mcnach

[quote name='Meddle' timestamp='1482943323' post='3203666'] [...] the Chinese instruments are built to deceive. I think the key difference is that the Japanese manufacturers were trying to score sales by producing a good quality product, whereas the Chinese builders on Aliexpress are deceiving the buyer and hoping to win sales by simply offering a Gibson Les Paul for sub-Epiphone money. You are buying into a scam, ultimately. [/quote] It depends. Some instruments attempt to look like Fender, Gibson etc instruments. I don't think they try to deceive the customer. The customer knows full well what they're buying: a counterfeit, of lower quality, which may look the part. I'm not a fan of that kind of business. Some builders offer you options that just are not available in bona fide instruments, or are willing to build something that does not resemble another manufacturer's instrument. They're generally build cheaply, but again, the buyer has a good idea of what they're buying. There may be someone who thinks their left-handed Les Paul in a completely unseen before colour is a real Les Paul despite costing only $200... but that's not going to be the average customer and that person is simply deceiving himself. A while ago I bought a Sue Ryder Precision. I did not expect it to be as good as a Fender, for example, and it wasn't. But it's an instrument that with some minor attention works well and I still use it. I turned it into a fretless and it's an instrument that does its job well. Sue Ryder did not attempt to deceive anybody, and the headstock shape and name reflected that. You can get the same sort of treatment from many builders in Aliexpress. Counterfeiting is not what they're about. They're about sales and will sell anything you want if they can make it... You want a cheap custom spec bass... you can certainly order that. [quote name='Meddle' timestamp='1482943323' post='3203666'] Chinese luthiers can, and will, produce brilliant faultless instruments, but that is a different market to Aliexpress.[/quote] Not at $200, of course not. It would be ridiculous to expect that. Some sellers do give indication that they can, if asked, built something of quality. They don't charge $200 for those, 'though. I think the problem is too many people have been blinded by greed and somehow convinced themselves that they can get a $2000 worth of instrument at $200 because it's China, and it just doesn't work that way. [quote name='Meddle' timestamp='1482943323' post='3203666'] From what I've read from people who have gone to the effort of commissioning Chinese-built products, you basically have to watch them like hawks and communicate clearly about every aspect of the build you want included. They may try and swap out components with inferior equivalents, or simply install the pickups in the wrong place or finish in the wrong colour.[/quote] Having dealt with Chinese businesses at my job, I'm very aware of communication issues. It can be a real nightmare. It pays to write concise and clear instructions... but even then misunderstandings do arise, it's true, ha! Still, they are not stupid and they want you to be happy so that you give them your money. They will work with you, you just need to remain focused, feed information in bite size chunks, and remain polite. Trying to give you lower spec components than specified? There are crooks in every country. If I commissioned a serious instrument I would have researched the builder and I'd be satisfied they are genuine. If you commission a budget instrument, there are no such issues, yes, of course you will get cheap components. You can see on eBay pretty much what kind of components you'll get. They will work. But if you buy a budget instrument with view to upgrade and modify it, that fits the bill perfectly. Wrong colour or pickup in the wrong place? They don't get paid. Simple. The seller I'm dealing with asked me for colour examples, he saw them, and was happy they can get something close enough and his words were something like "I'll send you pictures after staining. If not happy, we will change it". Aliexpress does not release the funds to them until I receive the item and I confirm it's ok. [quote name='Meddle' timestamp='1482943323' post='3203666'] However there is no reason for you not to get a good instrument from China at the end of the day; it just simply isn't the same as getting a British luthier to build a custom bass at a fraction of the cost. [/quote] Absolutely. Nobody suggested otherwise. There's a reason why I have an active order with Maruszczyk right now and I didn't think of going to Aliexpress for that one: I wanted a *good* serious instrument on that one. I also paid quite a bit more (although I still think it's a steal, those guys make superb instruments). There are many reasons you may buy say a VM Squier bass. Usually you don't buy it because it's the best you can buy. You buy it because for whatever reason you don't want to spend more than X and you are happy with the quality of that instrument even if it's not the best. However the selection is limited. If all you want is a Jazz or a Precision and you like the available colours, you're in luck. What if you would like a budget instrument in another configuration, colour, whatever? Well, if you're one of these people who enjoy taking instruments apart and doing work on them, some sellers in Aliexpress may just give you that possibility. That's my approach, anyway. I could be wrong! Time will tell.

