Bilbo

Errrr.. first believe in God.... I wasn't aware that 'Gospel' had to be a style anymore. I thought it was about content not genres and that you can have Christian folk music, Christian Metal, Christian Funk, Christian Bale (oops! What is he doing in here).... I always think of 'Gospel' as an attitude not a genre. What do I know? Heathen bustard....

Bought my Wal Custon Fretless on 25th April 1986 and it is still my main squeeze. I have other basses for fretted/low B work but have not gigged with another bass since around 1990. It still sounds great and no other bass has turned by head since. If I had the wonga, I would order a fretless 5 today. Hear the bass here! [url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=42836&st=20"]http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=42836&st=20[/url] And see it here! [url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=42836&st=20"]http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=42836&st=20[/url]

Nice production. The singer is great. Some nice touches in the arrangements and a nice fretless sound. Its a good product.

I just put my fingers where the note is. Seriously, though, I recommend people play the bass with their ears and not their eyes. I know thw fretlines are where the note is supposed to be etc but I also wouldn't rely on it in place of my ears (same with the dots on the side of the neck). Its the notes that matter not the technology. If you are not fretting consistently on/behind/in front of the lines, to me, the lines are in the wrong place, surely? That's why I went for an unlined fretless. Its all academic if you are reading a chart or utilisiing eye contact as a means of cueing yourselves.

Suffolk is chock full of us! WElcome.

I did a gig once where this Polish guy (I knew him) starts having a go at his missus at the back of the bar and six Portuguese guys grabbed him three on each side, picked him up kicking and screaming, walked him through the crowd carrying him above their heads (I had to turn sideways to let them past - I was still playing) out into the street, laid him on the floor and walked back in, leaving the bouncer to prevent his re-entry into the venue. No anger, no grief, no blood and guts, just assertive removal. Noone got hurt, even the Polish guy. It was a lesson in mature crowd control. Beautiful. I like Portuguese people - they know how to have a good time without getting leary.

I have recently bought and read these two new biographies on Ron Carter and Scott LaFaro. Worth a look if your are interested in their respective careers. What really freaks me out is the fact that LaFaro only played the bass for about 7 years from picking it up until his death in a car crash. Incredible. Both books dispell the myth that players are born with these talents. They work damn hard and study, practice and graft to get this good. The Carter book is only available from the US but I got it really easily. [url="http://www.amazon.com/Ron-Carter-Finding-Right-Notes/dp/061526526X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1254597090&sr=1-1-spell"]http://www.amazon.com/Ron-Carter-Finding-R...mp;sr=1-1-spell[/url] [url="http://www.amazon.co.uk/Jade-Visions-Music-Lafaro-Musicians/dp/1574412736/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1254596965&sr=1-1"]http://www.amazon.co.uk/Jade-Visions-Music...6965&sr=1-1[/url]

Nice one, JPS. Now you have played 'Song For My Father' once, you've got it out of your system. Never play it again. Please.

C Jam Blues - Duke Ellington.

Most of James Jamerson's work. Great lines, beautifully executed and then surrounded by bubblegum sung by 12 year-olds, tuneless whelps and trashy girlbands.

[quote name='JPS' post='613886' date='Oct 1 2009, 03:22 PM']I imagine you can get lost in this stuff for a liftetime and still not have enough time.[/quote] Absolutely: Ron Carter says 'I'm still just trying to find the right notes'.

[quote name='JPS' post='613857' date='Oct 1 2009, 02:34 PM']Thanks guys that's really helpful. I'm reasonably comfortable walking over a blues (not claiming to be Ray Brown obviously) and can write lines using arpeggios, passing notes, chromatic approach notes etc.[/quote] Thats pretty much all there is, mate: the rest is called style and taste and you can't get that any other way but trial and error over months and years of playing. [quote name='JPS' post='613857' date='Oct 1 2009, 02:34 PM']I read somewhere that you should always play the stronger notes - i.e. root, third or fifth - on the 1st and 3rd beats of the bar. Is this sound advice? I find it a bit difficult to be quite that precise at the moment.[/quote] It is true but its also impossible to think like that when you are playing at 320 bpm. Its a helpful guide to why somethings work better than others but, like all 'rules', it is there to be broken if you think something sounds good. [quote name='JPS' post='613857' date='Oct 1 2009, 02:34 PM']Wouldn't know where to start in terms of soloing to be honest. I'd probably make the classic bass player's mistake and fall back on arpeggios starting from the root upwards. Any useful tips on how to start soloing?[/quote] Yes you do, you just can't get that its hard to get from 1st bass to a home run and takes time. Its not magic, its hard learned. You improvise every time you speak or write - its no different. You just take notes, phrases, licks etc and play them in any order that pleases the ear. Sing along with you playing and play what you sing (don't sing what you play, thats the motor skills driving the brain not the other way around) [quote name='JPS' post='613857' date='Oct 1 2009, 02:34 PM']I've also started learning melodies for the first time. I take it they can be a useful starting point for modest solos.[/quote] Melodies are a great way of making sense of chord sequences. Time well spent. All solos are melodies; nothing more and nothing less.

