drTStingray

I just think the blues rock and early rock guys were more likely to be influenced by the John Entwhistle school of thought. Fact is you could argue a lot of people sounded like they were using flats at that time - I think that's more about recording technique (both in the studio and on the instrument). They certainly didn't sound like flats live. I can get my two band Stingray to sound 'generic with flats' with rounds and the mutes engaged and a percussive technique in the studio. Its often forgotten that we are now looking at this with the benefit of hindsight. No one in the UK had a clue who was playing on Motown stuff back then and least of all it was on a P Bass with flats. Back then you certainly couldn't hear the tone properly of the players of that era anyway. Im also not trying to put people off using P basses with flats - it's certainly a good sound (especially with modern amps)

Don't underestimate the power of technique and especially muting to achieve this.

I don't have a P but have experimented with flats - I felt like I needed to be a champion arm wrestler with some (mentioned earlier in this thread). TI flats, EB Group 3s and EB Cobalt all have roughly the same tension (similar to 100-40 rounds) that I can work with. These are my basses with flats. Regarding Acoustic, they were used by loads of people in the 70s - early 80s - they are SS, very loud, and keep a clean sound at high volume (I had a 370 - 3 or maybe 400 watts and very similar in amp size to an Ashdown ABM or Trace Elliott). A revelation against Marshall guitar stacks!! I'm not surprised JPJ didn't use flats - they are very much a 60s throw back when nothing else was available and in the 70s few musicians in modern music used them - even less in the 80s when a bright sound was required. That said they sound different (although you can get close with rounds and technique). As Stingrays shipped with GHS flats up to early 78 I was keen to try them on my Classic Stingray and the TIs are still there after about 4 yrs - the Fretless has EB Cobalt flats (partially for maintenance of board reasons). That said I like the sound with them. You can call me a 70s (or/and 80s or 90s) throwback if you want but definitely not a 60s throwback 😁😁😂

I think it highly unlikely that situation will occur again - if I used that analogy id be expecting to pay £250 for a US Precision or £350 for a pre EB Stingray - clearly highly unlikely. If you think a Wal is worth £500 then that says a lot about your taste in bass sound and willingness to pay for craftsmanship, particularly when we are surrounded by US built 'production line instruments' that are 3 or 4 times that cost - as I said previously it's rarely worth getting involved in such discussion as its about personal taste. As with all antiques and collectibles prices can go up and down very significantly based on fashion (this affects the vintage market more significantly so this type of argument is more appropriate in a vintage bass thread) but surely we're talking complete collapse of a market or capitalism for any item to reduce to the price it was in the 80s/90s? Used prices of instruments do track new prices largely.

The reason I mentioned Alan Spenner was exactly because the Wal allowed the listener to hear the nuances of his playing and frankly, yes, the sound went from good to phenomenal (particularly live). This wasn't just limited to him, there are others. Join the club with Wal GAS!!

It's rarely worth arguing on matters of opinion or taste but on this occasion the idea a Wal sound is mythical is nonsense by any sensible reasoning. Why do I think this? I'll give you a couple of examples - in the early 70s one of the best bass players around was Alan Spenner - he played a Precision and made it sound good - back then many people playing Precisions sounded meh (that's if you could even hear, particularly live, any articulation). Alan changed to a Wal in the mid 70s and I saw him with a Kokomo reunion using it - the sound was incredible - extremely articulate - you can hear him on quite a few things with the Wal but most famous is his work with Roxymusic in the late 70s. Also listen to the link posted recently in the Mick Karn thread. Or any Brand X with Percy Jones for the Fretless version. This is the Wal sound - and it sounded like that live as well. Add to that the basses come from a boutique operation and they are a very popular instrument - fuelled by the love for Justin Chancellor especially in the US. Are they worth it? For me, they would be a logical step forward from a Stingray type of sound but I still don't have one having dallied with the idea a number of times. Tone wise a Wal offers more control than a Stingray, because of the filter approach to EQ - but they have some similarities in that 'fat' Bass tone. If you are completely sold on some other type of sound (eg vintage Fender or Ric) you're probably wasting your money - who knows where the values will go in the future, but isn't that a problem with any expensive instrument? Some of us remember times when shops could barely give Fender basses away so fashion does come into play. If you're a player who wants technique to be heard without having to permanently dig in, a decent variation in tones, top notch build and materials (effectively an exquisite instrument) and to have a full and punchy bass sound to underpin the music you're working in, then these are a pretty good bet. I don't think I'd go for two necks - however the fretted and Fretless sounds are equally nice and classic (imho of course) - maybe a cheaper way of getting two iconic sounds if that's what uyou want rather than buying two Wals.