[quote name='blablas' timestamp='1482937630' post='3203624'] Something like this? Been there - done that. However I needed to do some work on it before it was a player. - Aligned the pickups to the strings, the bridge pu was moved over by 3 millimeters, the neck pu by 1 millimeter. - Due to the moving of the pickups I also had to move the pickguard. - Reshaped the nut, they just put on a right handed one so this needed to be seriously modified. - Gave the tuner bushings a few knocks on their head, they were mounted crooked. - The fingerboard had several less good looking and finished spots, re-finished these. - Crowned the frets where needed and polished them, they were level but rough finished in a lot spots. I just can't and won't cope with this reversed crap! - Done a full shielding of the controls cavity, there was none whatsoever. - Made a thumb rest. - Made a new truss rod cover. - Replaced the strap holders, what was on there was mounted with very thin and short screws, to leave those would have been waiting for an accident to happen. - Checked if all the screws and bolts were tightened and if they weren't tightened them (more often than not they were loose!). - Did a full and thorough setup. Rebuild diary can be found [url="http://theharleybentonclub.proboards.com/thread/669/lefty-rickenfaker-4005-aliexpress"]here[/url]. [/quote] very interesting read! and those truss rod covers are fantastic!!! well done!!! ah, I wish I had access to that kind of technology! Glad all the misaligned parts were easy to realign. My pickup will be routed onto the body, no pickguard, so no much room for misalignments there! Although it would be easy to create a pickguard for it afterwards if needed. Hey, I bought a Retrovibe that had its bridge pickup misaligned with a slightly enlarged pickup route, meaning that it fit nicely on one end and left an unsightly gap on the other. Fortunately it was easy to fix by modifying the pickguard so that it was a bit larger, and David from Retrovibe was happy to pay for it. It's the kind of work I am well prepared to do. It doesn't scare me... heh, in fact right now I am taking a rest before I tidy up my Matt Freeman Squier Precision... I had it converted to Jazz configuration, and now I just moved the neck pickup towards the bridge. I got a new pickguard done, and I've been chiselling away making room for the pickup where I want it. You can't leave tools near me when I'm not at work or gigging... I'll have to do something I had to laugh at the nut, 'though. Really? A right handed nut? It does show how little the person(s) making that guitar knew or cared. Do you remember what seller was that?

Mark bought my Seymour Duncan SMB4A pickup. Great communication, easy transaction, great guy to deal with.

