No. 8 Wire

0949 Conducting an experiment. I'm going to measure how long it takes to discharge the 20000 mA battery to get an idea of how much 'real world' capacity is available. Plugged in a single pedal to see how long the battery lasts. Its a Mooer Tender Octaver with a (hopefully) 128 mA draw, can't measure the current to check unfortunately. The step up converters have an efficiency or around 90%, so the pedal should be using 1.28W of power, which on the 5V side equates to 256 mA current, or a max of 86 hrs battery use. So we'll see how close it gets! I've fully charged this battery, but immediately on plugging in the pedal, its already dropped to 3/4 full. Also I'm fairly sure the battery self discharges (maybe the charge control circuit always draws). So I'm fairly sure the life will be well below the ideal! After this I'll try out a representative number of pedals from the board - say 3 on and see how that goes. Edited to correct some figures!

[quote name='CameronJ' timestamp='1503514403' post='3358890'] I know what you mean, the €8 postage isn't the cheapest but to be fair I don't begrudge it as Thomann's customer service tends to be spot on. To get the postage for free you've got to spend €199 which I don't think I'll be spending this time around. Edit: the postage is actually €10...but I'm still willing to pay it. Especially when my order includes items I can't get from any shops in the UK. [/quote] I don't begrudge the postage but I usually wait until I've got a few things I need to spread the postage a bit. Bought a lot of gear from them. A bass, 2 cabs, keyboard, countless strings and small items, been happy so far.

[quote name='CameronJ' timestamp='1503510233' post='3358841'] Oh very nice. I reckon this'll be my next purchase: https://www.thomann.de/gb/harley_benton_powerplant_powerbank.htm 10,000 mAh, two 9v outputs, a USB output and a built in LED torch! Reckon I'll get myself 2 of them as an upgrade to my existing batteries (which will then serve to power my pedaltrain Nano+ instead) [/quote] That's a good price for that if you are buying something else to get free postage. I might have gone for that over my homebrew.

[quote name='CameronJ' timestamp='1503426721' post='3358161'] I suspect this is in part down to the fact you're using a USB battery pack with a 5v to 9v converter rather than a dedicated 9v pack. As you say the Line 6 M5 is quite fussy with power - I used to own one and it was always noisy when sharing power. That was before I really knew about the benefits of isolating pedals. [/quote] Its not an issue for me really as I don't in general use the M5, mostly because I find it noisy! just thought I'd give it a go on the battery in case it solved that problem. I think the noise may be to do with my house supply (especially in my practice room) though rather than the M5s fault. It does seem to affect pedals and amps (even basses) that are quiet elsewhere. Great that the Smooth Hound at 400 mA will run off its own supply.

[quote name='CameronJ' timestamp='1503399169' post='3357851'] I looked into this at length and initially thought the same re: Diago Isolator, but the limiting factor is the amount of current each Isolator can supply. The Diago can only supply up to 110mA of current whereas the Timelord can supply up to 400mA I believe. The Smooth Hound needs around 300mA so the choice here is clear. [/quote] If you're going the rechargeable battery/converter route then I would have thought a dedicated battery is the cheapest way to go - if the smooth hound will run off it. I have a line 6 M5 (500mA draw) that my battery system will not run, even though it should be within spec - all my pedals turned on at once are fine and that should be a 400-500 mA draw. That said, the M5 does seem so be particular about power supplies and also might have a start up spike that triggers the protection on the battery - its done the same with lower rated supplies before. Be good to know if something like a smooth hound with a high draw will run of one of these converter systems, even with a dedicated pack.

[quote name='EBS_freak' timestamp='1503326014' post='3357257'] I was also going to ask you, hasn't your battery got multiple outputs on? If so, you could up your maximum current draw by splitting across output sinstead of just (presumably what you are doing now) daisy chaining off a single output? [/quote] As it happens I have two converters so I tried that - it didn't like that at all. But I have figured out the issue a little bit - seems to occur if you take out the USB and put it back in while the LEDs are still flashing - they take about 5-10 seconds to reset. Replace the USB well after the lights stop and all is well. Must be some a protection measure to avoid blowing your phone or something. So panic over, all is well.

