Jump to content


Room Treatment


9 replies to this topic

#1 adamg67

    Fully fledged member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 174 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:West Yorkshire

Posted 16 September 2017 - 08:58 PM

Interested reading the home studio porn thread that lots of people have sound treatment in their rooms at home. Obvious question, how do you figure out what you need and where you need it?
For Sale: Ibanez ATK 300: http://basschat.co.u...f-bass-for-l220
Between bands after supplying bass and more for Studio 13: http://studio13.rocks
Ibnaez BTB456 6 string / Ibanez SRC6 (x2) / Maruszczyk Jake 5A+ Custom in Blue Burst.
Ibanez RGIB6 Baritone / Paul Reed Smith S2 Custom 24 in Black Burst.
MarkBass Multiamp Mono (love it!) / Markbass Traveler 1x15 / Amplitube Max
Feedback: http://basschat.co.u...ck-for-adamg67/

#2 SubsonicSimpleton

    Fully fledged member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 662 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Sunny Yorkshire

Posted 17 September 2017 - 12:23 PM

There is lots of information on room design and treatment here.

http://forum.studiotips.com/index.php

This article is a good place to start

http://forum.studiot....php?f=5&t=3314

#3 Skol303

    Needs to get out more

  • Forum Moderators
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,174 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Manchester

Posted 18 September 2017 - 01:32 PM

I can't recommend the Gearslutz forum enough for this kind of thing...

https://www.gearslut...ding-acoustics/

... lots of pro audio folk on there who are happy to help.

Other than that, there are basically two ways of approaching this:

1) The easy way, which is to assume that your room will need bass traps in every corner, side panels next to where your desk is and a 'ceiling cloud' panel above it. Pretty much 99% of home studios will need that exact treatment.

2) The more involved way, which is to buy yourself a calibrated measurement mic, download a free copy of Room EQ Wizard software, learn how to use it (no mean feat - I've dabbled!) and get yourself some accurate room measurements to inform your choices for acoustic treatment.

Or... if you're able to spend some money, there are a number of companies who can do all this for you. The people at GIK Acoustics are arguably the market leaders with offices in the US and UK. Very helpful by all accounts. I personally have experience of using Blue Frog Audio (small independent company), who were just great and spent a lot of time working out what treatment I needed, using Google Sketchup to illustrate their ideas.

But ultimately... acoustic treatment is a HUGE topic that gets very scientific very quickly. There's lots of basic advise on Gearslutz and elsewhere online (pretty much summarised by my point 1 above), but of course each solution is ultimately specific to the room itself - so if you want a detailed answer, you need to measure/provide the detail yourself or ask for help from a professional. Which sadly isn't me :)

#4 roman_sub

    Fully fledged member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 311 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Wimbledon, London

Posted 20 September 2017 - 03:05 PM

I'd start with thinking about these 3 areas:

1) basstraps - corners and where wall meets ceiling behind speakers

2) absorbers - to kill first order reflections from speakers - i.e. ceiling above, and to the sides (think of it as a mirror)

3) some sort of diffuser behind you - bookshelf with randomly stacked books is acceptable as a real world compromise....


other than that, aim for symmetry between walls, and ideally sitting at around the 38% mark of the room.... don't be afraid to experiment with speaker positioning too, especially if they are rear-ported. sub-woofer set up is a whole new area too....

good luck!
My feedback: http://basschat.co.u...__hl__roman_sub

Free sound engineering (location/mix/master): http://basschat.co.u...xing-mastering/

Stuff for sale:

Fender USA jazz 3-ply pickguard (white): http://basschat.co.u...e/#entry3306657

Fender Precision Minty White pickguard + wiring harness: http://basschat.co.u...wiring-harness/

Hughes & Kettner Tubeman overdrive preamp: http://basschat.co.u...mp-l100-posted/

#5 WinterMute

    Fully fledged member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 242 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:London, England

Posted 24 September 2017 - 02:17 PM

There's also http://www.eqacoustics.com who do very good home studio studio kits and will help with advice.

