Al Krow Posted February 19, 2017 Share Posted February 19, 2017 Hey fellow BCs! Wanted to pick your brains on whether a multi-effects pedal can compete with dedicated single effect pedals? To take one example will the octave function on a Zoom MS-60B come anywhere close to a Boss OC-2 or do I need to splash out on dedicated single effects each time for the best results? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lozz196 Posted February 19, 2017 Share Posted February 19, 2017 I had the Zoom B3 and it was pretty near on the effects I tried on it, not 100% but maybe 85/90% there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-Bay Posted February 19, 2017 Share Posted February 19, 2017 +1 some are better than others. I now use the B3 for the less used effects and have my common ones as stand alone. To me it works as a good compromise between quality and not carrying a board that is the size of New Guinea. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Krow Posted February 19, 2017 Author Share Posted February 19, 2017 Interesting that you guys both use the B3 rather than the 60B, I guess the B3 is still a step up from the 60B despite being a few years older? Have you (or any other BCs) tried the Boss ME 50B? Views? T Bay - your "compromise" suggestion makes very good sense! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rushbo Posted February 19, 2017 Share Posted February 19, 2017 Another vote for the Zoom - I'm a pretty sparing user of effects (compression, drive, distortion, a bit of chorus for the sensitive ballad moments and an auto wah for the occasional comedy interlude...) so it's perfect for me. It sits on a plank of MDF next to my SmoothHound wireless dealio and a two way plug socket to power them up. I've even squeezed in a little tin with some spare batteries and plectrums on there. Fits nicely into a laptop case. I made the step away from single pedals when I had recurring issues with interconnects, in spite of having decent quality ones. The Zoom is perfect for me. It's done well over 100 gigs and rehearsals and always delivers. Rugged construction and it's boyracer red, too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lozz196 Posted February 19, 2017 Share Posted February 19, 2017 (edited) Interesting that you guys both use the B3 rather than the 60B, I guess the B3 is still a step up from the 60B despite being a few years older? Have you (or any other BCs) tried the Boss ME 50B? Views? T Bay - your "compromise" suggestion makes very good sense! I used the B3 as I needed a DI and the 60B doesn`t have one. That was my only reason for choosing it, if the 60B had had one I would have bought that due to it`s smaller footprint. Edited March 27, 2019 by Dad3353 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skybone Posted February 20, 2017 Share Posted February 20, 2017 I used a B3 for a while, and found it to be versatile, though if you want to use more than 3 effects at once, it could be a bit limiting. I got an MS60B from someone on here, a great wee pedal, but very limited regarding switching effects during songs. I now use the Line6 POD HD500x, which gives me all the flexibility of an effects floor board as well as all the amp sims. Sounds great too. Modern multi-FX are so much better than their forebears, though a good number of people insist on individual effects. Must admit that I was something of an analogue snob while I was playing guitar for gigs & rehearsals (valve amp & analogue pedals), but used a POD for recording ideas and practising at home. A good multi-FX can allow you to experiment with effects that you'd either not find, or would be too expensive to buy just to experiment with. IMO, you can use the multi-FX to find sounds that you like, and then you can build an analogue rig from there if that's still a priority. When you start to look at rigs like the Axe FX, Kemper & Helix, you realise that multi's have come such a long wayin a relatively short period. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dannybuoy Posted February 20, 2017 Share Posted February 20, 2017 Separate pedals all the way for me. I love being able to swap things in and out so that I end up with the best of each effect that suits my needs. Multis are always a compromise, especially when it comes to dirt. Aside from the tonal aspects, I find them a pain to tweak and program, and far prefer the hands on usability that separates offer. I'm no technophobe either, I work in IT and am a tech geek. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Krow Posted February 21, 2017 Author Share Posted February 21, 2017 Hi Skybone - I think that is a very helpful summary of where I should be heading: i.e. use the multi FX to explore effects and then get a dedicated pedal for key effects I want to be using. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Left Foot Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 I started off with mutli-effects (Boss & Line 6) and you can get some very decent sounds out of them. However, I think you need to tweek each patch to get the sound you really want and in some cases you need to put a lot of time in to get something vaguely usable in certain settings. This means pushing lots of buttons as its mostly digital settings including amp set ups. You get a lot of bang for your buck with multi effects, undoubtedly, but you might be getting what you expected based on ease of use and signal path layouts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Left Foot Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 (edited) Hi Skybone - I think that is a very helpful summary of where I should be heading: i.e. use the multi FX to explore effects and then get a dedicated pedal for key effects I want to be using. I'm not sure, personally a multi effect really swamps you down initially. In keeping with my previous post about the adjustment needed on patches, I think multi effects actually suit people who know what they want as a user group more. However, the trend is that beginners get a multi effects unit and not get the best out of it because they don't really know what they want. A common discussion on BC is the 'must haves' on peoples board and the common responses (whilst everyone's different) are the