Thunderthumbs

[quote name='Delberthot' post='384560' date='Jan 19 2009, 12:10 AM']I know what I've said in the past about single cut basses but that is really nice.[/quote] Never really done anything for me in the past......but this is loooooverly.

Ooooooh.....that's just lush :wub: Good luck with it. Wish it was coming my way!

[quote name='wesfinn' post='379582' date='Jan 13 2009, 08:07 PM']surely if its all illegal, then everybody could 'club together' to buy the bass so that it would technically be owned by all the people who paid. that would then jsut be a straight sale right? then its up to those people to decide if they want to 'give' the bass to one person and theyre way of doing so is to draw the names out of a hat to make it fair, that way there is no financial profit gained, it's just a bunch of nice people who decided that they would give away theyre share in something.[/quote] As I think it was noelk27 who pointed it out, it doesn't matter how you try to paint it, the "law" sees it another way, and as such it would still be defined as a lottery. Anyway, as I said earlier, I've an offer to consider, and after my consultation with my local authority I'm going to follow that up and put this "raffle/lottery" to bed.

[quote name='warwickhunt' post='379386' date='Jan 13 2009, 05:37 PM']That would make sense as there are raffles held in Church halls up and down the country... they can't be illegal! Or is it the value and destination of proceeds that dictates if it can go ahead?[/quote] From what I was told by my licensing section, yes. As the proceeds would be going squarely in my pocket, it's effectively illegal. Even if I were to "invite" people to a private club, the invitees are still classed as "the general public" so I would still require a license. I've received an offer should this have fallen through, so in this case, I think for me, ped and other admin of Basschat that's the best route to go down. I still think it's something worth looking at for the future, and something I might spend a bit of spare time trying to resolve. Cheers, Pete.

Dear all, I have just spoken to the licensing section of my local council and I'm afraid it's a non-starter. The issues (as have already been raised by a couple of legal eagle BCers) are: 1. It is classed as a lottery, therefore a lottery license would have to be applied for. 2. The application would be immediately rejected as the proceeds of the lottery are not for charitable use. 3. If it were to generate money for charity at the same time, to raise enough money for me to take £1000 out of it would mean collectively we could buy a Bugatti Veyron! 4. Since none of you are my immediately family, I couldn't have a "private" raffle. So in short, it's not going to happen. I said to Ped right at the start I didn't want to step into areas of illegality and put him and the other admin/mods of Basschat in the brown stuff. Personally, I think it's a shame we can't find a solution in the long term (although maybe someone can?) as I think it could've been a good way of getting gear moved around in these leaner times. Since no transactions have taken place, I would imagine no laws have been broken, we've just basically had a big debate, an open discussion. Thanks everyone for your input, especially Simon and Noel. Cheers, Pete.

Just a quick update. From advice I received, I will be contacting my local authority to check the gaming regulations. So I'll come back and inform everyone once I've spoken to them. warwickhunt and Golchen....no problem, thanks for your clarification.

[quote name='Monz' post='378501' date='Jan 13 2009, 12:14 AM']Put me down for two please... hmmmmmm warwick[/quote] 60 gone. 40 left. Right. Off to bed

[quote name='steve' post='378482' date='Jan 12 2009, 11:50 PM']erm, I'll have a ticket tho' [/quote] That's 58 then. 42 to go.

[quote name='BassManKev' post='378477' date='Jan 12 2009, 11:50 PM']im not sure about members new to the site being allowed to enter into this, i mean if someone who signed up yesterday who nobody knows send the tenner and wins it, i wouldnt be best pleased! But of course then theres the decision of when a member is 'known' enough for him/her to enter..... complicated.[/quote] I can see where you're coming from, but are we going down the "chavs shouldn't be allowed to win the lottery" avenue? If someone's spent their cash, it might not be the most popular result, but fair yes?

[quote name='benwhiteuk' post='378472' date='Jan 12 2009, 11:45 PM']Sorry man, I didn’t mean to call anyone’s integrity into question and I don’t mean any disrespect. I think this is a great idea but when 100 fairly anonymous people are spending £10 on a raffle ticket I think things should be tight with no questionable circumstances or results. I’m not disputing the credibility of the idea or the possibility that this will go ahead, I’m just asking the questions that I feel need to be asked in order for all bases (excuse the pun ) to be covered to allow this to go ahead without any problems. I’m all for this to go ahead mate, don’t get me wrong [/quote] No problems whatsoever. I really hope this is an issue we can cover the legality of, as I think it'd be a great route to go down for the forseeable future for getting some basses sold for very little outlay on a lot of peoples parts. The Govt want us to start spending money, so why not let Basschat take the credit for getting this country's economy back on the road to recovery Anyway, yeah I'm up for whatever the consensus thinks is the fairest and most open way of drawing a winner.

