LukeFRC

L1000 - one of the best basses ever designed - fact!

[quote name='The Dark Lord' timestamp='1344601735' post='1766935'] Yeah, lots of people make copies of Fender basses. They're obviously just as good, if not better than real Fenders. For example, I once had a girlfriend who looked just like Kylie Minogue - so she was obviously as good, or maybe even better. No .... wait .... [/quote] her sister?

Yourself (including physical mental health) Family Friends and social health Uni/work (at times this may move up one in intense times) Fun things like music Things you have to do like music ... ... what other people think of me That would be my priority. I'm currently writing up my masters dissertation. Really put effort into that and give up other stuff like the bands- it's not worth you suffering in either studies or health because you don't want to upset some band mates. Keep cycling (I hear growing sideburns helps too) cos it sounds fun and help you. focus on what matters- which at this stage is your writing.... talking of which- I'm turning basschat off now and getting back to my own!

do you think that if you are working with stuff that you will be shipped to scotland to do, and to the USA for training then you might be working on stuff a bit more complex than a passive bass volume and tone? In my mind if you are doing the electronics for Trident or something you use the best you can. Lets consider something more complex than a passive bass.... how about an amp? Now lets imagine you are building something that has to last for years, using high voltages and in reasonably rough handling conditions. Ofcourse the tolerances of the components matter, and the build construction and the transformer, and the quality of the pots you are using. My amp (Tecamp) is boutique enough I know that they will have used decent parts in it (lets not get into mass produced amps and their quality/profit decisions ) say I am buying a bass, or getting one made for me- maybe from that great builder Osprey Guitars- I want decent parts and probably I will spec CTS or similar mid level pots (lets remember they aren't actually high end here) simply as they have a good rep, and no doubt Ou7shined has a stash of them anyway. And I am sure that the CTS would be more reliable, smoother and more consistent than some cheaper made parts. What I have trouble accepting- and what no one has given any kind of explanation for is this: How can a passive circuit with a 250k ohms resistor sound different to a passive circuit with a different 250k ohms resistor (- at the tiny currents we would expect in a guitar loom. ) yes I get it's in the signal chain, and in mechanical design one can be better than another but electronically and audibility? Interestingly the input stage on the amp, or even the capacitance of the cable will make far bigger difference to sound than the pots- but none ever seems to discuss amps input stages! I have my warwick set up wired to jack at the mo while I save up for a new pre.... and last week it sounded awful- turns out the resonance of the old cable I was using, the resonance of the bass the input stage of my amp and my cab all added together didn't sound nice. Different cable and it was fine (and the -10 stage on the amp also sorted it too) anyway

ahh... it sounds like you have that problem it happens to us all at one time or another.... jazz- but no rear - maybe try something else there... maybe... the answer dear Mattbass97 is a precision!

[quote name='Johnston' timestamp='1344545487' post='1766358'] I will take their word over it [/quote] which is great, but what's the scientific explanation in this example? can you ask them- audio difference between makes of identically specced variable resistors.

