drTStingray

[quote name='Mykesbass' timestamp='1488878383' post='3252507'] And possibly the original Subs? Sorry, I was also including guitars in this, as I'm pretty sure the Luke was Basswood, and if you think tonewood is a hot potato among bass players don't get guitarists started on the subject!! [/quote] The Subs and early/mid 90s solid colours on SR4 and 5 are poplar (I think the Steve Morse guitar is also). I think body wood and fretboard wood makes a difference (I base this on the fact I have Rays with ash, poplar and alder bodies - but there are lots of other elements which change things a bit) but it's all fairly marginal IMHO. As you say, basswood is fine.

[quote name='Mykesbass' timestamp='1488811635' post='3251952'] Nothing wrong with basswood (apart from it looks boring). Music Man use it under solid finishes. [/quote] Slight correction for the uninitiated - basswood is used only on Musicman Bongo basses. I read somewhere that when the bass was being developed it was found to colour the sound least of all tried at prototype stage. That said, and probably concurring with the theory about aesthetics rather than sound, the higher priced limited PDN models often feature different body wood/ trans finish, even on Bongos.

[quote name='mcnach' timestamp='1488535937' post='3249707'] there's something there about wanting to be yourself etc... for sure, don't be a pushover. But a band is a group of people and that is going to mean discussion and compromise, unless you're all clones and think 100% alike all the time, or you're all hired hands (in which case you'll do as told,, full stop, and smile for the cameras if they want you to ). I think many hobbyist musicians (like myself) can get a little too precious about their gear and what they play. I've seen this coming from insecurity in some cases, from sheer bloodymindedness in others, selfishness... and a few times because their artistic integrity was superior. In other words: I've never experienced that attitude to be a positive thing. Just like being a pushover will also not take you to anywhere nice either. It's a balancing act. You have your preferences. Others have other preferences. Together you push and pull and discuss and sometimes even argue, why not? an argument does not have to be something where someone is trying to subjugate another... in the end, if you have sufficient in common, you end up moving in a direction you've collectively decided, and carry on. You need to be flexible. And balanced. Leave your egos in a pocket of the gig bag, locked. You'll have more fun. [/quote] I tend to agree with this, in all aspects except instruments and equipment (unless there's a particular sound issue). My personal experience over 40 odd yrs as a semi pro has been this issue crops up rarely but when it does it's usually a portent for other 'controlling' behaviour - it's also notable that most of the people doing it I have encountered have been technically weaker or indeed the weakest musician in the group, and simply ill informed or wrong (not just when commenting on fellow musician's instruments or sound either). You have to decide whether you can tolerate it or not. I have known people asking others to have their guitars resprayed because it doesn't match the band (in one case the self styled leader had an aversion to a certain colour!!). The bottom line is you do come across controlling and irrational behaviour in music groups but thankfully it's not a regular issue in my experience. A high turnover of musicians is often a pointer to potential issues!!

Also the Reflex and 25th Anniversay have ceramic I think - only available used - there's a 25th in the for sale now. There is also the Bongo but that does not really get a Stingray sound. All of these are few and far between to try out.

I forgot to mention - the Classic and Old Smoothie basses have lacqured necks (not at all sticky though) whereas the standard Stingrays have oil and wax finished necks.

Not really - they're 2 band so plenty of bass and treble boost available - remember you can get a quite different sound dependent on whereabouts between the neck and bridge you pluck the strings. I usually set mine full bass and almost full treble - roll back the EQ to accentuate the mids if you want a staccato sort of sound. Worth trying with the mutes rolled on as well. I suggest you try the amp set flat initially - remember if you scoop the amp a lot (or use pre set amp filters like the Markbass, it's possible to overemphasise the bass (say on E and A strings). They're generally very good, consistent basses with few problems. I hope it goes well.