Right.......role call: 57 "notice of intent" as at this list, so 43 to go. Those marked with a "?"........reading your posts, I'm not sure whether you have actually confirmed you'd want one or not (should it get the go ahead), so could you clarify that for me please. Cheers. ari BassManKev beerdragon ben604 benwhiteuk [i]Born 2B Mild ?[/i] bundacious cd_david x 2 cgordonfreeman CHRISDABASS crez5150 Delberthot eude Geejay Golchen [i]GremlinAndy ?[/i] guyl Hamster hivez ieuanmacey jake_tenfloors jmesa JoeS [i]JohnnyLightyear ?[/i] [i]josh3184 ?[/i] lateralus462 lee650 littleal x4 mathewsanchez mogli66 molan mr_russ MythSte NancyJohnson x2 [i]noelk27 ?[/i] OutToPlayJazz overwater#1 Rasta simon1964 spacecowboy steve-norris [i]Stockholm Syndrome ?[/i] TenLetters x2 The Burpster Vern-Icepick vmaxblues Voodoosnake Waldo WeirdWar wotnwhy yorks5stringer

[quote name='OutToPlayJazz' post='378435' date='Jan 12 2009, 11:10 PM']Nice idea & a very different way of selling your instrument. Do you work in marketing or something? Count me in [/quote] Ha ha, no not at all. Although I'm starting to think of auditioning for The Apprentice this year

[quote name='benwhiteuk' post='378427' date='Jan 12 2009, 11:06 PM']Yeah I do agree with this – I think more thought would have to go into the “drawing” process to make sure that the people who entered are satisfied that it has been a fair process and even if they don’t agree it’s been a fair process there’s some form of evidence that’ll prove beyond reasonable doubt that the draw was genuine and completely fair. I’d have thought that the best way to organise the drawing of something like this would be at one of the larger bashes maybe, but then I guess that the time scale may play quite a large factor in this not happening. People will obviously be handing over money before the draw has been made, but it’s not like they’re going to be protected by a contract but much rather just good faith that i) the draw will happen, ii) the draw will be fair, iii) the bass will get sent out, etc... This is a great idea but it seems to me that, regardless of legalities, there’s a lot to sort out and confirm. However, I'd be in for a tenner if it does happen [/quote] Guys, I'm happy to go to whatever lengths people think is fair and square (within reason of course) which is why I contacted Ped to start off with. I wanted to get the draw done elsewhere so I retain impartiality. He was the one that suggested he'd stay out of it and perform the draw, which I'm all for. I don't think any of us here would question Ped's integrity. Equally, I have met enough people on here that hopefully would vouch for me being honourable, fair and square, etc. I've travelled the length of the country and back in a day at my own cost to swap & sell equipment, etc., so although I'll obviously gain from this, I'm certainly not in it for ripping anyone off at all. Just ask any one from bassbunny, yorks5stringer, lee650, rasta, machines and possibly a few others. Clearly I want to sell my lovely Warwick, as it's a shame to have a bass this nice that's not being used any longer, and as I said, I don't want to sell it for less than I honestly think it's worth. And I think if we can cover the legality of it, I think it'd be a great way for people to start moving some of the high enders that just aren't moving as nobody's got deep pockets any longer. Cheers, Pete.

[quote name='Golchen' post='378134' date='Jan 12 2009, 07:25 PM']Interesting idea. I don't actually like thumb basses so I'd probably just stick it on eBay if I bought a ticket and won. Is that horribly cynical?[/quote] That's your choice......"you pays your money" [quote name='Golchen' post='378134' date='Jan 12 2009, 07:25 PM']I can't see this as a 'way forward' because people will only bite once or twice on this sort of thing. Nice idea for an occasional though.[/quote] I'd definitely be up for it if a few nice high enders were knocking about [quote name='Golchen' post='378134' date='Jan 12 2009, 07:25 PM']How would you ensure the draw to be fair? I'm not particularly in favour of names in a hat in this day and age?[/quote] If you think there's a fairer way, feel free to let me know. Like I said, I've already had assurances that Ped will take no part in any ticket purchase (nor get mates to buy tickets on his behalf), and he's prepared to do the draw itself to ensure that I don't unluckily pull a friend's name out and leave myself open to question.

