Andyjr1515

So, onto my slightly unconventional finishing method - and this was one of the topics as Paul and I explored to decide whether this was a good project to come my way in the first place. As I will illustrate next (using another recent project where I remembered to take photos!) I use good old Ronseal Hardglaze, thinned with white spirits and applied with a cloth...yes, I know... The reason I do it that way is:[list] [*]I don't have the room or facilities to spray other than small ad-hoc tasks in the back garden [*]It produces a better finish than you would expect [*]For the kind of things I generally do (figured wood or veneers) it is fine [/list] The reason we had the discussion is because I generally don't do solid colours & of all of them, gloss black is one of the most difficult from the varnishing point of view. Paul was happy to take the chance and I was happy enough to try it. For those who might be interested, I'll illustrate the method using the other project, then next thread go through the practical easy bits and challenges on the Precision. This is from another forum (TheFretboard) which had a summer challenge to buy an entry level 6-string kit and 'do something' with it. I plumbed for the offset (Jazzmaster-like) kit. I veneered the top, left the sides and back and stained it with fountain pen ink. Next came the varnishing. The kit is: Basically - tin of hardglaze, white spririts, jam jar to mix those two, microfibre cloths (£2-3 for 4 in Sainsbury's/Homebase), rubber gloves. I added one more thing - a 'glass cleaning' micro fibrecloth to use as a dust catching 'tack rag': If you have not used microfibre cloths yet, they are a FABULOUS invention. Provided you [u] don't cut them[/u] they are completely lint-free and dustless - much more so than even a pretty well cleaned lacquer brush. The varnish is thinned by around 30% (up to 50% towards the end) and then applied in smooth passes, just slightly overlapping: The white spirit makes it spread more easily, and dry more quickly. Generally you can get two coats in a day and by the morning, it is dry enough to 1000 grit sand (if necessary) ready for the next two coats. For one of my veneer jobs, I would do this for a week or so, then 1000 wet n dry (used wet), to flatten it, then 2000 wet 'n dry (used wet) to prepare the final surface, then go to 50% white spirits, and wipe a couple of final coats for the final varnish. This is the guitar above after the final coat and before any final polishing (which often isn't necessary): (the funny round shapes are reflections of cupboard handles) For this one, with the figuring hiding any inconsistencies, I didn't even need to polish it. By the way, this is how it came out - not bad for something that started out as a £95.00 all inclusive kit! However, gloss black was going to need a bit more final finishing - that's where the extra challenges came... The above process alone got me this far: Next post: 'the additional challenges, resolution and final result'

[quote name='Paul S' timestamp='1409237765' post='2537851'] Can't wait for the next installment... wait - it's my bass! Great to see the full diary. [/quote] As the thread develops, you'll probably figure why it took a few weeks longer than estimated! (Paul was VERY patient, by the way)

[quote name='kodiakblair' timestamp='1409247322' post='2537969'] Andy I emailed those logos to your site just in case. [/quote] Received - thanks again, kodiakblair Andy

[quote name='kodiakblair' timestamp='1409247322' post='2537969'] Sadly not in the flesh or it would be mine. Fella over on TB Wolfmancharlie posted photos of his latest build and the Pantera was next to it.Funnily enough every photo he does has a Westone in it. Might have something to with him being #1 of the Electra/Westone club there. Andy I emailed those logos to your site just in case. [/quote] Great - thanks!

[quote name='Paul S' timestamp='1409237896' post='2537854'] The logo on the headstock of this is inlaid, rather than decal. [/quote] Yes - Paul's right. After all the care not to damage the 'decal' it turned out that the logo was a Mother of Pearl inlay - class job with such fine detailing! ...and as Paul says - you've seen another one???? Did you buy it? Did you steal it? If not, why not?

Thanks, folks. It's very satisfying to make a good bass into something even better. And this was a great bass to start off with...