following: Overdrive/Distortion - fuzz is different in sound. Reverb/Delay Chorus Octave Four simple starting points to jump off from. I would get the really cheap single effect units first and decide if you A) like them use them C) need them - and then decide if you would improve on either of them. Including cables and power supplies, this approach isn't going to cost you more than picking up a single multi effect unit however It will help you develop an appreciation for how to use effects, including how to stack effects and adjust them for what you need. Otherwise you may find you have all the options but no methods, a pointless scenario. Good luck in your pursuits. Edited March 27, 2019 by Dad3353 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmccombe7 Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 (edited) I have a mixture that i pick and choose depending on type of band i'm playing with. Have the Roland GT-6B mfx. that i tend to use for compressor, tuner and different bass amp tones. I have main channel as dry with only the comp used. Next channel up from that set to sound Ampeg valve tone with a Rik so it has that high end click and slight distortion on the 15" cab emulator. Like to think its my early Glenn Hughes Deep Purple era sound. Comp on this too. Other channels i have set up specifically for my own enjoyment are echo, reverb, for fretless use. Like some of the other channels but very rarely use for more than above items. On the other hand i have a Polytune, Aphex comp, that i nearly always have with me and on occasion add TC Echo a7 TC Reverb as required. Current band is blues base funk / rock so tuner and comp really all i use. Dave Edited February 21, 2017 by dmccombe7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigRedX Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 (edited) Hey fellow BCs! Wanted to pick your brains on whether a multi-effects pedal can compete with dedicated single effect pedals? To take one example will the octave function on a Zoom MS-60B come anywhere close to a Boss OC-2 or do I need to splash out on dedicated single effects each time for the best results? One of the problems when comparing and multi effects unit against single pedals is that people are rarely comparing like for like. A budget unit like the Zoom which does lots of things well - maybe some of them very well, isn't really going to be able to compete sonically with pedals that only do a single thing yet are each still more expensive than the multi effects unit. What you really need to do is to add up the total cost of all the individual pedals that you would like, and compare them against a multi effects unit of equivalent value. What you will find then is that the multi-effects will do some things better than some pedals and some things not as well and what is good what is not will depend on the manufacturer of the multi-effects unit. For me multi effects win out every time in a live situation for one thing - PROGRAMMABILITY. I know when I hit the button for a particular preset on my multi effects unit it's going to sound exactly the same as it did the last time I selected that combination of sounds. I'm not going to have to worry that the knobs might have got nudged in transit or by an over-enthusiastic member of the band or stage-invading audience member. There's no point in having a fantastic sounding pedal if it's all to easy to turn that killer sound into the worlds nastiest tone by a slight mis-setting of a control or two. And want a slightly different distortion on the next song? No need for multiple effects pedals or scrabbling on the floor trying to remember which setting to change. Simply pick the preset for the song and I'm ready to go. Finally my "pedal board" is at biggest, half the size it would need to be if I was going to do it all with dedicated effects pedals. In the studio, I'll use whatever I need to get the perfect sound for the track. Live I'll settle for a maybe slightly less good sound, safe in the knowledge that it will always be the same overtime I select it, and that if I need slight variations for different songs (or even different parts of the same song) they are all just a single footswitch press away. Edited March 27, 2019 by Dad3353 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EBS_freak Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 (edited) One of the problems when comparing and multi effects unit against single pedals is that people are rarely comparing like for like. A budget unit like the Zoom which does lots of things well - maybe some of them very well, isn't really going to be able to compete sonically with pedals that only do a single thing yet are each still more expensive than the multi effects unit. What you really need to do is to add up the total cost of all the individual pedals that you would like, and compare them against a multi effects unit of equivalent value. What you will find then is that the multi-effects will do some things better than some pedals and some things not as well and what is good what is not will depend on the manufacturer of the multi-effects unit. For me multi effects win out every time in a live situation for one thing - PROGRAMMABILITY. I know when I hit the button for a particular preset on my multi effects unit it's going to sound exactly the same as it did the last time I selected that combination of sounds. I'm not going to have to worry that the knobs might have got nudged in transit or by an over-enthusiastic member of the band or stage-invading audience member. There's no point in having a fantastic sounding pedal if it's all to easy to turn that killer sound into the worlds nastiest tone by a slight mis-setting of a control or two. And want a slightly different distortion on the next song? No need for multiple effects pedals or scrabbling on the floor trying to remember which setting to change. Simply pick the preset for the song and I'm ready to go. Finally my "pedal board" is at biggest, half the size it would need to be if I was going to do it all with dedicated effects pedals. In the studio, I'll use whatever I need to get the perfect sound for the track. Live I'll settle for a maybe slightly less good sound, safe in the knowledge that it will