[quote name='Sibob' timestamp='1482920518' post='3203480'] Mike Newell on here bought a Fodera copy from Ali Express and it was a heap of junk, so will be interesting to see how this pans out. It's a little difficult, as many people want to 'try a 5 string' (or whatever feature it is you're exploring), but understandably not spend a lot of money to do so. However, judging it on a £170 plank thrown together may not give you the best experience......so consider something else before giving up on 5s if this experience fails Si [/quote] You're right about the trying out something on a substandard example. Over the years I've experienced that at various levels! I do have experience with 5 strings 'though. My favourites were a USA MusicMan SUB5 and a Lakland 5502. I had others by Crafter, Squier, Peavey, G&L... They ranged from meh to pretty cool. The Lakland is probably the one bass I could use as my only bass, if I had to choose a 5-string. But I sold them all as I just don't use them and it's hard to bring yourself to use an instrument when you don't seem to find enough use in what it brings to the table, and miss what a couple of other very good 4-string basses give you. I haven't given up on 5 strings. I just haven't needed one enough, and I haven't found one that I like as much as my 4-strings. But I do like playing on one at times and I'd like to be comfortable enough on either. Years ago I went for an audition for a new starting band playing a funk/hip-hop mix... and it went ok but I was not their first choice. However, it turns out their first choice didn't work out, they had a couple of gigs coming up and no bass player. They called me to see if I was still interested and up for the challenge (first gig in 6 days). I said yes. We'd get in a couple of practices at the band leader's place and I'd bring my recorder to record everything (all original songs and nothing recorded, written out, nothing at all... in fact the songs were pretty much evolving and there was a degree of improvisation on the spot every time ). The guy says "don't bring anything, I have a very good acoustic bass and you should use that, keep the volume down in the flat...". In those days I had no transport and as he insisted so much about the acoustic bass and it was my first real experience with the band I decided to do as told. As I arrive he hands me this beautiful thing "here, this is for you". It was a 5-string fretless. I had barely played any fretless at that stage and I had never played a 5 string either. I sweated a lot For my second practice I brought a small combo and my Warwick Corvette, with 4 strings and nicely fitted frets But that ledt a mark and I wanted to be able to play any instrument reasonably well (well, reasonably well for my standard... I'm far from a being a pro). So I kind of miss having a 5-string bass whose sound and feel I like enough, but I'm not willing to spend several hundred in a great instrument. A squier quality instrument will do me just fine. Same with fretless. I've owned a few good ones... but you know which one I kept after selling all the others? You'll be horrified/amused. A Sue Ryder Precision. Yup! I removed the frets and had the fingerboard planed nicely by a luthier I knew in Edinburgh. Put a decent pickup on it and nylon tapewound strings. It is not the best fretless bass, I guarantee you that But it's nice enough to play and it makes the right noises for my purpose. Some people have more refined tastes but I have a couple of lowly Squier basses that work very well and I'm happy to use. That's kind of the point I'm aiming to reach with this 'experiment'. It's never going to be the bass to kill all basses, but it may just be ok for me to use and have around for not much money. A bass that's going to be a little unique, and that's also exciting. And if that fails, it looks like I'd have bought a wall decoration for £160

[quote name='TheGreek' timestamp='1482868890' post='3203231'] I'm now watching this thread too. Remember back in the 70s when "Made in Japan" meant "junk"? We now know that it wasn't true. It'll be interesting to see how long it takes for the Chinese to get QC under control. I reckon that for £150, even if you only get the bare bones, spending another £50 or so to get it set up to your liking, all the rough woodworking put right and for it to be "refined" might still make it VFM. Hoping it works out for you (and the rest of us afterwards). [/quote] Thank you, I hope so too! That's exactly my thinking/hope. It;s not going to be an amazing instrument, but I'd be more than happy with a VM Squier if they came in the configuration I want. I'm hoping I can turn it into something close to the VM series quality or thereabouts.

[quote name='miles'tone' timestamp='1482794259' post='3202803'] Yes I've used them at practice but not at a gig of my own I might add. They worked brilliantly for me. I could hear everything fine. Very loud guitars and drums.. And me! Much higher quality experience than any of the "rubber Christmas tree" plugs I've been through which usually do cut alot of top end and give a swampy tone to everything I've found. [/quote] Interesting. I don't see how it could work so well, from the description and graphs... but it clearly works for some! One of the guitarists in my band bought them recently and he really likes them. What I don't like is that I feel he turns himself in his monitor louder than he used to, more shrill... which maybe is a reflection of the decrease in high mids/treble... but I can deal with it, and as long as his tone doesn't become more bassy, then it's actually better for me. I was not very happy with the "xmas tree" ones. I used them because I wanted protection but the sound was not great. I am actually waiting on ACS Pro17 custom plugs. Let's see how those go. I'd like to try the metal ones despite my scepticism (I've been wrong once or twice in my life before ) but they're a bit pricey for an experiment, so I'll definitely wait to see what the ACS ones are like.

[quote name='Downdown' timestamp='1482797300' post='3202820'] Is the headline 'vinyl outsells digital downloads' really so surprising in these days of music streaming? Does a spotify subscription, for example, count towards the 'digital downloads' number? Might just be that few and fewer people are actually buying music in any 'collectable' format. Fighting over the dregs of a market doesn't seem like great business to me. [/quote] I think you hit it in the head. People like me still buy the odd CD, but mostly buy digital format music, because I like to own the file and not depend on connection to a service. But I am increasingly finding I am a little 'old-fashioned' among my peers (generally a bit younger than me, I guess because I'm immature so I fit there better ). Then, my girlfriend (who is one notch) never buys any music anymore, and relies on Spotify and some other service entirely. Her friends are the same. I think streaming is not only attractive because it allows you to access almost anything almost anywhere, but because it's interactive and can suggest new music based on what you are generally playing. That leads to discovering new music. It's something I like a lot and even I are started to feel I want to start streaming (as well as buying)... There's been quite a few bands that my gf is playing and I go "how did you find that?" and the reply is "oh, Spotify suggested it". I thought I was enough of a dinosaur when I kept buying CDs (I mostly stopped now, too much space and I rarely use a CD player), but with all the streaming stuff I feel like a grandpa. THEN, the new thing becomes vinyl? Give me a break!

