Bilbo

I went to far this month . I downloaded some massive recordings by Anthony Braxton, Old and New Dreams and Keith Jarrett. The Braxton stuff is really tough going. It is very abstract and I listened to 90 minutes (half?) of it before I had to give it a rest. I then went onto a live cd by 'Old and New Dreams', an Ornette Coleman 'tribute' band featuring Charlie Haden, Don Cherry, Dewey Redman and Ed Blackwell, whcih was also pretty free although much more accessable. I am now listenting to Keith Jarrett's 'Sunbear Concerts', a 6 cd boxed set of live improvisations that is also pretty intense. I am 4 hours in and not even half way there yet. I think I need to go lie down in a dark room! I have a Coltrane cd to get to yet that will probably sound like Kenny G after this stuff

I am interested in some of the responses to this as I am alway interested to hear what people are actually playing and in what ways they seek to improve themselves as players. I have always found that there are a lot of players who fill themselves up with clever party tricks that others, players and non-players alike, heap praise upon them for. Like that phase in the 90s where everyone was into Flea and learned all the BSSM tunes in an effort to sound like him. The motivation for doing that was not primarily musical, it was social. 'I want the kudos that Flea has'. 'If I can play Flea parts and he is winnign all of the polls, I must be as good as him and am equally deserving of praise'. We all like a bit of affirmation, me more than most, but I think, for many, it can get in the way of the real learning. I think BM is basically saying, in a way that is completely at odds with his brother's pseudo-intellectual presentation, is that he finds a lot of kids more interested in seeing themselves as the next 'young lion' or prodigy than they are in being the best player that concerted study and hard graft can make them. At each stage in our learning, we are only able to see a portion of what we are and what we have the potential to become. If we are sufficiently deluded, we can easily fall into the trap of believing we are better than we think we are and it takes a teacher to break that delusion, carefully but firmly. BM was being interviewed not giving a lesson or masterclass. A bit of tough love, I accept, but I think he has a point.

Try the strap over the right shoulder. It will feel strange at first but the bass remains in a playable position and, depending on the music you are playing, it should be useable?

Bit too far for me

Just to illustrate the importance of this piece of work, here is an additional, non-comprehensive list of rhythm changes tunes (some with variations but you get the idea): Allen's Alley - Denzel Best Boppin' A Riff - Bud Powell (?) Calling Dr. Jazz - Fats Navarro Celerity - Charlie Parker Crazyology - Charlie Parker C.T.A. - Jimmy Heath Dexterity - Charlie Parker Dizzy Atmosphere - Dizzy Gillespie (I assume) Eternal Triangle - Sonny Stitt Everything's Cool - Fat Girl - Fats Navarro Fingers - Thad Jones Five Guys Names Moe Good Bait - Tadd Dameron Goin' To Minton's - Fats Navarro Hollerin' and Screamin' - Fats Navarro I'm An Errand Boy For Rhythm - Nat Cole Jumpin' At The Woodside - Count Basie Kim - Charlie Parker Lemon Drop - George Wallington Little Pixie II - Thad Jones Merry Go Round - Duke Ellington Moose The Mooche - Charlie Parker Move - Denzil Best No Moe - Sonny Rollins An Oscar For Treadwell - Charlie Parker Passport - Charlie Parker Professor Bop - Babs Gonsalez Red Cross - Charlie Parker Room 608 - Horace Silver Salt Peanuts - Dizzy Gillespie The Serpent - John Lewis Serpent's Tooth - Miles Davis Steeplechase - Charlie Parker The Theme - Miles Davis Tip TOe - Thad Jones Thriving From A Riff - Charlie Parker Turnpike - J.J. Johnson? Webb City - Bud Powell? Wee - Denzil Best The list goes on and on and on and includes me (I have tried writing several 'rhythm changes tunes, as will have almost every jazz composer in the world)

Had some charts I could use to cross refer, although the chords are actually quite simple. Surprisingly so, in fact.

Very useful link, lowdown. Thank you.

Middle C on bass clef is one ledger line above the stave. On treble clef, middle C is one ledger line below the stave. learned that about a year ago. (Remember - bass guitar/double bass is written one octave higher than it actually sounds)

I am tryinhg to learn to read piano music at the moment. As I don't play the piano, this is proving problematic. Baby steps, baby steps.......

Eggsactly. Wrong targets = wrong business practices. Targets should be the acquisition of the [i]skill[/i], not the qualification. Government departments want you to get qualifications so that they can stand at teh dispatch box and say you did. The fact that you are no better qualified or no nearer getting a job is academic. They paid for the training, now its your fault you haven't got a job, not theirs.

