Andyjr1515

As those who have had a custom build done will know, even in a detailed thread there's lots of PM work goes on behind the scenes. Most of it is questions from Andyjr1515 to the prospective owner, 'do you want this; do you want that; what colour of the other do you prefer...' and usually matched with responses from the prospective owner to Andyjr1515 along the lines of, 'well, LIKE I SAID THREE TIMES NOW; Oh no - you haven't cut it have you?; Oh... I think we did spec a 6 string but now you've only left enough room for three strings...' Just normal supplier/customer communications, really. Anyway, while I've been doing the stuff on @Fishman 's Wal save, this back and forth has been going on between @Jus Lukin and me and I'm now in a position to start a number of the next steps. While the fret cutting jig is out and screwed down on my bench top, I'll be fret slotting, although for this build we are going for a radiused board and, to minimise any possibility of chipping, I will do that first. Then the slots. And then we are going for a couple of swifts at the 12th too @Jus Lukin is opting for no 'f'hole with some sound logic that, because the bridge and Superquads will hide so much of the walnut figuring, it seems a pity to lose even more with a hole in the middle of what's left. But that means that I can also now glue the top to the neck And so that's broadly what I'll be doing over the next couple of days

So last photo before turning my attention back to the headless for a few days - the finished swifts:

Putting the inlays in was normal method. Started with a pencilled outline of the inlay and then my Dremel with a 1mm bit in the precision router base, plenty of light, frequent vacuuming and a very steady hand Then mixed a generous amount of collected ebony sanding dust with some Z-poxy epoxy resin and filled the chambers with the mix: Then pressed the inlays , forcing the black epoxy out, and hence gluing them in and sealing and filling any gaps at the same time: And when that's fully cured they will be sanded flat at the same time as the pre-fretting sanding of the board itself. Nickel silver fretwire is on its way and, while all the fretboard stuff is out, I'll get on with a similar process with @Jus Lukin 's headless build

I like the colour! Wiping over with a damp cloth (squeezed out - not wet) will darken the dried stain and give you a pretty good guide to what shade it will be once you've added the finish.

And here they are: I've done two pairs. I'm pretty sure that @Jus Lukin wants a completely plain board and just side dots on his headless build, but, while I had the folding table out and cutting rest clamped to it, it was almost as quick to do a second pair at the same time just in case or for another future build. Along the same efficiency drive (don't worry, I'm sure that won't last long), then while the fret-slot mitre block I've just used for @Fishman 's board is still screwed to the workbench, I will hand mark the fret positions for @Jus Lukin 's 30" scale (I don't have a template for 30") and cut the slots on his board. For this Wal project, then tomorrow morning - when I have a bit of daylight to be able to see the pencil marks on the ebony fretboard - I'll pencil round two of the inlays, rout the recesses and fit them onto the board

And all the fretslots are done The bottom right edge is the edge of the board. You can just see the pencil mark for where the nut will come to once it's been cut to final taper. It's going to have no dots on the top (just some luminlays on the side) but just a couple of mother of pearl swifts at the 12th. I'll do that while it's still on the fretting template so it doesn't move around as I'm dremel-routing for the inlays. So this afternoon, mask on, jewellers saw out and time to cut a couple of swifts

seconded thirded

There's a feature line running through the fretboard blank that @Fishman would like to incorporate in the final fretboard. Trouble is, it is quite diagonal across the blank. We looked at a number of orientations using a template from the original board and came up with this as the closest we could get for the feature being centre-ish at both the heel and the nut: With this agreed, I could then cut one of the sides of the blank to give me a 90 degree datum for the fret slots. I also thicknessed the board down to around 5.8mm. That done, I attached the blank to the G&W mitre block 34" template: And then I could start sawing the slots. Here's about half-way through. I'll finish off tomorrow.

You probably need to sand further down. Glue (or previous finish preparation residue if it's stripped) doesn't soak in a lot - but it is surprising how much you have to sand down to get rid of it. So it's a sanding block with something like 80 grit (60 is too coarse) sanded with the grain until a wipe over with a damp cloth reveals no light patches - lighter patches usually designate the areas where the dampness isn't soaking into the wood and flags probable contamination still there (because almost all woods darken when they absorb moisture). Then - after letting it dry again, sand out the sanding marks with the progression of, say, 120, 180, 240 grit before staining again. The stain should then soak into all of the wood leaving just the teeny glue line which will hardly show (other than clearly being a join line )