Whilst other things are slightly distracting here, in line with recent Basschat themes and fashion, I'm really quite surprised no one has commented yet on the fact the bass is some variant of brown - if not the dreaded ****burst. That said, looks quite a nice bass 😊

But as we know from Pino, a Stingray does (I have one and know this as well) 😏 The necks are one piece maple - the top sliced off to insert the truss rod - and then the board glued back on - so you'd be hard pressed to see the join - and as stated its very highly figured maple (and look to be quarter sawn) so the neck plus the extra finishing etc accounts for the extra price (over a Stingray Special). There's no doubting they're very nice basses but apart from a lunch time scrutinising the pics at various shops, like @hiram.k.hackenbacker, I've been 'persuaded' I don't need any more basses - least of all another fretless!! Who knows - I might change my mind - it's less than a used CS Pino Precision - I know which I would prefer (the one without dents)!! 😬 I don't know what you guys have against roasted maple lol... ?

25 to say they wouldn't dream of having a light bulb as a candle gives a much more organic, warmer and vintage glow, very suitable for jazz but also metal.

I can imagine - those necks are crazily figured. How did you find the sound? They appear to have high gloss neck/board, plus it's a Stingray Special with 18 volt pre and neo pick up.

Well indeed, a bit like checking batteries, but nonetheless soldering at a gig seems a little more problematic than flipping a lid and replacing a battery. I'm sure people with such vintage equipment take a spare instrument just in case something 'falls off the old girl', to quote vintage Bentley owners. I wonder if a day will come when on a par with vintage cars, a vintage P Bass will de rigeur require it's operator to wear period clothing - perhaps a dapper 1960 style suit, shoes, shirt and tie a la Shadows and other beat combos of the era 😀 😏

All sounds good - my amp doesn't have a mute but excellent if you do - I always go post EQ as well, gets good results. Don't quote me but I reckon you'd be ok leaving the bass plugged in on a gig. Different matter if you're going to leave it plugged in for three months at home! I think Musicman only changed the circuit because there were active bass competitors (eg Ibanez Musician) from the end of the 70s - of course it meant the battery life would be extended - no doubt batteries are even better these days as well.

I've used these basses for about 40 yrs, and have never had a battery last less than 18 months - I never used to unplug them and have only really done so since reading some of the stories on forums. The original Stingray had the battery permanently under load (even when not plugged in) - the circuit was changed after a few years - however even with it in circuit the battery life could be counted in years rather than months - this was covered in the manual. So this really is a non-issue, often stressed about on other people's behalf by people who don't even own active basses. I always pull the end of my jack plug slightly out of the amp socket when the amp is on and the bass not being used and I leave the guitar end of the lead hanging over the bout of the bass (that way I remember to plug it in when starting a gig), and when we start the set push the lead back into the amp - avoiding all pops and bangs, and sudden onsets of feedback!! It also means the battery life is extended. As I say this really is a non problem and you're far more likely to suffer a lead failure or even a sudden dry joint in the nearly 60 yr old original wiring on your passive 62 P bass!! However for those budding inventors around, any chance you could invent an auto toilet seat lowerer - which would help avoid many her who must be obeyeds or mother in laws from maligning the entire male population for the transgression of failing to lower it on every occasion 😂👍😁

Biggest mistake of my life was to put a crap cheapo standard (non alkaline) battery in my Stingray (it lasted about 20 mins). We are talking about 1981 though. Ive generally worked on the basis that leaving the bass plugged in when you're not using it is unnecessary and at worst creates a trip hazard...... Batteries last years in my experience (using the best available). I generally use the Duracell with the blue band. I also put one of those coloured sticky spots on them with the date I changed them - just as a reminder. Its really a non issue in my experience!! And I have forgotten to unplug them occasionally. Best advice - unplug your bass when you're not using it - avoids other band members tripping over the cable and launching the bass across the floor (or someone doing the vacuuming at home). They're meant to last hundreds of hours plugged in anyway, the drain on most active basses being so small.