[quote name='Johnston' timestamp='1344540823' post='1766287'] I'm watching it now. so far i actually agree with a lot of it. Just likethe way I say that Lindy Fralins claim that Parafin wax is better than candle wax is only better because it's cheaper but they aren't going to say that. But that doesn't take away from when you change a signal path it can affect the signal. Just because in some cases people hear what they want to hear or expect the hear doesn't mean it is always so. [/quote] No but it does mean we have to take it into consideration. [quote name='Johnston' timestamp='1344540823' post='1766287'] For instance I was expecting to love the tone of the Trace Elliot bought. Going on the video I should hear less mud than my 15" Fender combo. Except I don't I actually don't like the TE.[/quote] A lot of people don't like Trace Gear. but that irrelevant [quote name='Johnston' timestamp='1344540823' post='1766287'] In the bass I swapped the Pups out of I was expecting little or indeed no change but I hear a definite change. All EQ flat on the amp BTW.[/quote] did you swap the pups or the pots? or both? of course you'll hear a difference with pups, no one is debating that. [quote name='Johnston' timestamp='1344540823' post='1766287'] None of this takes away from the fact the cheap components are cheap and not as reliable as the better stuff. This stuff is sitting directly in the signal path. It's not like a power cord that is no where near the actual signal path. Or a CD demagnitiser . This is stuff directly in between the pick up and the speaker . Saying a resistor in the middle of all that won't affect it is like saying the magnet choice or wire in the pick up means nothing.[/quote] right from the start no one has doubted that a better made pot will be mechanically better. I bet a CTS pot will be working in 20 years when the cheaper ones have given up the ghost, I expect them to be smoother and more accurate on the taper. No one doubts that! There are two things here- a pickup - which everyone knows has so many variables in construction and magnetic behaviour and electronic behaviour. So pickups are different. But a resistor is a passive component. A circuit with a resistor in it will more or less act the same regardless of the type of resistor PROVIDING the value is the same. So if I have a box of metal film resistors from maplin or somewhere, made by different people even and all of the same value (within the tolerances) then if I put one of them in the signal path of my pickups.. then they all should sound the same. Equally a potentiometer is no different than a non-vairable resistor and should in theory sound the same. It it doesn't- why doesn't it? [quote name='Johnston' timestamp='1344540823' post='1766287'] Would any one say that the magnet in the pick up has no affect, because at the end of the day they are all magnets just like all pots are just pots.[/quote] a better analogy would be jack sockets. They carry the signal path, and mechanically some are way better than others.... but they should all sound the same. [quote name='Johnston' timestamp='1344540823' post='1766287'] Or another thing. How come a guitar sounds different if there is no tone pot than when the tone pot is full open? Surely if it's full open and no resistance it shouldn't affect things? [/quote] I thought fully open was the stated resistance- so a open one is going to give 250k ohms or whatever up to full shut which is infinite resistance. Or at least that's how I thought it worked. Interesting sideline.... In amps some people favour carbon comp resistors over metal film as they are more irregular and as the voltage can effect the resistance of them causing distortions. thats my little resistor based thing I remember from making stuff.

[quote name='Stacker' timestamp='1344538515' post='1766245'] Gentlemen!! I said I wouldn't post again on this contentious topic but aren't we forgetting something? Our EARS! They are enough: they are what makes us choose between a Rick, a Fender Jazz, a Precision or an Alembic. And what we choose to shove them through, pedal-wise, rack-wise, amp-wise. You like what you hear and you can tell everyone else to go to Hell! [/quote] did you watch the vid ou7shined linked to?

caitlinbread (sp?) SFT is also nice wee pedal.

did you mean to buy the streamliner? Sansamp DI pedal thingy for a Ampeg type tone?

someone stuck a Musicman sub bass on gumtree for £200 today. Just throw that into the mix

[quote name='Johnston' timestamp='1344528904' post='1766074'] No one has said you have to use a certain pot value. But if the pot value alters the sound of the instrument then swapping pots like for like when one is closer to the intended value will make a difference. so swapping by pot that reads 634k for one that reads 493K will likely give an audible change. Even though they both say 500K Ergo swapping cheap pots out for better ones can alter the tone. Add in cheap sh*t wire with a higher resistance than good quality stuff and no one say that all wire has the same resistance because it hasn't. Oh and I have too much of a conscience for law [/quote] Of course half of this only matters on passive basses.....

[quote name='Ou7shined' timestamp='1344528522' post='1766059'] Wow and even at that price still no mention of how special the tone is. [/quote] mate. if you have to ask you obviously don't *know* do you. tut tut

[quote name='Ou7shined' timestamp='1344528036' post='1766040'] The reason we use 250k or 500k pots is because those are the pots which are readily available that are "close enough" for the job. It would be a scary universe indeed if guitars ONLY worked with these exact value pots. It could be that your specific bass would sound best with a 315k pot but try finding a decent supply of them. A quality pot will have a better chance of being closer to it's intended rating that says a cheaper job with a wider tolerance would, although it would be very foolish indeed to write off all cheap ones as not being be accurate as with modern production techniques this gap is closing, but even if a cheap one is as improbably far out as 25% it could still be in an acceptable range for your instrument. Just because it's traditional to use a 250k it doesn't mean that you need 0-250 per se. [/quote] my Yamaha SG uses 300k for the tone pots.... Warwick told me I need a 220k MN blend pot.... (into a 500k vol) really there going to be much difference between 220k and 250k?