There's some confusion in this thread though quite a lot of info is right. SR4 is just an abbreviation for Stingray 4 - you can guess what an SR5 is. New current spec Stingray 4 string comes in a variety of colours, a hard shell case, can be had with rosewood, maple or pau ferro (Fretless) fingerboard, and with 2 or 3 band EQs and can be had in bolt on or neck through configuration or with H, HH or HS pick up configurations. The bolt on can be had with a narrower neck profile (ordered as an SLO special), they all have ash bodies (occasionally a PDN limited edition model may have a different wood such as alder). There are other models including the classic Stingray (2 band 4 or 5 string with highly figured neck wood, and other retro features like string through body bridge with mutes) - there's also an old smoothie version of the classic with a different pick up and other features. The classic, old smoothie and neck thru are higher priced than the normal model (because they have higher grade materials and features) - this may be why a 2 band appears more expensive than a 3 band - but possibly comparing standard model with classic. The normal model in 2 band form should be slightly cheaper - natural body colour commands a mark up on price also. A few years back, the standard SR4 (i.e not classic etc) was available from some dealers for £999 in red, white or blue, with 2 band EQ and a gig bag - there may be one or two still around - this was back when the economy and particularly dollar v pound values hadn't changed greatly so if you find one, it will be a bargain (and likely more than £999 now). The poplar body won't make much difference and was used in the early 90s for all of the solid colour SR4s and SR5s. Maybe slightly mellower than ash at the extremes. The US Sub Stingrays also have poplar bodies. You are right there is a vast range of prices but if you order new they will be reasonably similar - used prices vary greatly - some of the more unusual specs and colours sometimes command much higher prices - depends if people want them (basic supply and demand).

The two humbuckers on the Warwick $$ seem to be side by side around the centre of the section between the bridge and the end of the neck. In fact the neck pick up looks to be in the same position as the MM neck pick up. The Musicman bridge pick up is in the usual place, whilst the neck humbucker is placed about the width of a humbucker closer to the neck than the bridge one. Remember the Musicman is based on coil selection and certainly on my Classic Sabre, selecting the inner cool of the neck humbucker produces a good Precision sound. The outer neck humbucker coil is around the Jazz neck position and there are settings where you can have neck and bridge single coils to approximate Jazz sounds. I don't have a Warwick $$ but have played one and I think the bridge humbucker is in the gap between the pick ups on the Musicman one. However the bass designs are quite different - the Musicman seems to aim to give you the single pick up MM sound but adding a few other alternatives which it achieves - my HH Ray and Sabre are the most versatile basses I have. The G and L seems to have the bridge pick up in a similar position to the MM one but the neck pick up closer to the bridge one. Once again a different take on it. The Gibson and Fender Telecaster bass (later version) have humbuckers right next to the end of the neck. Yet another approach!!

I haven't played one but heard Dave Marks play one once - it basically adds some quite nice string sound and an airy sort of acoustic sound. I'm afraid you will have to try one to appreciate it. I have a Bongo 5HHp however and use the piezo almost permanently mixed about 70% magnetic and 30% piezo - it basically adds an element of warmth to the sound. Mixed 100% the piezo makes a rather nice and unique sound when playing hip hopesque R and B - especially down low and on the B string. I understand they're pretty good on a Musicman Fretless though I've never tried one. I think the Dave Marks Stingray demo was Fretless possibly and the string sound was reminiscent of an upright. They're pretty few and far between at all let alone on a Fretless - best of luck tracking one down 😕

[quote name='LewisK1975' timestamp='1487945950' post='3244440'] Third! [/quote] Only to be exceeded by manhandling a Hammond B3 up fire escape stairs - followed by the Leslie unit 😯 - definitely a four man (burly) job - who says bass players have the heaviest gear!!!

Bloo*y hell you do hear about/come across some finicky people in bands from time to time!! I do like the guy who writes for a Precision bass - which one would that be, JJ Burnel on Peaches by the Stranglers, James Jamerson or maybe it was Roger Waters when he sounded like he was desperately after a Chris Squire Rickenbacker sound. Total nonsense of course as was proved with the changes in basses!! I think the points about people being controlling is well made - and they are best avoided because unless you're incredibly thick skinned and can ignore it, it will eventually lead to great stress or fisticuffs or something similar. I played for quite a while in a band where the self styled leader had some sort of OCD syndrome and was want to pick on individuals for instance requiring them to line their amps up exactly together, and against the back wall of the stage or room - and yes I did refuse as my rig needed space for the porting to work - this was the tip of the iceberg though as lead colours, strap positions and colours, music stands, drinks holders, set lists, drum stick holders you name it came in for treatment over an extended period - it was both funny and exasperating all at once. I would have great worries about people telling me what bass to play because it would probably be an indication of a general approach and in any case, most times I've encountered this type of thing, the person concerned is completely wrong anyway, and basically lacking in knowledge in the art of bass. It sounds like Lee Sklar has had that experience - the producer switch lol!! I also read an interview by Marcus Miller where he talked of using the bridge pick up on his jazz but being told to turn it off because of the supposed inherent hum - which he did and then turned it back on whilst they weren't looking. I like the idea of encouraging these guys to buy you a bass - do you reckon they'll have a view on the strings to use, and amp and speakers? I'm afraid I'd be off in a shot but that's just me!! You'll find people with ill informed prejudices and fixed viewpoints on things throughout life - it doesn't mean you have to follow them though.

