too much, or is this something where adjusting the relief would be better? The neck is pretty flat at the moment with a very very slight bow forwards. If I can't get the action any lower I'm still a very happy bunny I've learnt so much in the process - the main thing being that it's worth having a go cause it's tough to screw up a P-bass [/quote] If there is buzzing above the 12th fret (13th,14th,15th fret etc) then try tightening the truss rod a little (maybe a quarter turn) then check if the buzzing has improved any, if it has then your neck had too much relief, if it has not improved then the chances are either that the fretwork is less than perfect and could benefit from a fret dress or your playing style is too aggressive for the action you have set Edited February 23, 2017 by markdavid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anzoid Posted February 24, 2017 Author Share Posted February 24, 2017 Went back and took out some of the bits of veneer I'd put in, leaving just one up the bridge end - screwed everything back together and... it's good. Not sure what I got wrong last time that meant one piece wasn't enough, but now it's just right, had to raise the saddles a bit but the action is very low, very very slight buzz up the dusty end but I rarely play beyond the 15th or 16th fret anyway, so makes no odds. markdavid - it's a fretless but I assume though that the same principles apply? So, I shall probably have a look at tweaking the truss rod too, see if I can get all the way there - buzz free low action. I don't think I play particularly agressively, but then I've never worked on a bass so much to get the action this low before, so maybe that's something to look at too. Would the concensus be that fretless requires a lighter touch? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rikki_Sixx Posted February 24, 2017 Share Posted February 24, 2017 Thanks for posting this Anzoid - and to everyone else for the advice - as I've been thinking about this myself for when I eventually upgrade my bridge! I convinced myself it's a massive undertaking and my bass will be only good for firewood if I don't shim it right, so I'm glad I spotted this thread! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markdavid Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 [quote name='anzoid' timestamp='1487935430' post='3244281'] Went back and took out some of the bits of veneer I'd put in, leaving just one up the bridge end - screwed everything back together and... it's good. Not sure what I got wrong last time that meant one piece wasn't enough, but now it's just right, had to raise the saddles a bit but the action is very low, very very slight buzz up the dusty end but I rarely play beyond the 15th or 16th fret anyway, so makes no odds. markdavid - it's a fretless but I assume though that the same principles apply? So, I shall probably have a look at tweaking the truss rod too, see if I can get all the way there - buzz free low action. I don't think I play particularly agressively, but then I've never worked on a bass so much to get the action this low before, so maybe that's something to look at too. Would the concensus be that fretless requires a lighter touch? [/quote] Ahh I see , im sorry to say I have little to no fretless experience, I would assume the same principles apply, I would guess that on a fretless that correct neck relief is even more critical , I would also guess that a very slightly higher action than on a fretted bass would be be beneficial to avoid the notes choking , perhaps someone more knowledgeable can chime in Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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