I used Fuzzmeasure to get the basic plot of rooms to tell me where the problems are then apply bass traps to the nodal points, (corners basically) and some absorbers at the Early Reflection point, this will help tame most problems to a degree.

Fibre cored units are much better than foam, which isn't as effective as some people would have you believe, but will help some.

Diffusion isn't much use in a small room, but is very good in larger spaces with taming reverb and echo problems.
"Everything in excess, moderation is for monks" - Lazarus Long

Gear:
Musicman SR5 20th Anniversary
Musicman Bongo 5 in stealth...
OLP "Tony Levin" 5 string with Bartolini pups and pre upgrade.
Hybrid "Musicman" Fretless 5 string (OLP body, MM neck, Bart pups and pre)
Line 6 Bass Pod XT Pro & Shortboard
Crown XLS1500 power amp
Barefaced Big Twin T

#6 Skol303

    Needs to get out more

  • Forum Moderators
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,174 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Manchester

Posted 25 September 2017 - 02:27 PM

View PostWinterMute, on 24 September 2017 - 02:17 PM, said:

Fibre cored units are much better than foam, which isn't as effective as some people would have you believe, but will help some.

Absolutely this. Foam is next to useless for taming bass, which accounts for 99% of problems in 99% of home studios (*Department of Made Up Statistics, 2017). It mostly just dampens the high frequencies, which can leave the room sounding 'off'.

Bass trapping is all about density and volume of 'stuff' and the more the better. Most manufacturers seem to use ECOSE (a type of Rockwool). If you have the time and patience, you can manufacture bass traps yourself fairly easily and cheaply (says someone who has never done this himself...). Lots of tutorials online for how to do so.

View PostWinterMute, on 24 September 2017 - 02:17 PM, said:

I used Fuzzmeasure to get the basic plot of rooms to tell me where the problems are

Never heard of FuzzMeasure before. I'm going to investigate...! :)

Edited by Skol303, 25 September 2017 - 02:28 PM.


#7 WinterMute

    Fully fledged member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 242 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:London, England

Posted 26 September 2017 - 10:46 AM

View PostSkol303, on 25 September 2017 - 02:27 PM, said:

Absolutely this. Foam is next to useless for taming bass, which accounts for 99% of problems in 99% of home studios (*Department of Made Up Statistics, 2017). It mostly just dampens the high frequencies, which can leave the room sounding 'off'.

Bass trapping is all about density and volume of 'stuff' and the more the better. Most manufacturers seem to use ECOSE (a type of Rockwool). If you have the time and patience, you can manufacture bass traps yourself fairly easily and cheaply (says someone who has never done this himself...). Lots of tutorials online for how to do so.



Never heard of FuzzMeasure before. I'm going to investigate...! :)

It's a great little room measurement tool, but it relies on the quality of the mic and speakers, best used with a good Omni and whatever monitors you intend to use in the room...!

I did think about building the bass traps myself, but I'm just not that good at DIY and EQ do some really good packs.

If you've got more money that sense, take a look at these little boxes of voodoo, they are unbelievably good. http://www.psiaudio....tive-bass-trap/
"Everything in excess, moderation is for monks" - Lazarus Long

Gear:
Musicman SR5 20th Anniversary
Musicman Bongo 5 in stealth...
OLP "Tony Levin" 5 string with Bartolini pups and pre upgrade.
Hybrid "Musicman" Fretless 5 string (OLP body, MM neck, Bart pups and pre)
Line 6 Bass Pod XT Pro & Shortboard
Crown XLS1500 power amp
Barefaced Big Twin T

#8 adamg67

    Fully fledged member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 174 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:West Yorkshire