[quote name='EBS_freak' timestamp='1503324386' post='3357238'] Sounds like it could be some surge/short happens when you plug it in initially. I'm guessing the protection circuit is fairly sensitive.... and maybe the step up circuit is a bit harsh on sensor. Hmm. Dunno. [/quote] I think you are on to something, it does this whether any pedals are on or not. I'll try some experiments later.

[quote name='No. 8 Wire' timestamp='1503318225' post='3357117'] Just thought I add a word of warning on my particular rig. I keep getting a random protection function happening on the battery pack, where all 4 leds flash but no current can be drawn. Seems to be okay sometimes and not others! I think its an issue with this particular battery, so avoid the one I linked to! Just charging it to full now in case its a charge issue. [/quote] Just to update myself, something very weird going on with mine. USB in and all pedals power up, take out the USB and plug back in and the protection circuit is triggered. Put the battery on charge and it resets the protection, plug the USB back in and it works again. What is going on here?

Let us know what you use and how you get on. Could be useful to work out which are the best battery packs and converters between us.

Just thought I add a word of warning on my particular rig. I keep getting a random protection function happening on the battery pack, where all 4 leds flash but no current can be drawn. Seems to be okay sometimes and not others! I think its an issue with this particular battery, so avoid the one I linked to! Just charging it to full now in case its a charge issue.

[quote name='chrisanthony1211' timestamp='1503251241' post='3356708'] Smooth hound doesn't seem to like using a battery pack with another pedal, generates a load of noise.... [/quote] Just have a dedicated pack for the smooth hound, it'll still be cheaper and last longer than the mooer type off the shelf units.

[quote name='chrisanthony1211' timestamp='1503236026' post='3356589'] Does anyone make a battery power supply with isolated outputs? [/quote] I don't know but it would be fairly cheap to build a LiOn pack as above but use a dedicated supply to the pedal that needs the isolated supply. Edit: Are you sure you need a isolated supply at all, As I understand it noise could be coming from the power supply itself, so using a battery pack could eliminate the source. I just do this by trial and error though, so other than just give it a go, I don't have a techie type answer!

From the same seller: Mesa 360 M Pulse https://www.gumtree.com/p/guitar-bass-amplifiers/mesa-m-pulse-footswich/1261713348

[quote name='EBS_freak' timestamp='1503069889' post='3355513'] Interesting... So something like [url="https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00XVTJKCQ"]https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00XVTJKCQ[/url] and this [url="https://www.ebay.co.uk/i/192052264107?chn=ps&dispItem=1&adgroupid=41767405657&rlsatarget=pla-327666147269&abcId=1129006&adtype=pla&merchantid=113417885&poi=&googleloc=9045438&device=c&campaignid=861364981&crdt=0"]https://www.ebay.co....61364981&crdt=0[/url] ? Thats one cool looking solution! I like a lot! If I understand correctly, the on above will supply 3.4A... that would cater for most digital boards pretty easily! Obvs, you'd probably need to convert the polarity on the plug... but thats no bother in the grand scheme of things... EDIT: Now we are talking - [url="https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B012V9H3WA?psc=1"]https://www.amazon.c...012V9H3WA?psc=1[/url] [/quote] The first two are pretty much the system - just used this battery pack instead: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Magigo-20000mAh-Portable-Rechargeable-Flashlight/dp/B0716XZBB2/ref=sr_1_7?ie=UTF8&qid=1503071086&sr=8-7&keywords=magigo The 800 mA limitation comes from the 5v-9v converter itself, not the battery, I think they just lose performance if you try to draw to much, but don't know anything about that side of it. Also worth noting that the step up in voltage will drop the mA available by roughly half (at a guess), so you have a limit there too. Instead of one big pack you could use multiple small cheap ones if need be.

