Bilbo

Some Prog (and Jazz Rock) has dated quite badly.

[quote name='skankdelvar' timestamp='1439213455' post='2840891'] audiences of chin-stroking, blokey dotards in belly-bulging Marshall T-shirts. [/quote] Audiences of any kind would be nice....

[quote name='Dad3353' timestamp='1439210273' post='2840830'] Are you still 'aghast' at these artists being programmed at festivals, then, or has there been any understanding in the above..? Not that one has to [i]like [/i]the genre, of course, but at least recognise its legitimacy..? [/quote] Still aghast, I am afraid. I can see that there is a skill to this but, rather like hanging wallpaper or fitting a carpet around a toilet, just because someone has a skill that I lack, doesn't mean they I accept the argument that they should be on the stage!! PS I suspect anyone who likes this stuff quite rightly doesn't give a rat's arse what I think

[quote name='Dad3353' timestamp='1439209654' post='2840822'] Sometimes they're right, of course. [/quote] More often than not, it is the debates that are important and not the conclusions!

Return To Forever were an odd band because they started quite Latin Jazzy and moved into a strange post Mahavishnu Jazz Rock thang. I think there is certainly some proggy elements to it (The Jester and The Tyrant comes to mind) and Al Di Meola has often walked a fine line but I consider most of it to be fusion rather than prog. A lot of it got a bit naff but some of it is pretty impressive.

I remains unconvinced. As I have never danced for more than 12 seconds, I would not consider myself to be part of MC Dynorod's target audience and shall consequently leave the matter rest.

Tomatito did an interesting album with Michel Camilo but I prefer his own flamenco thing. I got into flamenco in a big way many years ago but, sadly, had to leave it behind. I LOVE listening to Nuevo Flamenco but it is not something that I can ever get involved in because there are only a few flamenco guitarists in Felixstowe* and they are all a bit old school for me. * are there f***.

[quote name='Muzz' timestamp='1439203405' post='2840715'] I'd say that when done well it's a real skill, a real musical talent, more akin to production and engineering than actually playing the instruments, perhaps, but within it's genre completely valid. [/quote] It all sounds a bit 'wannabe' to me. Like darts players calling themselves 'atheletes'.

Having spent the first few years of my Jazz career playing regularly at The Four Bars Inn in Cardiff (the original venue, not the one at the Sandringham Hotel), I woudl argue that the presence of a perfectly credible piano that was rarely moved, a decent PA and a couple of PZMs for miking the instrument, you can improve the experience for all parties, thereby improving the attraction of attendance. We regularly hosted solo pianists and piano players in trio and they sounded wonderful. You can't call guys like Liam Noble and the like and expect them to bring a NORD!! I am not expecting anything to change for the better in this regard but I thought it was worth highlighting what a shame it is that these kinds of venues which cater properly for instrumentalists whose instrument is not portable are not more common.

Am liking Focus 3 - I know some of the tunes (all the hits) but the rest are pretty good too. No Crimson on Spotify!!

I will watch that next time I am laid up with Lymes disease. It will make the time go faster.

Semantics, guys. Not the point. It's not acoustic!! Electric, electronic, electrical? It's not what it is that matters here but what it isn't.

I am now listening to Tarkus. Can't say the Banks recording has anything to worry about It has merit but I have always struggled with Palmer's drumming and there is a 'thrashing about' sensibility that I find less than appealing.

I now have 27 more recordings I need to listen to .

Acknowledging I am both an old fart and a Jazz nazi, I was just reading a BBC article about the demise of the nightclub (apparently they are closing at a rate not dissimilar to pubs). My attention was drawn to the fact that DJs are no w 'playing' festivals. I have to say that I have never 'got' the idea of a DJ as anything other than a bloke that plays records and the idea that these people are now appearing at festivals just leaves me aghast. I only ever have contact with DJs when I do wedding gigs and they are almost always socially inadequate nerds who know an astonishing amount about the music of the 1960s and very little about holding a conversation, particulary if it is with a girl. Now, it appears, they are festival headliners. Has the world gone mad. Oh - and apparently they class themselves as musicians. Can anyone of you youngsters explain all of this to an old feller?

I have used Band In A Box in the past quite successfully for demoing songs. Can't say I use it nowadays because I am in a different space composing-wise but It is a great tool for sketchng ideas and trying things out. A means to an end and not an end in itself.

For my money, the essential difference with prog. was that, unlike most other genres, it was essentially 'English', not blues based and not dance orientated. Adding stuff around epic fantasy, mellotrons and long solos was peripheral. It is music that is generally less 'groove' orientated and more cerebral. The fact that there was no expectation that I would have to dance to it was a major attraction

Lots of yummy things to listen to!!

Absolutely. Two tracks on his Back On The Streets lp were fusiony, and a track on Cozy Powell's Tilt lp.

Been a while. I just listened back to that old Colloseum slbum 'Strange New Flesh' and the track 'Down To You' with vocalist Mike Starrs who is astonishingly good. Gary Moore, Don Airey and Neil Murray leaving us wondering what may have been had Heavy Metal not come calling!!

Vocalist Kim Beacon (I think there are one or two instrumentals). The vocals are an important element to the album. My kid brother always says that the trouble with prog is that, with the exception of Genesis and Yes, the vocalists are all sh**. This album is a massive exception. Beacon's vocals are exquisite.

I love it just the way it is.

We have all seen that 'electric bass in Jazz' threads that appear here intermittently but, eb v db discussions aside, it has recently occured to me how rarely we get to play with a real acoustic piano, even an upright instrument, never mind a proper grand piano. Since I took up the double bass (about 5 years now?), I have played in an ensemble with a pianist only twice. Once in a recording studio (grand) and once on a gig at The Fleece in Stoke By Nayland (upright). Modern electric pianos are very good but it's a shame that more venues cannot accommodate the Real McCoy. I am sure it would improve the audiences if they could hear acoustic Jazz played 'properly'.

You are in for a treat, Kev!!

I have just re-discovered Tony Bank's album 'A Curious Feeling' - based on the book Flowers for Algernon. I had this on cassette 1,000 years ago and always loved it but forgot it. Just looked it up on youtube (it is not on Spotify). I love Tony Banks's writing and found that the Genesis songs I liked the most (One For The Vine, Guide Vocal, Evidence of Autumn etc) were almost always his but this album is something else. It is perfect end to end. If I had written it, I would have had to stop. It's the 'To Kill A Mockingbird' of Prog!!