Posted 26 September 2017 - 12:32 PM

Thinking about FuzzMeasrure (which is mac only, so no good for me) I have a vague memory of seeing a video someone "shooting a room" using a mic, and I guess it must have been a frequency graph? So you play stuff, poke your mic into different bits of the room and see if the frequencies coming back are the same as in the original. Does that sound sensible? It would work for bass traps maybe.
For Sale: Ibanez ATK 300: http://basschat.co.u...f-bass-for-l220
Between bands after supplying bass and more for Studio 13: http://studio13.rocks
Ibnaez BTB456 6 string / Ibanez SRC6 (x2) / Maruszczyk Jake 5A+ Custom in Blue Burst.
Ibanez RGIB6 Baritone / Paul Reed Smith S2 Custom 24 in Black Burst.
MarkBass Multiamp Mono (love it!) / Markbass Traveler 1x15 / Amplitube Max
Feedback: http://basschat.co.u...ck-for-adamg67/

#9 WinterMute

    Fully fledged member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 242 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:London, England

Posted 27 September 2017 - 08:43 PM

View Postadamg67, on 26 September 2017 - 12:32 PM, said:

Thinking about FuzzMeasrure (which is mac only, so no good for me) I have a vague memory of seeing a video someone "shooting a room" using a mic, and I guess it must have been a frequency graph? So you play stuff, poke your mic into different bits of the room and see if the frequencies coming back are the same as in the original. Does that sound sensible? It would work for bass traps maybe.

Sort of, you put the mic in different places, the listening spot, the back of the room, a few others and you play a combination of sweep tones, blips and white or pink noise (not all at the same time...) then the software shows you a waterfall graph of the frequency response, another of the RT. You can see where the frequencies are exaggerated and/or missing and you can plan accordingly.

Some 5.1 receivers do the same thing for living rooms and surround systems with a bit more automation and EQ.

Here's the waterfall plot of my room in the listening position and the back wall, you can see the difference in the bass response.

Attached File  monthly_09_2017/post-6211-0-99542500-1506544843.jpg   134.87K
Attached File  monthly_09_2017/post-6211-0-34305900-1506544861.jpg   136.29K

That's why you bass trap the back wall and the corners. Evened it out a bit with the traps, still too bassy on the back wall, but you don't listen critically in that position and the response only needs to be even at the listening position for such a small room.
"Everything in excess, moderation is for monks" - Lazarus Long

Gear:
Musicman SR5 20th Anniversary
Musicman Bongo 5 in stealth...
OLP "Tony Levin" 5 string with Bartolini pups and pre upgrade.
Hybrid "Musicman" Fretless 5 string (OLP body, MM neck, Bart pups and pre)
Line 6 Bass Pod XT Pro & Shortboard
Crown XLS1500 power amp
Barefaced Big Twin T

#10 adamg67

    Fully fledged member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 174 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:West Yorkshire

Posted 09 October 2017 - 11:33 AM

View PostWinterMute, on 27 September 2017 - 08:43 PM, said:

That's why you bass trap the back wall and the corners. Evened it out a bit with the traps, still too bassy on the back wall, but you don't listen critically in that position and the response only needs to be even at the listening position for such a small room.

I was thinking exactly that when I was in the room the other day, it only really matters how it sounds where I sit. I'm on the "long" wall but still close to the wall behind me, the room's only 2 x 2.5m anyway so it's hard to get away from it. We're looking to move next year, so this might be something to look at after that
For Sale: Ibanez ATK 300: http://basschat.co.u...f-bass-for-l220
Between bands after supplying bass and more for Studio 13: http://studio13.rocks
Ibnaez BTB456 6 string / Ibanez SRC6 (x2) / Maruszczyk Jake 5A+ Custom in Blue Burst.
Ibanez RGIB6 Baritone / Paul Reed Smith S2 Custom 24 in Black Burst.
MarkBass Multiamp Mono (love it!) / Markbass Traveler 1x15 / Amplitube Max
Feedback: http://basschat.co.u...ck-for-adamg67/





1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 1 guests, 0 anonymous users