The next task was filling the grain and dents/ knocks that the well used bass had suffered over the years. I tend to use stainableTimbermate decorators filler - it does absorb stain well if you are doing a trans or clear finish and you can water it down to almost nothing and it still works, although for this job it does dry a bit harder than I would like. If I do another one, I might give Rustins Grain Filler a whirl. That was left overnight to dry, sanded back down to the wood and then, taking advantage of a dry windless afternoon, primed with standard grey Rust-oleum grey surface primer from Homebase. Note the high tech 'spray 360 degrees' rig I was expecting to need to do a few coats, then sand down, then a few more but it went on very smoothly with no runs or dips. After the requisite time, on went a number of coats of black Rust-oleum 'Painters Touch' Gloss Black - also from Homebase. Again, these went on very well. I don't recall how many coats - but just over a can's worth using the 'two quick coats, dry, two quick coats, etc,' approach. The objective here was to build enough thickness to be able to fully flatten it without breaking through the black into the primer. The weather kept still and dry long enough to do that outdoor bit. The way I finish varnish can be all done indoors - the way I do it has its pro's and con's which I will cover in the next post, but being able to do it indoors with nothing more sophisticated than a jam jar and a microfibre cloth or two is definitely one of the big pro's. Thanks for looking Andy

As I mentioned in my recent Westone Pantera thread, the other item Paul S wanted me to have a look at was a Fender Precision Lyte body that had been refinished in the past but the lacquer had crazed badly. I generally don't do spray paint jobs - there are much more talented guys than me around - but Paul was willing to let me go the unconventional wipe-on finishing, and being black, I reckoned that even I could get an evenly-applied underlying paint coat underneath it. Of course, gloss black is one of the more challenging ones in that it shows up EVERY blemish. I did point out to Paul, before I started on it, that the crazed lacquer on it was something that some bass and guitar players would pay good money for ... maybe not intended but pretty cool nonetheless: Anyway, to continue with a strip and recoat was Paul's decision so I started with sanding, to see how tough it was. Here was the first surprise - the lacquer came off very easily..but the black paint underneath... As I sanded it, the heat generated melted the black and it just gummed up the sandpaper making it feel like trying to sand melted tar. After a considerable time, I had got no further than this: I needed a Plan B. The trouble with sanding difficult finishes is that it is too easy to end up sanding down the exposed wood while you are still trying to get through the tough outer stuff . So out came my trusty heatgun: Brilliant - the black coating came off like a slightly rubbery cellophane wrapper It didn't take too long before I was getting down to the wood... I'll post the rest shortly - grain and bump fills, primer & black spray then the long (as it turned out) process of trying to get a half-decent varnish and final polish!!! Thanks for looking Andy

Thanks, Paul....phew! Andy

I sanded the headstock down at an angle to retain the original varnish over the logo. What became clear was that the original problem has come from poor adhesion of the varnish to the paint in a number of places - around the A; D and G machine-head holes, but also in places along the top edge, particularly top left corner. At this stage, I knew I would have to sand down to the wood, at least in places. If it wasn't for the logo, it would be simply sand down to the wood for all of it, repaint and revarnish. I decided, instead, that I would need to do a, 'invisible' repair - easier with black than most other colours. First task was to get past all of the unsound varnish - this is almost there: For patching up the black, I used Staedtler permanent marker pens. Again, if it was sanded right down, I would have used black permanent ink as the stain, which would soak into the wood but (hopefully) wipe or sand off the inlay. Again, however, I couldn't risk the logo being a transfer - I figured no chance of getting hold of one of those 25 years after Westone disappeared off the scene! The advantage with the Staedtler pens is that they work over varnish (they were designed for overhead projector acetates) so not only could the bare wood be hidden, but the varnish/paint/wood thresholds too. Worked quite well - this was after a first sealing coat of varnish: Next was just more coats of varnish. As some of you know, I use a wipe-on method of varnishing. It doesn't, in my view, match a professional spray finish, but it can get pretty close and, not having any facilities for spraying, is certainly more practical for me. This is how it came up prior to its final drying time: Before refitting the tuners, I needed to let the varnish fully harden, so while I was waiting, I gave the frets a quick tidy up and polish, oiled the fretboard, and hid a few of the dints and scratches that the body had picked up over its years of play. Again, the staedtler pen was great for turning the 'white' poly dints invisible. These were some of them (before): ....and this was after a staedtlering and a quick polish... The final headstock? It came out like this... Doesn't look bad for its age! It also sounds stupendous. Met Paul S today to pass it back over. He was well chuffed how it looked... I'm just waiting for the feedback whether he likes the set-up I've done for him. I've flattened the neck relief a touch and lowered the action from how it was.... Andy

