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OK, I'm sorry everyone. Running a business that specialises in making gear for live music is really hard when pretty much all live music is currently on hold. It's harder still when you have two small children and a very challenging baby. Can you just ignore my last comment, I'm just trying to stay the right side of a nervous breakdown whilst trying to not have to make all my staff redundant.

Thank you. It’s probably best to leave it as it is, it’s more honest. I think a lot of people have a very different idea of Barefaced to what it actually is. For better or worse, I’m not really financially driven, I just want to make the best possible products in the way that I believe is right. I want to make things that people use for years and years and years, I don’t want to make things that are at all disposable. From a business perceptive I am horribly cursed by a desire to not screw up this planet any more than possible - I know making speakers (the actual drivers, especially the magnets) is not environmentally friendly so I want those speakers to be really valued items that people cherish and thar even outlast me. And I also strongly believe in trying to manufacture here, creating jobs where you get to use your hands, not just poke at a computer. So because of those decisions, everything we make costs a hell of a lot to make. Everything we design takes a really long time to design (I can’t tell you how long we’ve spent on the amp so far...) We operate from an almost comically tiny factory and no-one here, me included, makes much money. Thankfully I’m not a big spender, my wife is very frugal and you can get an awful lot of things free (hurrah for sharing/freecycle groups) or cheap secondhand, and the children don’t seem to mind (yet). Last year I bought a new car because the front wheel snapped off the 15 year old one as the suspension had rusted through - and I really like cars. Well, I say new, it’s almost five years old but that’s new to me! I need to do an official announcement updating customers etc on what Barefaced is up to, but with the massive fall in orders due to the lack of live music, I now have half as many staff as in March, and the staff who are still here are only part-time and mostly furloughed. It’s really hard. I know it’s even worse for all the pro musicians who’ve lost their entire income, the events companies, the list goes on. And of course those who’ve been seriously ill, or had close friends or relatives suffer, or even die from this. I don’t know where I’m rambling with this but I guess I’m trying to say that I’m not sitting in some ivory tower making fancy products, I’m just trying to do something I believe in and earn enough to live. And because margins are fine and right now turnover is much lower than normal, I’m spread very thin trying to wear too many hats so that I can pay the rent and my mortgage and payroll and feed my family and not have to lay off more staff.

Oh my. I just read back over this thread. I have nothing but sympathy for Alex. The one thing which used to grind my gears above all else when I ran my own business was armchair experts telling me how it should be done and where I was going wrong. Trust me if you've never been through this it wears you down. Every single person thinks they're being helpful, sharing their 'wisdom' seeing the bigger picture, offering 'constructive criticism' - I heard them all over the years. But actually for the person on the receiving end of this every single one of them just sounds exactly the same as the last. Remember the Harry Enfield character? You don't want to do it like that, you want to do it like this...

I think it's very sad that no one has bothered to ask the really important questions about the pedal, so far, on this thread. So in the interests of the wider community, Alex... Is it any good for metal?

Guys, this thread is about the Machinist pedal and nothing else. Please try to keep on topic otherwise we’ll have to close the discussion. Alex has apologised, let’s move on.

They did the conveyancing on my flat in Chichester, I think?

Make sure the others tell the virus they're getting paid so it doesn't infect them!

You're probably right, but reading the 'history' about this pedal was quite interesting and it makes sense to me how it came about. Barefaced + COG doing something together, made in the UK etc especially in these difficult times... is something to applaud, I feel. The product won't be for everyone (is anything ever?) but would it be better if they hadn't bothered at all? I don't think so.

As a fan of old DOD pedals where the control names had nothing to do with their function at all, I think the graphics are easy. And let's face it - by the time we're ready to gig with a new toy we don't read the knob descriptions anymore. We already know them.