[quote name='Grahambythesea' timestamp='1482751689' post='3202485'] Like you I am sorely tempted by the Aliexpress offers, I am not even phased by the "fakes". Hadn't seen that 5 string Jazz with MMs , looks good but will it play good? Sometimes you just have to take a risk, don't you. Good luck, I may be following your lead sometime soon. [/quote] Yeah, the idea of the fakes just seems silly to me. Just about any bass out there has an affordable lookalike bonafide version, of known quality, if that's what you want. Ok, not if you want an R-bass (I love the name Chickenfaker ) or some boutique high end basses... I just like the idea of a cheap bass that can meet your criteria, if those criteria are not easily found already in other 'normal' brands. It's a risk, but it's a win-win. If it works out, awesome. If it doesn't... hopefully it looks good enough for decoration and a few BC members get to feel smug

Interesting products!

[quote name='gareth' timestamp='1482698215' post='3202265'] But it is not a fender, it's an imposter , a poser, a fake It's got to be fender, end of [/quote] !!!

[quote name='Skybone' timestamp='1481146260' post='3190105'] EHX Small Stone [/quote] same here, it is simple but it sounds very good. The Soundblox Manta has some cool phasers too, but for phaser I prefer the EHX.

[quote name='bubinga5' timestamp='1482629349' post='3202052'] Totally unrelated to bass but I bought some carbon Race face Mountain Bike handle bars from AlIexpress. They have gone through huge amounts of punishment for 4 months. The same bars from the UK are £170. These carbon bars and they are carbon because they weigh the same as the real thing and i took them to a bike tech to veryfy they we're carbon. I stagger to say this. £15 posted to the UK. Work that one out. ??? [/quote] I'd be cautious with something like that, to be honest. It may be the right material but... why so cheap? I'd put that uncomfortably close to the 'too good to be true' category. I'd be worried that it's an item that failed QC and has some small structural defect which some unscrupulous seller decided to sell anyway. A mountain bike handle bar is something where you're sometimes going to be resting a lot of your weight on, and if it snaps under stress you could get badly injured. With a bass, only my self-esteem could be hurt if say a truss rod snaps in the middle of a gig Is there a way you can have the handlebar more thoroughly tested? I don't want you to get hurt, you post lots of cool youtube links on BC Having said that, a friend of mine started a business importing bikes and bike parts from a factory in China years ago. He dealt directly with the factory and he was amazed at how cheap (for UK standards) they could make quality stuff. He is no longer involved in that business, otherwise I'd offer to put in in touch.

[quote name='Rikki_Sixx' timestamp='1482623022' post='3202029'] Was this a YouTube account by the name of Sonicwingnut? If so I saw the same videos, it's amazing how much an Aliexpress guitar can be turned around with a bit of imagination and elbow grease! I'm looking forward to seeing what you get, what state it's in and how you improve it! [/quote] I don't remember the account. It was a Telecaster with bound body, cherry sunburst I think, and a very figured grain pretty top. There were things like the control plate being slightly slanted and the bridge also being slightly at an angle, the pickguard not cut flush to the bridge plate, rough plastic nut... stuff like that. There was one thing that was nasty 'though... the neck was correctly oriented, but the screws were all at amazingly weird angles and one of them came off the neck very close to the edge... very very very sloppy... Fixable if desired (the guy claimed the neck was solid in place) but it shows you how careful (or not) they were when screwing it together. The thing is saying 'aliexpress' means little. There are sellers with patchy feedback, and sellers with great feedback, some have been operating for under a year, some for 2 or more years... I don't believe they are all equal. We will see... I still don't know what to put as a logo, 'though. I don't want to leave the headstock blank, and I most definitely don't want a "Fender" logo or anything like that. I was toying with the idea of making a logo based on the letters AE (for aliexpress) and/or including a hint to the seller's shop name... but I have not made up my mind yet.