Teachers are buisnessmen and colleges are businesses. In my recent experience, tutors of all kinds in formal establishments are pretty much told not to fail anyone. Great for business, lousy for education and students. Education seems to be about fulfilling the fantasy not about improving the student's abilities. Branford Marsalis, great as he is, is perfectly aware of his shortcomings (has finished gigs by apologising to the audience for having a bad night and telling them to ask for their oney back) and is very openminded (has played with Sting, The Grateful Dead, Bruce Hornsby and a load of other rock and pop acts). I suspect he is seeing what I see whenever I have contact with music colleges; an education system that puts its business objectives first and its students learning and development needs last. I have seen 'music' students that can't actually play a note, can't sing in tune and have no idea. What they do have is the fees. Whats [i]that[/i] about if its not getting the whole thing wrong?

Yes, I can hear tghat now, Jake. Thanks, again, mate. 'Off to shed... Doom, doom, doom, doom, doom, doom, doom....

Just a few thoughts from saxophonist Branford Marsalis on what he has learned from his students. Offers pause for thought, I think?

Good points, Jake. I have some of those OP albums, certainly some recordings with Ray B and Ed T. I will have a listen to them and compare with the new recordings I have of myself. I have a bit of time today to spend practising so will get to it straight away. Thanks for the pointers.

Got my bass back from the luthier as promised and, with the new bridge and soundpost, it sounds great. Can't wait to get playing this afternoon (wedding gig - sax, bass, piano trio - just as well there are no drums as this is the first real oouting since the breakdown four weeks ago. I am expecting stamina to be an issue although the action on the bass is so much more user friendly so that will help a lot). Still, the other guys are good musical players so I am in safe hands!!

[quote name='jakesbass' post='1230785' date='May 14 2011, 10:43 AM']we can all always improve.... will PM some thoughts if you think that would be useful.[/quote] Please do, Jake. And feel free to do so in public, if you think it would be useful. One of the reasons I keep posting developments in my 'No Pain, No Gain' thread is to allow people to see what goes on when you take up an instrument like this after years of playing double bass (like a blog but without the pressure!!). I can already hear some 'shortcomings' on the track and still feel that there is a lot to do in terms of mastering the instrument but, in terms of getting from not playing to being a gigging player, its a useful marker to how long it takes and what the learning points are. I am big enough to take crticism and feel that doing so in public to help others learn would be perfectly acceptable to me.

Thanks for that, Mike. I guess my goal is to play it well and not just to play it. Its been a long time coming.

Great arrangement.

I'd rather eat my own liver.

Is it just me or has anyone ever talked to these luthier guys about hazards of branding for an international market? Or do they know ?

As some of you will know, my double bass has been poorly for a month or so and I am picking it up from the luthier's tomorrow. In the intervening period, I decided I would do something I have wanted to do for years but have never had the time. I have several trasncriptions of John Coltrane's saxophone parts on his legendary LP 'A Love Supreme' but they were all Bb parts. I have wanted to put them into bass clef for as long as I can remember having them and have never got around to it. Well, this month 'off' has provided the opportunity to do it at last. So, here is a bass clef version of Coltrane's saxophone playing on what is arguably one of the greatest and most influential jazz albums of all time. The transcription comes in 4 parts; Acknolwdgement, Resolution, Pursuance and Psalm. I have gained so much insight into this piece from the process of transcribing and listening to the album with the charts in front of me has revealed more and more detail about how deep this stuff actually is. I can't begin to explain how intense this stuff is. I am studying it but it feels like its almost a months work every two bars. Anyway, I hope someone finds a use for this. If not, I still win because I am in bass clef heaven!! NOTE this is the saxophone part [b]NOT[/b] the bass part. Some of it is playable on the bass but some is unplayable and more useful for study rather than performance. Some of the saxophone parts are phrased using wierd saxophonic idiosynracies which do not translate to a stringed instrument so I have to acknowledge having claimed at least a little poetic licence at various points in the transcription (mostly in Pursuance).

I know its not Dave Holland but it swings and I am certainly pleased with it in terms of where I was a year ago.

[quote name='Hector' post='1227647' date='May 11 2011, 03:26 PM']Sounding great Rob! How long since you first started on upright? Some disgustingly short amount of time I expect...[/quote] I borrowed a bass from Jakesbass in December 2009 and got my own last March so say 16 months? The lines I am playing are not that different to those I would have played on the Wal so all I really had to do was learn the mechanics of playing the double bass and to build the stamina (still working on that). It also helped that a short while before this session, I had my bass set up properly (it was set too high before). It all came together at that session.

[quote name='bassace' post='1227653' date='May 11 2011, 03:32 PM']Yes, very good bass playing although your drummer a bit careless with the cymbals at times. Only thing worries me; I understood from your posts that you were terribly cutting edge and had a downer on 'The Great American Songbook'. So why Witchcraft? Glad to see that you're not above doing what the rest of us do.[/quote] I just played the gig There's the me that I want to be and the me that I am. They are not necessarily the same thing.