Big question, JPS. The honest answer is 'all of the above' but I will try and give you a starting point. The most important thing to learn in jazz at the early stages is the jazz blues form in F and in Bb. F7/// Bb7/// F7/// //// Bb7/// //// F7/// D7/// Gm7/// C7/// F7/D7/Gm7/C7/ or Bb7/// Eb7/// Bb7/// //// Eb7/// //// Bb7/// G7/// Cm7/// F7/// Bb7/G7/Cm7/F7 If you can play walking lines over these two and improvise over them, you are on the way.

Ray Brown and Ella Fitzgerald? Del Palmer and Kate Bush?

Clarify what they want! If I dep for a rock/funk thing, I rely on my ears and get through by approximating the original (most of which I have usually heard if not played before). I did one dep where the bandleader had the hump because I didn't play the parts 'as per the record' (should have prepared charts then, shouldn't he ). I won't learn 30 tunes for a dep gig. I haven't got time. Its charts or 'close enough', I am afraid.

I could help if you can be arsed to travel as far as Felixstowe.

Where were these charts when I was learning to read I had to put up with dreadful folk songs from double bass books or trombone exercises not REAL charts from real music. Another great one for the Basschat Canon. Nice work, Mat.

Finally got around to downloading, Mat. The chart is great; I hadn't really listened to the track in that much detail before but its a nice line. Good work.

One of the issues I have with JB vs Jaco debate is that Berlin has, for me, failed to find a place for himself in any music of lasting quality. I think his Bruford stuff was marvellous but, since then, I have heard nothing that moves me (impresses, on occasion but never moves). Compare that to Jaco's stuff and you can see why JB never got that kind of prestige. Jaco was a better musician than Berlin, who is probably the better technician. JB sounds as if he comes at it with his brain not his heart and soul. His sound is clinical, Jaco's was much deeper (all subjective, I agree). Also, and this is not fair but it is true, Jaco, as a personailty, had presence, flair, charisma. JB is like your mate's Dad, the bloke that delivers the milk, the guy that mends your tv. Whether he is bitter or not is not for me to say but it is easy to see why he has experienced a lack of comparative success.

I always found that comment by Jeff Berlin to be nonsensical. If we all thought like that, most innovations on most instruments would never have happened. Percy Jones played fretless at the same time as Jaco and was compared with him but only an idiot would believe that they are not as different as chalk and cheese. If you want my opininon, depending on how deeply you want ot look, all double bass players sound like double bass players to me. And yet they all sound different. Same with pianists, trumpeters, saxophonists etc. All fretless basses sound like fretless basses but not all fretless bass players sound like Jaco. The argument does not bear close examination and never has. Berlin made a choice and justified it, like we all do. To be fair, Berlin human and all humans are fallable - even me

Gary Brown's line on Flora Purim's 'Cravo E Canela' from her CD 'Flora Purim sings Milton Nascimento'. Great Latin groove in 3:4; simple but effective line. Everyone on this forum could play it (even if they can't read it ) so have a go. I am hearing 4 against 3 but others may hear it as 2 dotted crotchets and a dotted quaver. Oh, and you'll need a 5-string/low B to play it as written (but you can play it on a 4 without too much hassle)

[quote name='AdamWoodBass' post='608443' date='Sep 25 2009, 10:19 AM']Miroslav Vitous doesn't seem to get much of a mention anymore. Awesome player. I love Avishai Cohen as well and again people don't tend to mention him when talking about really good jazz bass players.[/quote] Mmmmmm - I love Vitous, particularly with Chick Corea and Roy Haynes (on ECM), but Cohen I haven't decided on. I have a Claudia Acuna CD he is on where he plays great on one track but his sound sometimes fails to do it for me. Still, he's got time to get good. Sometimes its just about hearing these guys in the right setting.

I had bad experiences in this regard and would recommend patience. Find a teacher EVEN BEFORE YOU GET A BASS so you can discuss this kind of stuff with hem. They may even come with you to buy your first bass. You will probably have to travel to buy (this isn't like popping up the local Spar) but, more to the point, you may need to travel more than once in order to 'shop around'. If in doubt, DON'T BUY. I did and had a bad experience, not financially, the dealer I bought it off bought it back for almost the same price I paid for it, but it was a bass that was too small for me (6' 1") and I ended up with a hand injury that has never really gone away. I hope you have more luck that I did

[quote name='leftybassman392' post='608456' date='Sep 25 2009, 10:32 AM']Looks so simple and sounds great when you do get it right, but takes more work than you'd think (as I'm sure Bilbo would confirm).[/quote] Yes and no, Andy. If a player has dealt with the core competences of playing and isn't just playing by aping his or her idols, the transition is not too hard but it does require a change of mindset which can throw some people (I have struggled to get deps for some Latin gigs because of it). I am playing on a couple tracks that are of this type on www.myspace.com/albinocubana - nearly but not quite (but the same is true of the whole band so I can't be held entirely responsible for its shortcomings)

They are great grooves and it takes a lot of time to nail them. Its not so hard to play a groove with the accent on 4, but when you start actually playing compositions with complex changes, adding fills, accents, changes of groove etc, you really have to get into that way of hearing stuff to be able to make the music work. But, yes, its great stuff and really refereshing if its new to you.