@Osiris If you were an orchestral player you'd be well and truly f**ked then 😂😂 Even with bass guitars of all makes, there must be a pretty high proportion in the offending hue of brown - some in brown with tort guards!! Although as @AndyTravis has pointed out, some people seem to think some brown basses aren't brown at all!! 🤔 As far as Musicman goes, I've got quite a few of their basses and the majority aren't brown you'll be pleased to hear. BUT the archetypal bass guitar colour is generally sunburst, and particularly if we're talking Fender. MM Bongos have only once or maybe twice been offered in anything remotely resembling brown as limited editions - largely because their basswood bodies almost always get solid paint colours - the brighter the better!! The LE model had an alder body and was........ Honeyburst with highly figured maple neck. Looked awesome to me 👍

Definitely not...... and you'd be banned from Talkbass if you posted that there. Its actually a bad bass copy of a guitar Ronnie Wood played (or mimed with - apparently it didn't work) on TOTP at the beginning of the 70s. Its also a bit of an old joke started by some people on Talkbass at the beginning of the 2000s - I've always thought that anyone who hadn't noticed that all electric guitars have this shape at the bridge end, and the only other features on an MM Bongo which differ from that are the rounded edges and pickguard shape are either anti Musicman or have some sort of toilet fetish (there are a lot of things in life with an oval shape)!!!! Just remember all sunburst basses and particularly those with tort pickguards are BROWN - my Mrs says so and who am I to argue 😂😁 lets hope anyone who plays one doesn't think of excreta every time they pick their bass up. As I said before, brown was a popular car colour in the 70s, hence Fender and Musicman doing the walnut colour in the late 70s. Don't let that put you off - as Luke said those pre EB Stingrays are great. Or do you have major problems putting brown shoes on as well 😧 Im thinking this thread had gone a little anti - Musicman - one thing their basses and particularly the Bongo don't do is sound like the sort of things which do go on in the toilet - which is something some basses do. The word begins with F btw 😏

Now if I'd posted a pic of a vintage one with more red in it, I think you'd have hit the nail on the head 👍😬

Whilst we're in lavatorial fetish mode this has quite vile diahoretic connotations...... 😁

This is the same colour........ this one is mine and is a thing of great beauty 👍😀

I've heard it referred to as used nappy colour.....(ps that's not my photo and don't know who's copyright it is). Very rare and quite reveered colour option!! Btw snotburst is surely a patented Fender colour?!!

I'm guessing the effect is marginal in terms of overall strength in the requirements of a bass guitar. I haven't noticed a difference - they still dent and ding like regular maple. One thing no-one has mentioned is a very minor, but interesting side effect - the smell of maple syrup if you get your nose very close to the neck. I noticed it when I first got my MM Sabre - it was after a long gig in very humid conditions - I leaned over the bass whilst getting a gig bag to put it in. Now before people rush to Andertons (or any other popular stockist) and start sniffing Stingray necks, it was not me who said this!! 😂 MM standard v roasted maple - they look very similar (NB this is not a Stingray Special neck - it's a flamed neck on a limited edition bass)

Haha!! I hadn't appreciated that. I bet like most players who play sunburst and the usual bass suspects, we don't see them as brown - which they all are to an extent - as evidenced by my Mrs's non-expert view. Unless you've got for instance a blue or red one, you're stuffed - it's brown!! However none are as brown as walnut or mocha (which is what us bass players think of as brown - NB brown was a very popular car colour in the UK in the 70s as well - along with purple, lime green and orange - must be an era thing as that's when walnut was popular as a bass colour).

My Mrs tells me most basses are brown - of all types - and she's always right 👍😂 She calls my natural ash Stingray 'that wooden bass' 🤔

Probably walnut. They do another brown one called sunburst.... That Musicman is an odd colour - and what's happened to the fret markers? It looks like a darker honeyburst. There is a far simpler solution. Email the serial number to Ernie Ball Musicman Customer Services and they'll tell you - I'm guessing it's a non standard one if only from the lack of fret markers. My assertion has always been that bass players are higher up the evolutionary scale than drummers - and guitarists - if some of the Basschat contributions to this thread is anything to go by, and is representative of all bass players at large, I may have to reappraise that view....... You guys should have a go at defining Musicman trans green - now there's a colour!!

You guys aren't helping in the least...... apparently the neck and board have a high gloss finish. I already have a Musicman Fretless (indeed used it last weekend having seen this - used it with an octaver at one point - very Pino sounding 👍) - but these BFR ones look spectacular. I wonder how they will feel to play and sound? Only one way to find out I guess.