[quote name='EBS_freak' timestamp='1503067235' post='3355492'] With the Pros, my Enveloop solution is 2500mAh. I guess there's nothing stopping you running multiple units across a number of pedals or wiring multiple packs in parallel. Would be interested in knowing what your setup is comprised of...? Anyway... It's not just about how many pedals that your batteries can power... its about how long your power source can operate them for. You may find this interesting... [url="http://stinkfoot.se/power-list"]http://stinkfoot.se/power-list[/url] Basically, you can keep adding pedals, in my case, up to the point of 2500mA... (beyond that the pedals will be drawing more power than the power supply can physically supply) and it will power them for an hour. If you have 1250mA draw, you can power them for 2 hours... 625mA will be 4 hours... and so on. So for most analogue pedals, you can power them for ages... If you start lobbing on Strymons and other digital pedals, you are soon eating into the amount of time you can sustain the draw of power. In reality, if you have a digital laden pedal board, you are likely still going to be able to a couple of sets worth as long as you remember to turn the power on and off between playing. In short, 2500mAh / pedal draw in mAh = playing time.. (but most of you could probably figure that one out) [/quote] I had to check but as far as I can tell I can get up top 800 mA draw and the storage capacity is 20000 mAh - so a lot of time available there, but no good if you have big draw pedals. At the moment I've got a spectracomp, tender octaver, B3K, VMTD and a bass synth wah on a daisy chain. It has no issues. My system is a LiOn power bank, a step up converter from 5v to 9v and a polarity reverser. I was worried that the step up converter might introduce noise, but dead silent, at least with these particular pedals.

Also made my own, about £25 and 3 X as much energy storage as the mooer one. Mix of Amazon and eBay parts (only 3 parts). Not sure how many pedals it will power at once though, 5 so far is ok.

[quote name='NJE' timestamp='1502802887' post='3353626'] It isn't the lightest bass in the world, and it does have a slight bit of neck dive, but completely comfortable with a nice wide strap and hasn't ever slipped or taken a nose dive with me. I love the phenolic?? fingerboard, its like ebony and incredibly responsive. Over all it is a great bass for next to nothing used if you can find one. I have had a Squier vintage modified Precision V and again it was an amazing bass, so much fun to play. I would say that the nut width is thinner than the Deluxe V jazz and probably a bit narrower than my lakland 55-02. It was comfortable for me though and I struggle with tight spacing. Both great basses but tighter overall spacing on the Precision V. EDIT: Sorry I didn't realise you were looking at a different P5 not the vintage modified. [/quote] Yeah, its confusing with all the similar names Squier have used for diffrerent 5ers! I quite like an phenolic/ebonol fingerboard too. I might have to look into that one.

[quote name='Mastodon2' timestamp='1502829172' post='3353848'] How about Warwick 5s with the Broad Neck option? IIRC, it's the same neck as they use on the 6 string, but strung for 5 strings instead - really wide spacing. A bit too boaty and big for my tastes, but possibly what you're looking for? [/quote] According to theie website, broadneck is still only 47mm on a 5er. I know that doesn't tell the whole story, but not huge by 5er standards. broadneck bridge spacing is a super big 20mm though which could account for the boaty mcboat feeling. If I ever get the opportunity I'll try one out. Quite like the streamer but the other shapes have a phallus thing going on that I can't get into.

[quote name='NJE' timestamp='1502783431' post='3353425'] Squier active Jazz V has to be the bigggest neck of any 5 string I have ever seen, I have one and love it. I put a Hipshot 19mm bridge on mine if that is any help. It is an incredible bass, so well made and I have had so many compliments on the sound and playability. [/quote] That's a great help, a current model too, so that is an option. How do you find the basswood body? Is it too light for the big neck? I'm not a huge fan of basswood, mainly becasue I like natural finishes. At the moment I've got some 50mm/19mm contenders and all seem to be Squier. Squier Active Deluxe JAzz V https://www.guitarguitar.co.uk/product/07011213222329--squier-deluxe-jazz-bass-v-active-3-tone-sunburst?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI7fvVwerY1QIVp7ztCh0AgQwQEAQYASABEgILu_D_BwE Squier P 5 http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Fender-squire-5-string-precision-bass/232445314333?_trkparms=aid%3D111001%26algo%3DREC.SEED%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20160908131621%26meid%3D53329740f36e4517aebdefb3ce0f3415%26pid%3D100678%26rk%3D2%26rkt%3D8%26sd%3D172665921730&_trksid=p2481888.c100678.m3607&_trkparms=pageci%253Aa296a7e1-8192-11e7-8a59-74dbd1809b70%257Cparentrq%253Ae4fb0f6915d0a86bc8f54344fff6f183%257Ciid%253A1 And this: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Fender-Squier-Pro-Series-5-String-Bass-Rare-Collectable/172665921730?_trkparms=aid%3D111001%26algo%3DREC.SEED%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20160908131621%26meid%3D53329740f36e4517aebdefb3ce0f3415%26pid%3D100678%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D8%26sd%3D172665921730&_trksid=p2481888.c100678.m3607&_trkparms=pageci%253Aa296a7e1-8192-11e7-8a59-74dbd1809b70%257Cparentrq%253Ae4fb0f6915d0a86bc8f54344fff6f183%257Ciid%253A1 Now that last one ticks all the boxes... but also has everything I usually hate in one bass - rosewood neck, gold hardware, red body! However the more I look at it the more I'm coming round to it.

