Bilbo

[quote name='urb' timestamp='1319137249' post='1410504'] Anyway fearlessness is the way forward and I too am feeling particularly fearless with my playing too right now - leaping into the unknown and knowing you will land just fine if you trust your instincts is what making real music is all about... [/quote] I think this state comes after you have fully absorbed the core of what it is you are doing. If I 'let myself go' in the way you describe over a 12-bar blues or a static groove, it may reap rewards (no guarantees) but, if I did the same over a more complicated set of changes, it woudl fall apart within seconds. I was looking at some obsdcure charts last night and thinking how easy it is to get locked into a comfort zone and to forget the massive potential of improvised music. So much jazz that I play is based around the (not so) Great American Songbook or the half a dozen Aebersold/Fake Book tunes everyone plays that I can get locked into II V Is and cycles and routine turnarounds so much that even a slightly odd set of changes like a Wayne Shorter tune can throw the kind of spanner in that I am talking about. I guess the kind of freedom you describe is not something I am comfortable with. But it's not all about me

That's all about leading notes and grace notes, BE. They work becuase they are adjacent to the chord tones and are used on weak beats of the bar as a lead into a diatonic phrase on a strong beat. Holding any lead in note will create tension that is released when it is resolved. A lead in note will work better on a chord tones than a non-chord tone and on a weak beat rather than a strong one although turning that around has long ago become acceptable in the right context. You learn to recognise the difference quite quickly and make your musical decisions accordingly.

That is correct. Use the root of the dominant 7th chords as the first note of the mixolydian mode and change the mode every time you change the chord. So a blues in E would be E7 = E mix (Amajor) = E F# G# A B C# D E A7 = A mix (D major)= A B C# D E F# G A (only note different is G instead of G#) B7 = B mix (E major)= B C# D# E F# G# A B (only notes different are D# and G#) Those 1 and 2 note differences are what defines the 12-bar blues and a whole genre has been built upon them.

[quote name='BottomE' timestamp='1319103737' post='1409844']Sod all that. I want to learn about the wrong notes. The interesting ones that don't fit "theoretically" but sound jazzy and cool.[/quote] Trust me. Just because they sound jazzy and cool to you doesn't mean that they don't fit a theory, just that you don't know that theory. I did a session once and the producer (who worked for the BBC) said he had ths jazzy chord sequence he wanted to use but had not yet found a use for it. The sequence went Emaj7, F#m7, G#m7, Amaj7.....He said it reminded him of Level 42. Nuff said...

And PS, the fraudn thing never really goes away

[quote name='Amafi' timestamp='1319043972' post='1409300'] I know my major scale in every position and in every key, I know the modes and I know both my Major and minor Pentatonics in every key. Most songs I play are 12 bar but I still don't know whether I should play Major or minor Pentatonics as they both seem to fit. What I would really like to know is what scale/mode to play and when, especially for fills, and how do you know what scale/mode to use? Say I was to get a song from a friend, how would I know how to jam over it? A recent video said that you should find each chord that the guitarist is playing, overlap them in the same fretboard position, and the notes from the chords will define the scale to play. Is this correct? Any advice would be helpful. Thanks[/quote] Sounds to me that you know some stuff but have not yet got a sense of context. Most blues are based around dominant chords rather than major but the dominant chords are the fifth mode of the major scale so its them same notes starting in a different place. A major pentatonic works over both as there is no 7th, a minor works because there is a blue note (the third). Your guitar player may be playing rock barre chords that are often ambiguous, hence both sounding correct. As for the video advice, its very simplistic. It may work with first position chords but not with any interesting voicings (a lot of jazz guitarists don't play root notes etc). Try finding some play-alongs that focus on the stuff you want to learn.

Just a point in relation to 'building up strength'. In my experience, it is not so much building up strength as it is learning to use you hand and arm effeiciently in order to maximise it's muscle tone. I have found that, when I maintain a sustained practice schedule, my left hand maintains its positioning much more readily and I find that I have fewer problems with fatigue etc. Its not because my hand is stronger, it is because my whole body/arm posture is better. Can I also recommend the book An Alexander Technique Approach to Double Bass Technique by Ethan Kind as something worth reading and thinking about? Its not a magic cure but it helps you think about how the body works 'in toto' as opposed to just the ways your hands interact with the bass. http://www.amazon.co.uk/Alexander-Technique-Approach-Double-ebook/dp/B004JKMSSE/ref=sr_1_fkmr1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1319025463&sr=1-1-fkmr1 Also, ref. baboom's comments about playing softer. Agree 100%. Use the pick up/amp technology to amplifiy your sound. I know there is a lot of talk about the bassists in the old big bands having no amps but the music they played was a lot more 'grounded' and modern playing techniques probably require a bit of help (and a lot of them were mic'd up as well). Get a good pick up and a decent pre amp (Fishman Plat Pro?) to avoid feedback and let your amp do the work. It will help you relax and play better and your right hand will not choke your sound as much i.e. more resonance.