I think you said that the body was going to be stained, @oldslapper ? If that is the case - while I fully endorse what @Cuzzie says, and especially thinning the oil a touch for the initial sealing coats - I would make a small but important change to the sequence. What @Cuzzie describes in terms of applying the initial coats with sandpaper is exactly the best way for unstained wood. It basically creates a slurry of oil and fine sawdust that acts as a perfect grain-fill/surface preparation that will eventually lead to a wonderfully organic silky smooth satin finish and a perfect base finish if you wanted to build up to a gloss. However, for stained wood, while using sandpaper is still done (I actually use very fine wet and dry c 1000-2000 grit), it is best not to use that for those initial coats. Stains - and especially water-based stains - are surprisingly thin. They do no penetrate the wood much at all. And if the surface is slurried at this first stage, the stain will certainly be sanded off in places. So - and I emphasise this is only for a stained finish - I would just change the sequence a touch. What I do is: - apply the sealing coats. Thinning is a great suggestion to get the oil properly into the wood. - I then apply 2-3 further coats (making sure they are dry between each coat) - and then I apply the next coat using 1000+ grit wet and dry, where the wet is oil, and gently apply the coat with the paper in a smooth gentle movement - pretty much as @Cuzzie describes. The same thing happens, but now the slurry is a mixture of hardened oil mixed with fresh oil rather than oil and sawdust. I check the paper regularly to ensure that minimal stain is coming off in the oil - if it is then let it dry and put a couple more coats on before repeating this process. For unstained, I do pretty much exactly what @Cuzzie suggests

One of the easiest - and a big favourite for many of us builders - is Birchwood-Casey Tru-oil It's easy to apply, it is pretty non-toxic and it smells vaguely of cricket bats (it's a polymerised Linseed oil based product). You can brush it on, or wipe it on with a lintless cloth and some even just use their fingers (although personally I would recommend surgical /mechanics thin rubber gloves to do that). It is also (it does smell a bit, though) perfectly possible to do on a (covered) dining table. Generally you can do at least one whole coat in a day (I do back and sides in the morning and top and sides in the evening). The first few coats will generally soak into the timber and - as you say - seal it. Additional coats start building a thickness (although it remains pretty thin once dry) and eventually a shine. It is difficult to get a full gloss with it, but a pretty decent low-gloss is perfectly achievable. There are various tips and tricks but that's what I would recommend for starters. (Oh - and a small 3fl oz bottle is PLENTY)

Hi John What kind of final finish are you looking for? Matt, Satin, Gloss? And are you happy seeing the grain in the finish or are you aiming for new car flatness? There are lots of 'spare room' options.

Although it's a more 'flying be the seat of your pants' I personally would use thin CA (cyano/superglue). I would get a version that isn't to quick in bonding and make sure it is the water-thin type. I would test it on some scrap wood first. Gorilla tends to be too thick; Bostik (the 'normal' version, not the gel) tends to be about right for me. I would mask around the area with 3M Blue decorators masking tape from Homebase (not the cheap blue knock-off from B&Q - that is dreadful stuff) and then 'wick' the superglue into the crack. Capillary action will suck the glue deep into the crack. I would apply plenty, but not that much that it all runs out. Then I would hold the sliver tightly until the glue has fully grasped it. Rubber gloves is a must and lots of ventilation - CA fumes are EVIL (and probably not at all good for you). It's the sort of thing where I would practice it in advance so I know exactly where everything is, where and how I'm going to hold it while it's curing and even where am I going to put the bottle down before I start - even the slower stuff cures quickly and there is nothing worse than it being half-glued! I would even try with an old fashioned wooden pencil and deliberately crack it and see how the glue reacts, how well it wicks and how long I've got. Thinned PVA is not a bad solution, but it is very difficult to get the glue deep into the crack because it won't 'wick' in the same way. I have used a needle-less syringe, though, in some circumstances to force thicker glue into tight cracks - even epoxy resin. That would do a half-decent job with PVA. I use the ones folks use to get medicines down their dogs and cats throats from ebay.

I call that my 'cellar by desklight' look. I believe Dulux are interested

So I chiselled the moved piece flat so that I could properly detect any movement. I didn't want to remove it because that bridge over the trussrod end thread is useful for keeping wood glue out of the thread So basically the nylon block is supposed to be fixed. Theoretically there are two timber haunches (marked in yellow) stopping it simply moving in the direction of the arrow when the trussrod is tightened. But, clearly, it has moved at some stage. It's moved forward to leave that small gap at the back and enough for the top of the nylon to snap the timber bridge over the rod. That may have happened the very first time the trussrod was tightened - it is only about 3mm thick and the force is pushing it's weakest grain line. Or it maybe that the haunches themselves are weakened and every time force is applied, the block moves forward and loses the force applied to the rod. So now I can see right up close, I can do a live stress test. First I clamp a block along the neck - I am not applying downward pressure - but I am stopping the neck rising up from flat: And now, watching the block and split wood very closely, I start tightening the trussrod. The neck can't go anywhere so the allen key starts becoming difficult to turn. I turn it to the 'luthier's touch-point' - the point where you would normally stop because you know from experience (quite) that much more will break the rod. And it passed with flying colours. No movement, no creaking, no cracking. This will be fine in service. So the neck and rod are confirmed sound and now I can get on and start making the new fretboard. In the meantime, there's a Wall 1e pro template winging its way across to me to start thinking about the body that this will eventually be fitted to. As always, thanks for looking