[quote name='bremen' timestamp='1344523695' post='1765938'] You've tried cts pots in your Warwick? [/quote] no. the MEC ones are diddy, and green and therefore better! look at these... if we buy more than 4 we get a discount! http://www.banzaimusic.com/Alessandro-SS-250k-log-Guitar-Pot.html

Guys dont want to excite anyone, but my warwick's pots cost 3 times a cts pot and sound 3 times as good.

Warning: I can't spell. The capacatance value of pots is small enough to ignore right?

[quote name='RichZbaraski' timestamp='1344511539' post='1765622'] No, but that is a very similar bass! This one is a very dark finish. I remember seeing that one on the bay. Hmmmm, my instinct says no. So perhaps i'll leave it! [/quote] but the early fenders were supposed to be good. For doing up to sell it'd not worth it maybe, but as a good bass to... you know, play... maybe? Let me put it this way, if it were my family I would be going around for a play and possibly getting a great bass.

[quote name='RichZbaraski' timestamp='1344464499' post='1765145'] So, I may have the opportunity to buy a 1963 Fender Jazz bass for £800! Crazy right?! Reason is, is that it really needs a refinish and the markings on the neck have been sanded off swell as the logo (ugly red varnish refinish) though the markings are still on the neck plate and majority of the hardware is original. My question is, refinished in OLY white with a matching headstock, how much do think this will be worth? I've seen a unoriginal refinished 63 jazz bass go for around £2,750 but I can't be sure Sorry if this is violating any rules! rich [/quote] sorry for being an idiot... but why does it matter what it will be worth? You will never be able to prove more than hearsay what it is or isn't- it may be a fender- it may not be. So that given- what matters is what the thing is like to play, is it a amazing bass? is it worth 800 or more even now? If it is then why not get it and get something special at a good price. But it would be fraudulent to buy, refinish and sell as an original and you don't have a clue- so the question is- if I got this, and refinished it would Bass + refinish < sale price if I wanted to move it on? For info there was a jazz that a guy sold on here last year that he sold as a bitsa with possibly some old fender parts on it. Dead honest, and it looked like it possibly was real old parts- but again couldn't prove more than he had a good jazz bass. I think it went for £550 or so

[quote name='gjones' timestamp='1344463698' post='1765126'] Very true. Why spend £150 on a set of Lindy Fralins when you could have a secondhand set of pickups from an Squier affinity for £15. If subtle upgrades to the quality of a pickup's component parts can make a big difference to their sound quality, why can't the same improvement be found when you upgrade your electronics? After all a pickup is just wire and some magnets. [/quote] because there are many different variables in the construction of that pickup that affect it's working. A pot is a variable resistor, and while one can be smoother in it's sweep, something giving 250k ohm resistance should sound the same as something else giving 250k ohm resistance.

[quote name='Ou7shined' timestamp='1344460571' post='1765052'] No that's slightly facetious. But continuing the analogy, when we are speaking about the musical response of pots you might as well be saying to your tyre guy "don't get the air for your tyres here, it's free. The garage round the corner charges 20p air... it's bound to be better". [/quote] Not wanting to knock the stuff KiOgon does.... given how soldering iron resistant a lot of folk are on here... I can believe a well made set of components could be better than an idiot made set..... I am more intreaged by all the "CTS pots changed my tone" thing... would be fascinating to actually test... I guess there could be intolerances to the pot track? or something inducing additional capacitance?

[quote name='warwickhunt' timestamp='1344436625' post='1764465'] Sorry but I have to disagree for the very reasons that you think that they are great! I agree with all of the statements that a Wal can sound great BUT having owned one many years ago (and having one in the house now on loan), I have to say that they infuriate me with their ability to allow 'me' to screw the tone up! I found that when I owned mine that if I gave it just a bit of a tweak mid song/gig it had the potential to start to sound pants and I'd then spend the rest of the gig trying to get back what I wanted... not my idea of fun. Not saying that they aren't great basses, I have liked the neck of everyone that I have tried but I find them generally a bit too heavy and those tone circuits are just not for me. [/quote] so not like P basses then?

is there a mute button?