[quote name='miles'tone' timestamp='1482599464' post='3201781'] Has nobody heard about the "Isolates" revolution? They are bloody amazing! They isolate your ear drums completely so you "hear" everything through your ears bone (sounds weird, I know!) I tested my new set for the first time at a Pixies gig (holy Paz! 😍) two weeks ago. I was right at the front at the barrier and stayed there all night. I got the most perfect mix of the band with no ringing whatsoever. I could even hear people talking. Very strange at first but after 10 mins it felt normal. The Isolates come in Aluminium and Titanium, I went for the Aluminium ones as they are cheaper. They worked perfectly anyway. Check em out. Such a simple idea but a TOTAL gamechanger! I was turned on to them by my best friend who's band mates now too all have a set each. I've been through every type of earplugs short of shelling out for a custom made set. These Isolates are the sh!t. Seriously. Check them out people, you owe it to your ears! [url="https://flareaudio.com/products/earfoams/isolate/"]https://flareaudio.c...rfoams/isolate/[/url] [/quote] How are they different from sticking your fingers in your ears? I had a look at their response curves and they seem to cut higher frequencies (above 1KHz, which is not terribly high) more... hmmmm. Have you tried them at a gig (onstage) and/or band practice yet?

[quote name='Oopsdabassist' timestamp='1482613491' post='3201955'] Myself and my nephew have been talked into playing, amongst others, 'rappers delight' for family xmas karaoke, lovely bassline and very hypnotic, and not my usual fare, so fun to play something different. [/quote] Rappers delight = Good times by Chic. Chic has a lot of tasty basslines in their repertoire, it took me a while to realise just how good they were!

[quote name='Beer of the Bass' timestamp='1482604013' post='3201842'] Ah, I guess it's harder to change than a bass drum skin! I hope their time estimates aren't messed up too much by Chinese New Year. I've ordered something from China in January before, and it seems like everyone downs tools for a week then the post is backlogged after they start up again. [/quote] I'm not too bothered about the time of arrival, to be honest. Just like with the Maruszczyk I have in order, I do my best to forget about them, and when the arrive they arrive... It's like a Christmas you didn't expect, although you pay for your own presents

[quote name='Beer of the Bass' timestamp='1482587449' post='3201626'] Is it getting the Sea Bass Kid logo on the headstock, by any chance? [/quote] Ha! No, I still haven't decided what I'll put. I did put the SBK on the red Maruszczyk and I regretted it. Just as I got the bass I went through a phase being annoyed at the band and I nearly quit. No more band logos

[quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1482506691' post='3201160'] Ha... truth is, if you're a tinkerer, it sounds like you'll have a lot of fun with it regardless of the outcome. There are worse ways to spend your time and money :-) [/quote] Exactly... I get to have fun on NYE playing to nice crowds, and go home with a new decorative bass. What's not to like? I may even be able to play it, and the time I spend setting it up it's time I'm not out there on the streets getting into who knows what kind of mischief

[quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1482504444' post='3201135'] I'm intrigued too... YouTube is full of horror stories, so best of luck! [/quote] I know, I don't expect much but also some successful ones. I think you just have to be realistic about what to expect. The reviews from people ordering that very bass model are reasonable. Some minor finish flaws here and there, sharp frets... usual stuff on that price bracket. I'm not saying this could be an alternative to Maruszczyk but this is the difference between not bothering with a 5-string or having one around. I've owned nice 5-string basses... an EBMM SUB5 and a Lakland 5502 were the best, although the G&L L2500 was nearly as nice... but they all went as I just don't *need* one. But occasionally I would like to have one around, and if I had one, I'd want it with an MM pickup type at the right place. So let's have a go. I might end up enjoying the 5-string world this time around and () end up emailing Adrian for my birthday next year again I watched a video of a guy with a Telecaster from aliexpress and there were many things he didn't like... but mostly they were cosmetic issues. If for £160 I get something that has most parts and a truss rod that works etc, I'll count it as a success. I enjoy tinkering, and I am counting on a serious set up job, and possibly redoing/replacing electronics, but I have all parts in my spares drawer... we will see. Worst case scenario: it goes on the wall I'll share the result here, so you can laugh at me and enjoy the experience without wasting your money as I'd have done it for you. I'm that nice.