In the early to mid 80s I was the world's greatest fan of both Elvis Costello and of his band The Attractions. OK, so it wasn't easy to prove that using a Sinclair Spectrum and electronic calculator, but I'm pretty confident of the stats nonetheless. Can't remember which one as they all blurred into a haze of cider, smoke and tiny squares of paper, but one of the Saturday nights at Pilton Pop Festival (a village event near the towns of Shepton Mallet and Glastonbury) featured Elvis himself as the headliner. Say what you like, there is something special about living in the time of your heroes ascendant. When popular culture esteems your favourites and places them on public pedestals for your personal pleasure. Beats the hell out of seeing them years after their peak when it feels as if the world has moved on and left both you and them trying to catch the smoke of past glory in the net of nostalgia. That year I was pressed against the barrier just feet from the great man, drinking in every moment of his solo performance. It was the first time I heard Tramp The Dirt Down and the cheers of the crowd in sympathy with its sentiments, visibly moved him and me both. All good things come to an end and indeed EC, having performed his encores bowed for the final time in acknowledgement of the muddy masses on that magical Somerset evening, . I was ready to return to our little camp and find my mates so I could tell them, repeatedly and at enormous length just how good Elvis was, when he sang the opening line of another song, the curtains in front of which he'd performed flew back, the stage exploded with light and there, right there, in front of me was none other than The Attractions, featuring of course, my all time favourite bassist Mr Bruce Thomas himself. They crashed into a full set of material and I was utterly delirious. Higher than any lump of squidgy black or red leb could have made me. A couple of hours of my favourite songwriter, solo, was a near religious experience, but to have my favourite band then perform a surprise set as well, left me a barely coherent babbling fool. No gig has ever come close before or since.

The more you look at the knobs with the cool overwriting graphics, the more they make sense to me - i think they are fine, and one you know what they do, it doesn’t matter

Yes, it's been a horrific year. I'm sorry for upsetting any of you, I really didn't mean to.

So... this here pedal then...

Dunno why but I imagine you saying this whilst screwing a silencer onto an unmarked and untraceable pistol

Comments like that remind me of why I rarely visit there any more

I know most of it's rhetorical - but I'll have a stab - How many would have gone out and gotten it if it was an amp released and bitten the bullet? At the moment, not a lot. Unless it's was a cheap combo or practice amp for use at home. I'm sure there's a lot of people that are wondering whether they'll ever gig again. There's a lot of re-evaluation going on for a lot of people, especially if there's a lot of money tied up in gear that doesn't look like it will be used in the foreseeable. If it was an amp, it's impossible to say what would have happened - a lot of people would buy off the specs. There's no specs, there's no amp. It's a pointless question really - but I will nail my colours to the mast... given the pandemic, if there was an amp for sale, I would guess the sales figures would be impacted way, way more right now, than a pedal, which can be used at gigs, at home, rehearsals (if allowed) and recording sessions... oh and they are a lot cheaper than amp is likely to be. How many who would have bitten the bullet bought the pedal have changed their minds based on the graphics and lack of DI amongst the other things mentioned? ZVex made alterations to their SHO because they failed to take into account, theres a whole load of church players in the states that liked the pedal, but felt it was inappropriate to have Super Hard On written on it. I guess there will be all sort of people offended by that kinda thing. That promptly had a change of heart and relabelled it the SHO. Of course, you could have taped over it... but why would you want to do that when you've bought a pedal at a premium? Design is a very important - and often overlooked element of a product. There's always the camp that don't care, it's functional, it works, it does what they want it to... but they are also the people that don't care having their car doors dinged at the supermarket. If you are investing in a product, there's a certain element of visual appeal that in many cases, takes place. I hate the look of the Fiat Multipla. It could be the best car in the world... but I hate looking at it. Would I care if I hated looking at an FX pedal? Probably not... but if there were two otherwise identical sounding units, I'd take the one that visually appeals to me. The DI element - well, that's a fundamental requirement to some. If it doesn't offer it and you want it, look elsewhere, or go begging for a v2 and hope for the best. I am guessing that this product has been produced to be the minimum viable product that has enough appeal to sell over competitor products. Adding DI would be an added expense that the vast majority of people would not have used. Is this a preamp? Or a magical fuzz, grind, clean whatever box. If you want a pre, get a pre with a DI. If you want a whatever box, consider this. How many people will throw in thoughts on what they thought the pedal should do/look like and never had an intention of getting it or anything like it anyway and use that as an excuse for not getting it? If you are never ever going to own a Ferrari, does that mean you can't have an opinion on what you would have liked to see on it or comment on what you don't like about it? It all forms part of the market research and is a valid input. A Ferrari has to have curbside appeal so that those that don't own it, aspire to own it. How many people would change their view based on any clips coming out from BF/COG or based on a BCer who may get one and give their thoughts, and does it matter which member does that in weighting the review/opinion? Not me. No offense, most of you guys are deaf or are prone to honeymoon periods. I'd like to see reviews just to see if I agree or disagree with the points of views displayed in said videos... and get more informed about what's out there. If it suddenly appears on Tim C or Dusty Hills board, does that make a difference? Hell no, there's only two people in the bass playing world that prompt people to buy gear. That's Mark King and Marcus Miller. And the people buying that gear tend to be those in jobs outside of music. What people play and the whole endorsement thing is a complete nonsense. What’s the conclusion? We are on a forum where people share views and opinions. Sometimes in keeping with others views, sometimes not. What's the problem with that? Does it really matter if anybody buys this or not? Maybe to Alex. Not to the rest of us. But if we disclose information about what's good or what's bad, it will drive improvement... and when it comes to Barefaced, people seem to have issue whenever something is said that doesn't go with the grain, whatever that may or may not be. So I think we are on the same page. Maybe?