Well, that might be my ploy to get the thread closed down before I chisel that bit of wood away and there's a massive *POP* and I'm left covered in graphite fibres and wood chippings

Well, this morning the 4-sticks of Luminlay arrived from Japan - and one is for this save Posted in an airmail envelope in Japan on 21st Nov; Arrived UK 22nd Nov; Customs notification 10th December; £0 duty £5.80 VAT and £8.00 Royal Mail handling charge (most of the handling on their automated system was me); received 12th December And our leader is energetically and enthusiastically heading towards a no deal, no delay Brexit?? Hmmm... 2021 is going to be a joy...

Well, that chip you can see has already moved. It is split and it is misplaced. And there is a small gap behind the nylon block. The movement I am looking out for is of the white nylon block towards the headstock as the nut is tightened. The fretboard wouldn't affect that. And, of course, without knowing the full history of this second hand neck, we don't actually know whether the neck was holding relief properly in the first place - it may have been moving and losing relief. As there has clearly been some movement of something, I need to be sure - while I can do something about it if necessary - before making a new fretboard and gluing that on. I wouldn't want to have to iron the new fretboard off too It's a quick check and easily fixable in the unlikely event that there is an issue

Decent question. The wood at the two anchor ends of a single action rod take all of the force of the rod. They stay put as the rod gets shorter and so the neck has no option but to bend. So, if that is the bit of wood holding the nylon end block in place, and it is capable of moving, then - now or later - when the screw end is tightened, the nylon block will simply move with the nut and the neck won't bend. (By chiselling the wood away, I will be able to see if there is anything else holding the block in place)

So some good news and also some bits to investigate a bit further with the neck. The link that @RichardH posted is immensely useful because I can see exactly what's going on. So my first question was whether the trussrod action was self-contained. A modern two way rod bends and the neck follows it. And therefore the two ends press down on the spine at the back of the neck and the middle presses up against the middle of the fretboard. And my question was - if this works like that, then what is going to hold the fretboard from pinging off???? But looking at the photos, it was clearly a one-way rod that was fitted. And that bends the neck by pulling against two fixed points at either end of the neck itself. And that doesn't put a force on the underside of the fretboard. But only one way of finding out - tighten the trussrod and either: - the neck was going to bend even without a fretboard attached or - there would be a soft furry *ping* and I would be covered in graphite fibres It bent fine and no *ping* So there is no need to remove the graphite as the guy on the link did. But - there was one thing I had noticed even before I did this. Was this the bit of wood that the one end of the rod relies on to hold the nylon block firmly in place? : Because, if it is, that is going to need sorting. Now, interestingly, when I tightened the rod, this sliver of cracked wood didn't move at all...and that is a good sign. And when I look at one of Richard's link photos, it looks like the block is actually held by the wood projections going down the depth of the neck: (with thanks and acknowledgement to unicornbass.se for the above photo) So tomorrow I'm going to chisel that bit of loose wood away and see if I'm right. There - I said it quickly so I don't think anyone will have noticed

I got the neck blank down close to final width, with enough wiggle room to let @Jus Lukin decide whether he prefers 17mm or 18mm spacing. Based on that I was going to be cutting the back wings oversize at this stage, I was able to do this too even though the neck isn't at its final width. And added the maple veneer so I didn't forget later So we have a bass that is weeks and weeks away from finish, but at least is starting to look like a bass:

Yes - good suggestion (and @Fishman is already in contact with Wal who are supplying a few bits and pieces (and were asked but couldn't supply a replacement body) so it's not an issue. That said, I think @RichardH 's post above completely clarifies it

Brilliant find! Yes that's the kiddy Thanks

@Matt P - the sheet steel that I'm using is 0.3mm thick. In the past, I've used one of these Irwin pull saws fairly successfully - pulled through backwards (you have to wear gloves, of course ) : The advantage is that they are pretty wide and the teeth are not kerfed. Oh - and they are dirt cheap! They are actually one of my favourite flexi saws - they cut through stuff that conventional saws struggle with. I haven't measured it, but it must be a similar thickness

I'm not sure - it might just be a flat filler plate. But clearly there for a purpose..