Bilbo

Professional musician or dole? No brainer. The trouble with your situation is that you know what you want to do but it is not the 'easy route' and it is inevitable that people are going to be put out. One of the hardest lessons we ever learn as human beings is that, sometimes, doing the right thing can upset as many people as doing the wrong thing. Managing such situtaions takes a degree of emotional maturity that some lack. There is a third way. You could stay with your old and but get a dep in for gigs you can't do. I don't know what kind of stuff your 'old' band play but assume that, with a bit of thought, they could find a dep easily enough - especially if they were a reader (charts or dots). There are loads of us in Suffolk so the may be someone on here who can fill in for gigs you can't do. If you want to make music your living, it is pretty much inevitable that you are going to have to have a few irons in the fire at any one time and most professionals are willing and able to accommodate properly prepared deps.

Done. An audience of 200 at a jazz gig? That'll be a festival then

I think its a British thing. We don't tend to tell people of their failings to their faces (but slag them off behind ther backs). I think its actually quite sad because, without that feedback, we are never going to improve. I have looked at several videos and listened to mp3s that I think are weak for one reason or another but I don't see it as my role to critique everything I see/hear on this forum, particularly if I think the material is poor. People don't know me and have no comprehension of the insights I may or may not have into the music, particularly the music [i]they[/i] play as opposed to that which [i]I[/i] play. My posts exist alongside those of several thousand other anonymous avatars and my praise or criticism has no context. Having posted my own recordings here and got a dozen or so positive comments out of 120+ downloads, I can only assume 110 people think 'tosser' . Do I need to actually [i]hear[/i] it to know that's what is being thought? Probably not. Not liking something is different to knowing it is deficient in some objective sense. If I don't like a song, it means nothing. If the player drags, is out of tune etc, then the criticism is legitimate but, the point is, is the person who has posted the recording emotionally mature enough to deal with that kind of criticism? I don't know the answer to that so I leave it alone. If I want a blunt opinion, I will put it on Youtube or Talkbass....

Welcome. Plenty of 'buying your first bass' type threads on here. You will get a lot of what you need here. Try Major Minors Boot Camp for bassist. If you need any more info. there are several players in Suffolk; I am in Felixstowe

Rehearsal discipline is a very important element of the professional. Sitting in a corner noodling, too many fag/tea braks, catch up chats etc all get in the way of focussed work. But the biggest drag is a lack of preparation. DIfferent techniques are starting to appear (dropbox has just appeared in my life) but the best tried and tested one, the one I love to see, is the written charts. I have got through 32 tunes in three hours using charts.

[quote name='BottomE' post='1155540' date='Mar 9 2011, 04:29 PM']The cover band has really helped us (IMHO) be a better originals band in many ways and kept everyone interested.[/quote] Typical. I'm having a perfectly good argument and then someone comes along and ruins it by being reasonable

[quote name='cetera' post='1155472' date='Mar 9 2011, 03:44 PM']+1 to ^this. If the original writer of a piece of music is the only person who can play it with feel or conviction then every other musician might as well not bother...[/quote] At last!! We agree on something :lol:

I was also reading a guest editorial in Jazztimes (US jazz magazine) by Vijay Iyer (pianist) and he made an interesting point about the profile of non-mainstream music (jazz in this case but it woudl apply to everything). He said 'its not about the [i]accessibility[/i] of new music but about [i]access[/i] to it'. You just don't get to hear it because its hidden. Those of you who aren't jazz fans, for instance, ask yourself when you last heard a jazz tune that was released this year. Bet it wasn't today, this week, this month or probably even this year. Same with folk, prog-rock etc etc. Its not there; anywhere. Mind you, reverting back to another thread I started about classic rock LPs I have never heard - I have never heard a KISS album either although I did see them live once (post unmaksed and in daylight so minimal show)

I was just thinking. I have played thousands of gigs over 30+ years, playing rock/metal, funk, pop, Latin and Jazz and the biggest audience I ever played to was 4,500. With a 7-piece jazz band. I wish I could say it was playing originals but they weren't, although they were original arrangements of standards written by our lead trumpet player. Second biggest gig (2,500) was a pop gig playing all originals. Every covers band gig I have ever done has been to a maximum of 200 and often to much smaller audiences. Makes you think.

If you have never played fretless before, it will probably take you about two days to get your playing close enough to functional. Don't make these fretless things out to be anything unusual. A zillion violin, viola, cello and double bass players can't all be geniuses. Fretmarkers are not taht useful really. Its a case of a little thought/application and you're away. Never tried the Warwick you mention.

[quote name='skankdelvar' post='1155306' date='Mar 9 2011, 01:42 PM']You are one of our deeper thinkers[/quote] Boy, are you guys in trouble......

Anyone bowing this?

Which brings me to my latest batch. A Branford Marsalis live cd called 'Bloomington' where he performs in trio with Jeff Watts and Robert Hurst. Marvellous stuff. Major elements of improvisation and interplay. On the opposite end of the scale, I 'upgraded' from vinyl to cd a copy of the Wynton Marsalis recording 'Hot Hosue Flowers' which is a trumpet led jazz quartet with strings. Jazz with strings is always a tense marriage but this one has some real highlights. I have also rediscovered an old Avishai Cohen cd called Adama which has some great playing on it (although I find Cohen's double bass sound a bit 'choked' to use a term Jakesbass uses). I love this jazz stuff - not intellectual affectation; pure visceral joy. Have another look at this and please watch it to the end to get the full buzz.