Hi Following my thread of Chris S's Westone Thunder III refurb, I was contacted by fellow forumite Paul S with reference to his own Westone, a fabulous X790. It had suffered a few years ago from a problem with the headstock that Paul had patched but needed a proper look at. I stressed that my finishing method would never match a professional spray/buff/polish job but Paul was happy to go ahead anyway. Fortuitously, I was flying into Luton - halfway between the two of us - the following week, so we agreed a handover there. Paul also asked me to look at a Fender Precision Lyte body, which I will cover in a separate thread. The X790 is/was a FABULOUS bass. But the headstock problem was unusual - at first it appeared to be stress cracks in the varnish from the machine-head washers and nuts: Paul had patched where the varnish had completely chipped away, but it was clear that there was a fissure right down to the wood on at least two of them. As with Chris S's headstock, I was concerned - if the logo turned out to be a transfer - not to sand into that area. If it was a transfer, it would be pretty impossible to reproduce it. I took the machine heads off and started sanding: I'll post again shortly but, in the meantime, note not only the breakthroughs, but also the 'light' patches Andy

D'Addario Chromes for me - love them.

Love the neck heel transition. The whole thing is looking excellent. I also have some hard evidence to use in discussions with my wife "See - you CAN do routing and sanding in the lounge!" Andy

Like the others, I have no idea what pickups would have been originally in this, but check the sizes of single-coil pickups such as [url="http://www.seymourduncan.com/products/bass-pickups/pbass/passive/scpb3_quarterpo/"]these Seymour Duncan ones[/url] . The dimensions are given on their website and there are other single coils that look a little slimmer. The alternative is to go for 'standard' pickups, but that will need the pockets routing out. Either way, you should be able to get some pickup rings that will both cover the holes and also fit the pickups. [u]Check the sizes first[/u], though, before laying out any cash. You could also go the scratchplate route, as hamfist suggests although it seems a shame to hide that lovely wood pattern - it's not often you see a one piece like that! This was one of my early veneering jobbies - the pickup rings hide a multitude of sins

Here's my tribute to Warwick's fantastic Thumb 4 fretless - it was my first full build and done for our band's bassist...I sometimes get to play it ...and yes - if I did it again I'd make a much better job of the heel...long story...

Crackingly good Likewise - can't wait to hear it

If you are adding to the stable rather than swopping, why not try fretless? I hardly play bass at all (I'm the band's reserve when the bassist wants to play lead) and then bassist switched across to fretless... ...to my utter amazement it took no time for me to be able to adapt. Yes - I have to look at the side dots, but as long as you can do that, it's pretty straightforward.

I've had to replace every one I've had...acoustics, basses.... It's the only bad thing I can think of for yamahas...otherwise I'm a great fan. Don't know why they still fit them

[quote name='ezbass' timestamp='1407859540' post='2524763'] My Ibby GWB35 started like this Then became this And now currently looks like this [/quote] Ooh wow! The final reincarnation is very nicely done.

[quote name='Chris Sharman' timestamp='1407858702' post='2524751'] I did indeed mean Jag. I was dropping my Jazz off with a hangover at the time I saw it... [/quote]

Does this count? It's a veneering job but, heck, it matches! It is on what was originally a black Squier VM Jaguar and is my current bass:

Looks a nice few pieces of wood - is the fretboard ebony?

[quote name='Dolando' timestamp='1407783177' post='2524023'] Haha, Thanks. I'm really pleased with it. To be honest, since this first coat, I've done about 6 coats and its got a bit more of a shine now. Not quite a gloss, but has a bit of a shine and I'm not sure I want a full gloss finish. [/quote] To be honest, I've never found that Tru-Oil ever does go what I would call 'full-gloss' - it always does have a slight satin look about it once it completely dries. It's going to look a stunning bass when all assembled!

[quote name='Chris Sharman' timestamp='1407763799' post='2523698'] ...and I can vouch for Andy's work having seen the Jazz in person last night. It looks better in the flesh (wood?) if that were possible. [/quote] Thanks, Chris! (And Chris meant Jag, not Jazz) Andy

[quote name='Meddle' timestamp='1407705811' post='2523265'] Whoa. These basses are 'reskinned' then? Amazing work. Do you sand the front off them and veneer them or what? [/quote] Hi and yes - all the above are standard entry-level or mid range basses with the finish taken off, veneered on the top and then re-varnished Usually, the biggest challenge is getting the existing coating off in the first place!