We never planned to have multiple knob choices, we chose a knob, designed the graphics etc around it and then because of the pandemic's impact on supply chains we couldn't get enough of them for the first production run. Then I had the idea of offering knob choices so we could make something positive out of this problem. I've got two of these pedals on my board (one at the start and one near the end of the signal chain), one with one knob style and one with another style.

And FWIW, I think it looks fackin brilliant. It appeals to my inner engineering nerd. Once you've worked out what the symbols actually mean -- and let's face it, we're all intelligent, even the guitarists** so that won't take long -- it'll be easy enough. I mean, it's not the first pedal to have shall we say 'enigmatic' control labelling... 'Pinch' and 'Wool' on the Woolly Mammoth, anyone? ** obvious joke, but I apologise to any sensitive petals who are offended by it.

Let’s look at the pedal properly - its an overdrive/fuzz/clean signal path, which if i read properly is able to be used on guitar and bass. This makes perfect sense considering BF is making guitar and bass cabs - pinning all hopes onto a bass amp does in itself not serve all of the customer base. People using their cabs, will already have an amp, its more expensive for them to make and for us to buy, and despite protestations would there be a mass buying of the amp from the BC community let alone the whole bass community at this time when no one has a lot of cash - i doubt it. The lack of DI makes not difference really - it doesn’t have to be line level to go into a desk or a USB interface etc. You just have to gain stage,plenty of pre-amp pedals have no DI - Tech21 PSA 2.0, Line6 Helix etc. Personally i think it sounds really interesting,and I want to have a play more on it, i am not normally a fuzz guy, I like either a mild ‘tube’ type drive,or go more for a crossover type clank like the Tech21 DP3X or dUg amp. What i want to know is @alexclaber i reckon it will do the overdrive nicely as well as fuzz, but will the distortion do ‘clanky’ or is it still more organic? Keep going, i like it so far

From little acorns, and all that. If they're going to dip a toe into the waters of stuff-other-than-cabs, better to start small. Jumping in feet first with an expensive tube amp, with all the R&D and prototyping costs involved, could have been financial suicide. I think it's a smart first move.

I think you're reading too much into it.

This is such a spectacularly awful year for so many people, with deaths, job losses, no work etc etc. Sorry everyone, I shouldn't have got emotional. I should probably have had some breakfast but I've been run of my feet...

You mean, listen to the voice of the people who could be interested in buying your product. As above, wow. Thing is, you may have done a smart move here, get a reputable custom fx company to design your pedal, get it into a position where it can be manufactured in bulk, put your branding on it... and just shift boxes. Thats the beginnings of a good business model. Coming onto a platform an alienating your customers, not so much.