on't deny yourself the pleasure of finding this stuff for yourself. If you know major and minor scales and their modes you are probably 90% of the way there for most popular music but the quality is in the 10% and that is where you find the augmented, diminished, chromatic, altered etc that Doddy referred to. It is worth mentioning that the altered dominant is the 7th mode of the melodic minor scale. Most alteted chords in charts (E7b9, E7#9 etc) are all played using the the altered dominant scale. Its not as complicated as it sounds although learning the sounds of each scale is that much harder because they occur less often and often fleetingly. Kids learn this stuff one at a time. Adults always think that they can learn the whole thing in one sitting! TAke your time and learn incrementally.

If you weren't joking, it would be even funnier.

Silddx rools! I haven't enjoyed the tune so much in ages!!

Don't like those Hot Club grooves and the harmonies tend to be too 'square'. How about 'Joy Spring'?

Googled it. Not my bag. Any more suggestions?

Who is that by, Mark? Not sure if I know it.

I guess its about context. A fast paced tune can carry that a lot more than a slow one. Endless sixteenths on a ballad would be a lot harder to take than on a Parker blues. But we unquestionably agree that space of a good thing (and that my Bossa solo didn't have enough of it)!!

[quote name='mcgraham' timestamp='1318798945' post='1406388']I'll be honest, I was surprised that you and Mike didn't use them more when I listened to your renditions. Mike's GS and your first fast BB rendition just seemed relentless with next to no space or breathing room for the piece as a whole... which is fine for basslines but not for solos (IMO). As I'm sure you'll agree, playing relentlessly without rests is akin to people who talk lots but truly say so very little. Rests let the piece breathe and lets whatever else you've played find somewhere to rest in the listener's mind... in the same way if you were doing a talk you would have pauses to let the point you've just made sink in.[/quote] The issue is pacing and, whilst I agree that silence is great way to break up the flow but its not the only one. A sequence of straight 8ths is going to be dull but both Mike and I broke up the sequence with held notes, syncopated notes, triplets and various other dynamic figures so 'without rests' is a bit harsh. Nevertheless, more space is an entirely legitimate suggestion.

Its strange to admit that the gaps are what makes it harder to play but easier to listen to.

Great backing track on that one, Mark, and you sound better for it - am loving that tempo! As a contrast, here's my slow one! I couldn't get the mp3 downloaded so had to make my own backing track so apologies for the cheesiness. http://soundcloud.com/robert-palmer-1/sets/basschatters-revenge

I think we all need producers

I know what you mwan about the homeogeneity, Mark. Its the old diarrhoea thing!! Will try again on the slower one!

Just realised Mark and I have used a different Aebersold and mine is twice as fast! Sorry mate. Will try and fine the slower one as it is harder to play!

Here we go, into the lion's den! Bass solo starts at 1.54. I am playing the guitar on this track also so no taking the p*** (yes, it is slightly out of tune....) http://soundcloud.com/robert-palmer-1/sets/basschatters-revenge/

Comment posted, Mark. Can get my own version of this one up quickly so watch this space!

Its an interesting question: why do people still record covers of GS? The answer could be 'because they can' but I think there is an element of proving something. I have severla versions of the tune by people such as Chris Potter and Kenny Garrett etc and I wonder why guys who have as much musicality and creativity as they have still have this apparent need to prove they meet that particular challenge. I am consciously working on learning to play these changes as an exercise (and I will post when I am ready) but I will say that I will NEVER record the tune commercially. What is the world supposed to do with all of these versions of what is, aside from the maths, essentially a pretty naff tune? Even Berg's version leaves me wondering if he thought 'what can I do to prove that I can REALLY burn? I know, 'Giant Steps' in 7:4!! Even Garrett does one melody )chorus where he halves the bar lengths (1 chord per beat instead on 1 per two beats. Its a bit 'I can out-Trane Trane'. Maybe its nothing more than sport...

I couldn't do video anyway so its audio only for me. I did an hour on it last night and am starting to make progress but still not ready for a public airing. I have played it live in the past (a long time ago) and wonder how the hell I got away with it (I probably didn't but people are polite, aren't they!). Anyway, its not the destination that matters but the journey. There is a lot of learning going on at Bag End at the moment!

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