[quote name='ras52' timestamp='1482504583' post='3201136'] No need to go to 4/4 when 5/4 is so straightforward... [media]http://youtu.be/RK_j2LE07G0[/media] [/quote] what the...

[quote name='Lozz196' timestamp='1482501565' post='3201110'] It`s called a Sansamp [/quote] ugh... but seriously, ugh

[quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1482436153' post='3200637'] It's a Coke / Diet Coke thing. One day you accidentally buy full fat Coke, and MY GOD it's nice. [/quote] then you discover Coke Zero and never go full-fat again... we need a Coke Zero amplifier...

I have always viewed aliexpress as a haven for counterfeit instruments, and something that doesn't interest me. I only recently learnt that it's just a huge sellers market and you can buy legit stuff there too. My gf has bought a few small items of clothing and decorating and it's no different from buying on eBay, really... she had to complain twice, once because she was sent the wrong item by mistake and another because it was low quality. Both times she was refunded fast and asked to just keep it. Like eBay, it pays to look at the feedback score and how long a store has been trading. So as I checked something for her, I noticed lots of bass pictures (damn cookies, they know ME!). And I got curious. There's a few interesting looking instruments there... low prices... quality questionable, but in many places the pics are detailed enough and I'd say 'honest': you can see how the pickup routing is not perfect, how the finish is fantastic, how veneers are applied to tops and the edges are not terribly tidy... which helps me imagine what sort of instrument they may be. The sort that could be pretty cool if you are able and willing to spend a little time tidying it up after it gets into your hands. So far, no particular reason to be terribly attracted to the instruments there, except they offer some interesting combinations of features. And here's where I noticed "we can customise". A few of these sellers claim to either run their own manufacturing or work closely with a manufacturing plant, and that they can modify things to accommodate a buyer. So... here's the experiment. A few days ago we were offered two gigs next weekend, covering NYE, and earning us some welcome and unexpected cash, as initially we had a greed not to play NYE this year. I decided to use part of my fee towards a 5-string bass from a seller that looks good on paper, whom I approached and has been pretty economic with his words but addressing all my points. Just efficient communication, a bit like Adrian Maruszczyk Not that I expect the same quality, not at all! But I sort of want a cheap 5 string to explore 5stringness again. So... a bass caught my eye. It was a Jazz shape. Maple neck and board with block markers, ash body with a figured maple veneer top in natural finish, two big MM humbuckers, no pickguard, 3-band active. So I approached them asking whether they'd make one without the fender logo (I would supply something else myself), just one pickup positioned where I want it, no neck markers, body tinted purple (I supplied a picture as example)... and they said yes, just supply the logo as PDF, and they'll show me examples of the colour and they'll send me a picture when it's done... and if I don't like it, they'll do it again. I was warned it would take probably a month (only!?) and cost the princely sum of around £160-170 all included (price is in USD). So why not? He said the weight is typically around 4Kg, which is not bad for a 5 string. I then enquired about maybe using a Precision shape instead, which I find more comfy and being smaller will also likely be a bit lighter. The reply was "yes, I can make that". So I'll prepare a sheet with all the specs and a mock picture to illustrate all the key points and dimensions, get some kind of logo sorted... and I'll place the order sometime over the next week or so. I figured it was worth a punt to get a cheap instrument that will l be a bit different from what's around. Of course... it may prove to me a complete waste of money but if it's useless I'll hang it as decoration and then get a white Squier VM precision and modify that one with a MM pickup and a new pickguard. The 'base' bass looked like this on their site: Watch this space if you're curious about aliexpress... and sometime in February I should receive this, and a 4-string custom Maruszczyk as well... [u][b]EDIT 30th Dec' 2016:[/b][/u] post #36, decal designed

[quote name='obi 2 kenobi' timestamp='1482491642' post='3200981'] am I in an elevator ? [/quote]