You doubt the data Dave? Go visit a COVID ward, speak to doctors and nurses who do the caring and put their lives at risk every day, and explain to them that it’s Ok, you’re in a band and you need to rehearse. And go to the gym for whatever reason. But the supermarkets are at mostly at fault, cos while you need to play and exercise, people don’t need food.

Hey @alexclaber looks like you’ve had a stinker of a day but you’ve inspired a new thread idea. I was thinking about a thread where people post openly and honestly about times they had a really bad day and said/did something which in hindsight appears a bit misguided. I dunno maybe you slapped the missus, slept with a work colleague or built a bass effect pedal and didn’t put words on it? Going by some posts on this thread there appears to be loads of folk who love to have their say and I’m confident they’ll all get the ball rolling with some proper cathartic sharing, no holes barred so we can endow some righteous outrage/judgement at their antics! I’ve got a few great symbols lined up to reply to the ones I really like! ❤️ 🐀 🔔🔚 🎽aka👰🥊

Maybe the pedal will have an information sheet/manual explaining the knobs/symbols and what they do so people have the option to not read it before coming online to whinge about it.

To me, this is a 250-quid fuzz box - so I'm definitely not the target market. However, I can see the business logic behind the move and I'm sure Alex knows what his customers want. This is a tough time to launch a new music product and I wish him well with it.

Yes, I can't believe I forgot to put that on there! Would it be useful to know where the jacks are so you can see how well they nest with other side-jack pedals?

Despite being a short-scale-only player, I've only just found this topic. Thanks to all those who've posted some very interesting pic's so far. I'll add a few of my own when I get a minute. THIS TRULY IS THE GOLDEN AGE OF SHORT-SCALE BASSES!

For a large proportion of players, amateur or professional, your instrument(s) of choice are an extension of your personality. For introvert, extravert, narcissist or whatever that's going to drive your choice even beyond budget as even those with little to spend can find a bargain used instrument that's at least close to their aspirations. Marketing things as 'pro' is simply that, marketing. I have a 'pro-user' adjustable spanner here, but it's pretty cheap. If I worked in a garage I'd probably kit myself out with Snap-On tools, but I know that Halfords kit is likely to be just as good (and has a lifetime guarantee - the one time I split a socket they replaced it no questions asked). Plus another factor. I've got a fair few basses, one of them is a rare Fender (a Performer) and is at least as good as any bass I've played and is so easy to play with its skinny neck my playing goes up two notches just by picking it up. But it really only works for me when I'm standing up so it's never had the use of my other basses. Both times I'be been recording a demo in a 'proper' studio the sound engineers told me to use my battered Hohner B2 in preference to the Performer because it sounded better (one said it was one of the best sounding basses they ever heard, but this was a local studio in Coventry not Abbey Road...) OTOH I realise my flea bass is outstanding, I play it nearly every day. I change basses from time to time for the variety but I usually have two handy, and it's always one of them. This is simply because it's so comfortable (to me) and gives great range of sounds. What I'm trying to say is that instrument choice is intensely personal and I imagine being a pro just gives you the opportunity to be more discriminating and gives you a certain licence to use what you want, not what you are expected to use. The roads of music are littered with 'Signature' models that the signee quietly puts aside after a tour or so...

If you were referring to me saying "musicians" as being a veiled insult, I didn't say bassists because it's aimed at guitarists too, and other instrumentalists. Again, apologies if you were insulted by that, it was not meant to be an insult. We're all musicians, even the drummers! 😉

Just some further feedback - again, just my opinion. Im intrigued by the inclusion of knob choices. Standardise them. If people want to customise them, let them do it at their cost. Build a brand on uniformity - not so your product looks like it's been built from random parts bins. Im taking this is an off the shelf product that you want to just shift in boxes? Why add the complication?

Thank you for your apology Alex, I know exactly where you're coming from. Life is tricky indeed.

We've been working intensely on the bass amp since 2017. It's not far from being finished but right now there isn't the demand for loud live music equipment to finance bringing it to full production and releasing it.

ive just re-read this thread and nearly every post has some sort of positive coment and or what i would consider constructive feedback. for a manufacturer of a new pedal to come on a forum thread and alienate everybody that commented is really bad form Alex.