I think you're doing Gibson a disservice here. It doesn't look that different than a Fender Dimension bass and I don't recall anyone complaining that was generic, derivative or even a copy of an EBMM - which it clearly is in some ways 18v electronics screams Bongo but that is in a whole different league. Remember two of the greatest bass players to walk the planet, Jack Bruce and Andy Fraser both made their names with the thicker sounding EB3 (Precision and Jazz were thin sounding things by comparison) and although weren't famous for putting generic bass on pop records (as session players) but providing bass on some of most jammers, rockers, bluesers and general muso's favourite songs - certainly the bass heavy ones. So give em a break guys. I'm no Gibson fan but I do worry that players on forums are too tied to the ubiquitous Fender models which are ok, adequate or even great in very skilled hands - but remember the main reason they waned in popularity for some players until the 'retro is king' era starting in the mid 90s - players were saying 'ok I can play Schooldays but it sounds crap on my Precision'. Not sure how it would sound on this Gibson either but it looks to have a whole lot more capability for varied sounds than a P bass to me (for those who want to play a bit more than generic vanilla bass, that is). I'll try one if I see one!! I love Fenders btw - just haven't believed they were the last word in bass since the late 70s!!

Musicman have Tim Commerford playing their basses so fairly similar I guess. I can understand people wanting to play something that looks like what Flea uses but seriously - a Fender body and neck with an Aguilar copy of a Musicman circuit and pick up? Far easier to play a black and rosewood Stingray which is what Flea has been pictured with in the past, and will make an equally good sound, but with the legendary Musicman quality and playability. I'm a big fan of Flea and was very tempted by the Mexican road worn Flea Jazz - I don't think I would go to the expense of a Custom Shop special of this bass though, particularly when a bog standard Stingray would do the job all day.

Have I got this right, the current bass player can't play the bass parts on the new album? Which begs the question who wrote them - it's normally the bass player in my experience? In which case the problem doesn't arise....

I have done exactly this several years ago - mine was ABM500 + 1x15 + 2x10 for LM3 + 2x10 standard and 2x10 Traveller. It's a more focussed sound for all the styles of music I play and is perfect with the Musicman basses I use. The other thing is that this is borne out by You Tube clips showing similar songs before and after. I still have my Ashdown equipment and use it at home and may occasionally use it for gigs. My back much prefers the Mark Bass equipment and I can always get a great sound with it - either of the 2x10 cabs are usable on their own for small to medium gigs also.

[quote name='geoffbyrne' timestamp='1486031873' post='3228606'] Look at film from the 50's - everyone (pretty much) played thumb style. G. [/quote] However electric bass was largely irrelevant in GB until the end of the 50s (helped by import restrictions) - and even in the US was the exception rather than the rule.

[quote name='sbrag' timestamp='1485979571' post='3228256'] There was a Chas and Dave documentary out a couple of years ago where i belive they claimed that this has been the most sampled piece of music ever. Chas and Dave are hip hop legends. Gertcha [/quote] I saw that and Dave explained how the bass part had been the basis of that part of the Labi Siffre song - everything builds around the bass and drum pattern. Actually I came across Chas Hodges as the sessions bass player on an album I bought in the early 70s called the London Sessions, by Jerry Lee Lewis - I bought it because of the featured guitarists including both Lees, Albert and Alvin. I then found Chas Hodges to have played bass with Heads Hands and Feet, including playing bass on Country Boy - it's all good stuff! So these guys really were in the sessions scene and other famous bands well before the Chas and Dave stuff - though I was always impressed with Dave's bass parts on that. The Eminem sample sounds just that - a sample straight from the track with the addition of the DJ scratching. I rather like the Eminem track as well!

[quote name='SpondonBassed' timestamp='1485980496' post='3228269'] I looked up the acronym you used and found this; http://acronyms.thefreedictionary.com/PBFS Can we eliminate some of those definitions please? [/quote] Lol - I made it up - Pretty Bloo** F****ng Sure 😀

[quote name='ians' timestamp='1485976998' post='3228224'] umm...isn't it all in the fingers anyway? [/quote] Well apparently lots of those guys using 'passive' instruments in the late 70s put them through such gizmos as the Alembic pre amp - thus - aherm - preamping them!! Also I've heard of people using Sadowski floor pre amps. Nate Watts is a good example re the Alembic in the studio (some of the famous Songs in the Key of Life tracks) - he later used a Stingray which of course has the onboard preamp. I'm guessing a decent proportion of all of this is in the fingers as you say. I personally prefer the sound of an on board pre amp (well a Musicman one at least) and dislike the colouration given by some passive instruments. That said modern active EQ amps help a lot of passive instruments to get over some of the issues they had with audibility in the 70s/80s.