[quote name='BassManKev' post='378123' date='Jan 12 2009, 07:16 PM']if its kept to 100 tickets limit, and you will get all the money, that means knowone but you is getting any money right?? meaning that its just like selling a bass, so there shouldnt be any legal issues?[/quote] As for limiting it to 100, yes it would be only me that would receive money. As for whether that constitutes the same as selling a bass......errr.......can't answer that with 100% conviction as I'm not a legal eagle (but my head says probably not, as I'd probably have to sell 100 parts of the bass - 1 to each person). As ped has stated, another BCer (who is in the legal profession) is going to check out with a gaming licence is required, so I'm sure we'll all know soon enough.

[quote name='ped' post='378090' date='Jan 12 2009, 06:49 PM']Simon1964 has kindly offered to check into the legality of this 'auction' (turns out there may be a problem with doing a raffle for personal profit or some such, don't ask me why) so I hope nobody minds if we bear that in mind... by all means register interest in the meantime until we know either way. Cheers ped P.s sorry Thunderthumbs, I probably should have looked into it before![/quote] Hi Ped, Yeah, no worries whatsoever. That's why I raised the issue of what effect it would have on the admin/mods of the site. If it turns out that all that is required is a gaming licence is required, and it's a fairly simple process, then I'd be happy to put towards it (as long as it's not £1000 ) As for the other ideas, yes I've no problem limiting it to 100 tickets, so it keeps the odds down. I was thinking with half my brain trying to raise some charity cash at the same time, but I can see everyone's point with that. 100 tickets it would be then (if we get the all clear on the legality). Keith......I should've asked for copyright permission on the photos first, I know but I still had the photos you took for me, and a friend has my camera at the moment. (Note for anyone who's now starting to wonder why the bass is mine, but Keith "yorks5stringer" took the photos........I borrowed a bass of his some months back with a view to buying and left my Warwick at his house as security.......he kindly took some photos of it for me).

[size=4][color="#FF0000"][b]EDIT: PLEASE READ POST #129 FIRST. THIS CANNOT GO AHEAD DUE TO LEGAL REQUIREMENTS[/b][/color][/size] Hello all, I've had a chat with Ped today about his thoughts on an idea I had as a selling ploy, and thankfully, his thoughts were positive. Bearing in mind that we're in desperate times financially, I thought I'd put this out to everybody as a feeler, and if there are enough positive replies, let's make it happen. What I suggested is this......... I have my 1991 Warwick Thumb 5 NT which I am offering up [b]FOR RAFFLE[/b], not for sale. I have owned this bass from new, so feel free to ask any questions. In the present climate, I think this could be the way forward for selling basses on here, especially the high enders which are beautiful basses, but as cash is sparse, there seem to be no takers. I know there are some basses on here I would definitely chance £10 on. Ped himself has already said that if this takes off, there is an opening for a new forum (see below). [quote]Hi Pete, Very happy to do the draw for you, I shouldn't have another bass anyway and she would never believe that it was won for £10 :0) If it goes well, which I am sure it will, I think a new forum might be in order... Fingers crossed and keep me up to date, I will watch with much interest. Cheers ped[/quote] So, I have put a value of £1000 on my Warwick. Now obviously, in the current market I know the number of people prepared to lay that out are very small, but I really would rather hang on to it until things are better financially, than let it go undervalued. With this in mind, what I'm looking for is 100 'registers of interest' at £10 each. NO TRANSACTION WILL TAKE PLACE AT THIS STAGE - IT'S PURELY TO REGISTER INTEREST, as in, "put me down for 1 ticket @ £10". You know the sort of thing. There is nothing to stop anyone purchasing more than one ticket to increase their chances. I'll keep a running total and keep posting it, and if it reaches 100, it'll happen. The payments (should this become definite) would come to myself, and I would receive my valuation of £1000. Anything over and above £1000 would go to a charity of the winner's choice, and of course I would request a receipt from the charity as proof of payment. The list of names, together with the number of tickets purchased per person will go to Ped, so I can be cleared of anything that doesn't appear impartial. Ped has already confirmed he would not register any interest so as to remain impartial, and he will draw the winning ticket. So cheers all, let me know. All the best, Pete. [attachment=18567:01.jpg][attachment=18572:08.jpg][attachment=18576:12.jpg][attachment=18574:10.jpg] [attachment=18571:07.jpg][attachment=18570:06.jpg][attachment=18573:09.jpg][attachment=18575:11.jpg] [ attachment=18569:05.jpg][size="4"][/size]

[quote name='walplayer' post='375478' date='Jan 9 2009, 06:08 PM']That's a beauty !![/quote] Yep, gotta agree there. Absobloodylutely gorgeous.

Got mine yesterday. Cheers Ped. I'll be posting a photo of me posing in it once I've lost the two stone I've put on over Xmas!