Comparing this thread to the thread on talkbass with the same title is why I hardly come on here.

Good post, although I would have thought that BF have sufficient brand loyalty now to not have needed to produce a game-changing amp, just a good amp (which I guess is what many amp manufacturers do in reverse, game-changing amps, standard cabs)? I suspect a reliable and powerful unit styled to match their cabs would sell on brand power and aesthetics alone?

I agree and it's even more crowded for instruments which have greater reliance on precision for quality any way. The margins on pedals are better than amps once the R&D is done, the cost of parts is peanuts when purchased in bulk and the upfront capital investment in tooling etc. is lower. Anyone can start a pedal business if they have the knowledge. For example Land Devices started with one pedal in 2017, a tribute to an obscure fuzz pedal called the Interfax Harmonic Perculator which sparked the interest of people behind Premier Guitar and Reverb. They featured it and pretty soon the $500 investment in parts for the initial run of 20-40 pedals snowballed into a fully fledged production line. For someone who is tone hunting, pedals are way more accessible than amps, players are more inclined to buy in greater volume so there's less risk to some degree. If I was Alex, I'd be thinking about what customers would most likely use with the cabs. Amps seem like a natural choice but they'd have to be game changing in the same way as the cabs were game changing. Some amp companies offer voicing options, some offer features you'll probably never need, others go down the vintage tribute route, yet more target price points. I'm not sure there's much to do there unless there's a shift in technology or construction. But hell, I wouldn't mind a reasonably priced valve amp with tuner, parallel and serial effect loops, 400w/50w power scaling, easy to replace parts and self biasing to reduce reliance on an amp technician for maintenance. That's been missed in the bass market so far but guitarists have many of those features already.

I can't see it being allowed in T2 and T3. Doesn't make sense with the rest of the restrictions. And TBH it is looking more promising that we might get a working vaccine in the next 6 months. I'd be waiting. I just hope the first round of people who get it do it properly. Get the dose, keep isolating / distancing for the 2-3 week period for antibodies to develop, 2nd shot etc. Actually follow the instructions. Then maybe - just maybe we might have a good summer next year.

just change the title of this thread. easier

I haven't played a Fallout specifically, but I've owned both USA and Tribute G&Ls and specific 'custom' features such as finishes aside, I struggled to tell the difference between them.

I quite like the general sound of the bass but as others have said the hiss and gain control needs sorting. Other than that it's probably a good bass for the price. I'd need to play one to confirm that though. 😁 The logo isn't the worst I've seen but could be better. I wonder what the actual legal standpoint is of building the bass in China and then finishing it off (eg: add the original logo) in another country where you can use the trademark? After all the bass came in a Sadowsky branded gig bag and branded box? 🤔

The pedal looks very good, I would love to see an FX loop in it which would separate the clean from those two other channels. I would use a X-over between them. The clean channel looks just like I would love to have one: a simple and one very effective filter. (Offtopic: If BF will make an amp, it probably has Gain - 3/4/5 knob EQ - Vol. But hopefully not. I would love to see something like an old Quad type of EQ with tilt and another knob that selects the tilt freq, like Gain - Tilt - Freq - Vol. It certainly would be an old design but fresh compared to those basic ones I described earlier. Offtopic ends, back to the CVs and cover letters and so on.)

I will also check back through my comms with you Alex and take some time later to recount how badly you dealt with a previous complaint from me, which I decided to to make public then but now will.

Surely it's better to have critical feedback than just having smoke blown up your a$$?

I think my problem with this is they don't build pedals. So customer feedback, continuous improvement and product development, r and d etc..... All feels mis placed. An amp has always made sense to me. Maximise the synergy with their cabs. There's Lots of established, niche and quality pedal builders out there.... what is effectively an outsourced/ White label product via third party just feels it missed the point of the barefaced brand to me. Not meaning to sound too critical, I guess just disappointed in the direction. ✌️

Can't help feeling a strong sense of disappointment that their first venture away from cabs is this? Guess they have their reasons