[quote name='pete.young' timestamp='1502744773' post='3353288'] I find one of the benefits of the 5 string is that you don't need to play down the neck end, which is great for people like me with short arms. Have you tried playing it on E-A-D strings on frets 6-9 ? [/quote] I do this to an extent, but I find some tunes just don't sound right moved up the fretboard. This is really the main reason I've still got the Sire, I can play up the neck as a stop-gap, but also the damn thing is just far too nice! You just can't get anything as nice as this with the range of tones for the same money (ie its used value).

[quote name='squire5' timestamp='1502735542' post='3353208'] My Squier P5 is just slightly over 50mm at the nut and string spacing at the bridge is 20mm,but dont take that as exact as I'm only using a flexible tape measure.But the nut is definitely over 50mm. [/quote] Which model is that? The one with jazz pickups? The only ones I can find for sale are the VM5s, they say in the specs that it is a 47.6mm neck.

[quote name='ikay' timestamp='1502728297' post='3353159'] Just measured my Yamaha TRB5 which is 19mm at the bridge with a 47mm nut. Actual string spacing at nut is 38mm B to G (string centre to string centre) which is more J than P so not as wide that end as you're looking for. Some figures for reference anyway. [/quote] I think you have hit on something here, my sire has a 45mm string spacing but B-G centre-centre is only a shade under 35mm, so it seems that how close the strings are to the fingerboard edge might have a lot to do with the feel. I'll look out for a TRB5 in case it feels wider than the measurement would suggest.

[quote name='Woodinblack' timestamp='1502727989' post='3353154'] Aren't the fender 5s that sort of scale? I know I can't use them because the strings are too wide for me, so I assumed it was something of that scale. Also Ibanez BTB - 19mm at the bridge and 47mm on the nut [/quote] The Fender 5's seem to have a few different widths, most common seems to be the 47.6mm for the P5. Thanks for that on the BTB, that's great to know as they are a fairly easy instrument to get hold of and have a go on.

[quote name='Bigwan' timestamp='1502725552' post='3353131'] Surprised by that... Having said that I'm not entirely convinced that the raw specs tell the whole story in cases like this. I've always been a stickler for 19mm string spacing at the bridge... or so I thought... I've come to realise it's the ergonomics of the bass as a whole that matters, not just measurement of one specific area. The Laklands and the Roscoe Beck (and my ACG 5) have asymmetric neck carves which contribute far more to the neck feel than you'd expect from looking at the measurements. If you get a chance I suggest you give them a try. Another suggestion would be a Warwick Stage 1 Streamer Broad Neck... [/quote] I think you're right about the measurement not telling the whole story. I wonder sometimes if some of them are even written correctly. I guess the only answer is to try them out. I've certainly never played an asymmetric neck, so that is something to check out. I'll look up the Warwick.

[quote name='Bigwan' timestamp='1502724545' post='3353124'] Laklands feel a good bit wider than Sire to me so I'm surprised at those measurements. Fender Roscoe Beck V is the widest I've experienced if you have the reddies... [/quote] According to the specs the Roscoe neck is 47.6mm. So a bit wider than the Sire, same as a precision v. It might be worth a look at the precision V given it should be in a shop somewhere.