Let's get this straight. Playing in a tribute band takes a certain level of skill and attention to detail and I am sure it stretches some people at least a little sometimes. Its great that the audience can have a great evening being entertained in a nostalgic kind of way, seeing a live band doing stuff by a band they liked when they were younger or never got to see but who no longer tour. Its great that the landlords make their money and their pubs stay open. Its great that the musicians get to work and its great that they get lots of money for their trouble (actually, some of them barely break even but that's another story). Its wonderful that all these people are happy, contented and set up for life, just like the girl someone mentioned who bought her house on the proceeds of singing to backing tapes. Good luck to her. I (and many others, musos and potential audiences alike) just think its a shame that this is what punters settle for. Just like chefs who hate Macdonalds or ready meals, theatre directors who hate Lloyd Webber or the artists who hated Athena. Some people think the public are being shortchanged and wish to draw attention to that belief. I also know that nobody cares in the slightest what I think. I don't expect anyone to stop doing it. I don't expect anyone to throw themselves on their sword. I don't expect venues to stop booking profit making bands in favour of loss making originals bands. I don't expect every original to be the most astonishing piece of music ever. I don't expect everyone to throw the towel in and start jazz bands. I don't claim my favourite music is better than anyone else's (except in jest and in advocating for its qualities). I don't think ill of anyone who plays in a covers band or a tribute band. I play 99% covers (inc standards) at every gig I do and don't feel the need to wear sackcloth the day after, just a little frustrated and bored by the repetition. I just think that its a shame that tv is mostly repeats, films are mostly remakes and bands are mostly playing other people' stuff. In my experience, people nearly always like the originals the best, whether its books, film, art or music. Some people are happy to watch repeats, I think its better to watch new stuff. So shoot me.... And, if people are bored with these arguments (and the one about reading) why do these threads always go on for days and days?

I sold one of these once and would like it back...... [url="http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://pod.ath.cx/guitars/artist/latest/arty-med.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.futureguitarnow.com/forum/index.php%3Ftopic%3D497.0&usg=__1KoaL8qaT7wtvPHa-NSRSKzKtkA=&h=480&w=640&sz=87&hl=en&start=16&zoom=1&tbnid=m9RjGxvG1zo1MM:&tbnh=101&tbnw=147&ei=SH12TcWnG4GeOsHO5PgM&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dibanez%2Bartist%2Bguitar%26hl%3Den%26biw%3D1156%26bih%3D571%26gbv%3D2%26tbs%3Disch:1&itbs=1&iact=rc&dur=234&oei=NX12TdKsBM3Zsga216zyBA&page=2&ndsp=22&ved=1t:429,r:16,s:16&tx=128&ty=48"]Ibanez Artist Guitar[/url]

Its the Macdonaldsisation of music. Tribute bands are small franchises of the bands they copy. Loads of people like them but they are ultimately lacking in nutrition and probably rot your teeth.

[quote name='skankdelvar' post='1153103' date='Mar 7 2011, 10:17 PM']The thing about Classical music is you have to 'get it'. Even if you can't hear any planned, expressive differences, they're most certainly there. If nothing else, conductors spend an inordinate amount of developing original interpretations of pieces. Any score is simply the basis for a kaleidoscope of infinitely subtle possibilities. Of course, it all must seem rather strange and disciplined if one is accustomed to expressing oneself through the relatively unsubtle practise of playing wildly off into the horizon based on no more than a bit of theory, some 'instinct' and some 'soul'. The imposition of the dots - when it occurs - engenders a remarkable distillation of musicianship. The nice thing about classical is it [i]does [/i]allow soloists the opportunity to improvise or ornament certain parts of the performance. These passages are called Cadenzas.[/quote] Are you having a go?

[quote name='niceguyhomer' post='1153334' date='Mar 8 2011, 07:38 AM']Loving the band name [/quote] +1

Does that mean every conversation we ever have must contain new ideas and concepts? We're doomed

The drummer's an animal!!!

[quote name='Pete Academy' post='1152832' date='Mar 7 2011, 07:22 PM']Cracking version of 'Black Friday' you posted recently, Bilbo. [/quote] Don't gloat, PA.....

I used to play 2 octaves of Major, minor, harmonic minor, melodic minor, diminished and augmented scales and all the modes of each. I then play them in broken thirds, fourths, fifths, sixths and sevenths and then arpeggiated scales. Took about an hour a day but all my technique comes from those exercises.

I've never got that 'interpretation' argument in classical music. If you play a piece and someone else plays through the same score, its going to be different and one will be better than the other but its still the same piece so the 'creativity' element is limited to your stab at the dots. I guess its a case of accepting the ethos of the genre. If you like classical, you accept its parameters. If you like covers bands, you make your decision re: whether you prefer 'like the original' or 'a creative re-arrangement'. If you like Tribute bands, you will know whether you prefer the one s who dress the part or the soundalikes. And so on...

[quote name='cd_david' post='1152405' date='Mar 7 2011, 12:49 PM']If the audiences for Jazz and classical gigs were not so heavily subsidised by arts funding in general (in comparison to rock and pop) then Im sure the "more entertaining" music would be self sustaining?[/quote] The amount of arts funding for jazz is derisory, despite it having the same size audience as Opera, which gets millions in funding. Jazz has to compete on the same turf as pop and rock which is why the numbers of musicians in the UK who play jazz for a living is pretty much nil. Most of them supplement their incomes in other ways but rarely through arts funding.