always be the same overtime I select it, and that if I need slight variations for different songs (or even different parts of the same song) they are all just a single footswitch press away. ^ This. It's one of the version I have switched my rig completely. I can take different rigs, all digitally controllable... and nobody would bat an eyelid if it sounds 95% like the analogue equivalent anyway. Edited March 27, 2019 by Dad3353 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Japhet Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 I'd say the Zoom B3 is great if you can get your 'core' sound out of your amp without taking up patches for preamp or amp modelling. Then you can have 3 free patches for actual effects. You can 'toggle' into different banks but you wouldn't want to try it mid song and one false move could lead to complete disaster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Krow Posted February 21, 2017 Author Share Posted February 21, 2017 Thanks for the additional posts guys. Left foot, I note you missed off a compressor pedal from your summary of most used effects which caught me by surprise, as I thought this would be at or near the top of a "must have" pedal list?! But maybe not if the BC consensus is saying otherwise! (And built in tuners are obviously very handy too). So I get what Dave (dmccombe 7) is saying on his pedal set up. I'll also have to confess a guilty pleasure of really enjoying a Vox AC30 "old skool" tremolo sound. I know they were designed for "twangy" guitar but I personally really like the sound for the appropriate track on twangy-bass also Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigRedX Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 Personally I wouldn't bother with either reverb or delay as an effect for the bass, because IME in the majority of cases they simply make the bass less distinct especially in a band mix. The only time I've been able to make delay work effectively was alongside a sequencer synchronised gate which chopped the notes short enough so that each note could be distinctly heard as a separate entity. And it would need to have a tap tempo function to keep it in time - something a lot of individual delay pedals don't have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EBS_freak Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 (edited) Personally I wouldn't bother with either reverb or delay as an effect for the bass, because IME in the majority of cases they simply make the bass less distinct especially in a band mix. The only time I've been able to make delay work effectively was alongside a sequencer synchronised gate which chopped the notes short enough so that each note could be distinctly heard as a separate entity. And it would need to have a tap tempo function to keep it in time - something a lot of individual delay pedals don't have. I use delay as a synth pad thing - I've yet to be able to use it in a manner like guitarists do though... and reverb is nice in an acoustic setting, especially with fretless... but yes, for your standard in a band bass, reverb and delay are probably most up there in the least needed effects. EDIT: Something like this maybe... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WW7iIaZeMgY Edited March 27, 2019 by Dad3353 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROConnell Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 Kind of off-topic but does anybody know what happened to the Boss GT-10B? There's none anywhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dood Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 I think the Zoom B3N sounds like it's going to be quite a contender when it drops next month. I'll do my best to get my hands on one to try out and report back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cherchez la Femme Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 I sold my MXR M80, BBE Opto Stomp and some assorted modulation/delay effects (Small Stone, Hardwire DL-8 and the like) and picked up a B3 on here for £100 which near-enough nails the sounds I need. So I basically swapped a few pedals for a 'one-box' solution and made myself £100 odd! I still use single stompboxes for overdrive and I prefer my Pitchblack tuner to the built-in B3 tuner, but aside from that the B3 covers my compression and EQ needs just fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skybone Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 With the B3n coming out, there should be some cracking deals on B3's due. Not forgetting second hand versions as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Krow Posted February 25, 2017 Author Share Posted February 25, 2017 Had a comment from a fellow BC'r on the B3n thread that they found the Zoom MS-60B octave effect to be good. Would others agree? I felt that the tracking with low notes on the MS-60B leaves a little to be desired, and a decent octave effect is a priority for me (and which was kind of the trigger for this thread, although it's been very helpful anyways!) How do the other multi fx boxes fare with tracking at the low end - how low do they reasonably go - any manage to track all the way down to a bottom E? Do any dedicated octave pedals manage this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Left Foot Posted February 25, 2017 Share Posted February 25, 2017 Compressors are an effect you'd want depending on, again, what you want to do... gain pedals compress the signal. Regarding what effect to use, if you know you don't want to use a revert/delay then it's all the more reason not to get a multi effect which will offer you options you don't want. As with most multi effects, you'll spend an age tweaking 3-4 patches to do what you need for practicality reasons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigRedX Posted February 25, 2017 Share Posted February 25, 2017 (edited) As with most multi effects, you'll spend an age tweaking 3-4 patches to do what you need for practicality reasons. But you'll never have to tweak them again once you've got it right, and they'll be right every time you select them. Edited March 27, 2019 by Dad3353 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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