[quote name='SpondonBassed' timestamp='1485964614' post='3228085'] Who T F made Leo the boss of bass anyway? [/quote] It's funny you should say this - back in the late 60s Jack Bruce was God of Bass and Andy Fraser was the apprentice God of Bass as far as I was concerned - both played EB3s. Despite this fact, I lusted after a Precision - despite Leo Lyons and John Paul Jones being my other bass Demi-Gods and playing Jazzes. I suppose having another bass Demi God in Larry Taylor (who played one of those funny slab bodied Precisions at the time) just about justified my choice. Oh and at the time no one knew who the **ck Jamerson was, only that there were some tasty and audible bass lines on Tamla records with rumours of them being played by a housewife in her spare time. How times have changed!!!

[quote name='Hobbayne' timestamp='1485967291' post='3228120'] No. Jack Horner married one of the Spice Girls. [/quote] Lucky chap!!

[quote name='Hobbayne' timestamp='1485954545' post='3227962'] This is the 1962 P Bass used by Greg Lake. Note the tugbar under the G string. Bassists back in the day used to grip with the index and middle fingers while plucking the strings with the thumb. [/quote] Amazing - I'm PBFS he used a Fender Jazz when I saw him with Emerson Lake and Palmer back in the 70s and also with KC before that? He also played rather nice acoustic guitar as well - I hadn't appreciated he'd gone back to the 1959 rudiments at some stage 🤔 With regard to the tug bar, back in the late 60s when I got interested in these things, unless you played with your fingers bass players were rather thought of as dabbling guitarists or worse still, those clicky plectrum things on the 'bubblegum' pop music of the day, as opposed to proper progressive music (or jazz/R and B ) so it was really an anachronism from the late 50s. As is often the case with Messrs Fender and timely (or not usually) response to customer practice and need, they moved the tug bar to the top to facilitate 'proper' finger style bass playing in the early 70s just at a time when slap bass was taking off in R and B, and thus rendering it virtually impossible on a standard Precision without removing said tug bar. Of course, parking your plucking hand in one place by using the tug bar rather limits the change in sound you can get by varying somewhere between the bridge and the neck. But so do the chrome covers (even more so on a Jazz). All that said, a Fender without a tug bar in the traditional place for the era (and chrome covers) just doesn't look right to me but that's just me being OCD probably 😉

Mark King Superb bassist. For me a bass review should show the versatility of the bass in a whole range of styles. Those styles may include slap, picked, bread and butter pop from various eras, Palm muted, 70s/80s/90s fingerstyle, with effects for electronic - basically as much as possible to give an indication of how it would fit a range of people's requirements. The amp and speaker set up (if used) should not colour the sound too much (I have found some types of set up scoop mids and top very badly thus limiting the sound of the bass itself). I have found in my experience that there are some bass players who limit their playing to narrow genres - no problem if that's what they want to do - however the only people I've come across who don't like slap are bass players (many of whom haven't even bothered to learn to play it) and guitarists who object to a bass being anything but a low pitched background rumble. On the contrary audiences seem to love it if used tastefully (basically the same proviso as for any technique). In the 80s it was entirely possible to come across bass players who could ONLY play slap 😮 To omit one particular style because it offends some people's sensitivities seems daft to me - if you transfer this to a drum demo, much of that is genre specific - so would you miss out rockabilly because it offends bread and butter rockers - I think not!!

[quote name='rodney72a' timestamp='1485307598' post='3223054'] Like this, you mean? (Not mine, I should add - these are from a friend who was at NAMM.) [url="http://s1275.photobucket.com/user/72arodney/media/IMG_1917_zpsjcfttzac.jpeg.html"][/url] [url="http://s1275.photobucket.com/user/72arodney/media/IMG_1918_zpsirqoxtre.jpeg.html"][/url] [url="http://s1275.photobucket.com/user/72arodney/media/IMG_1919_zpsbfeqbuhi.jpeg.html"][/url] [/quote] My lord that is an awesome looking bass 👍 But how does the new price compare to a post Brexit Fender Custom Shop bass price? On the question of Cites, I suspect all manufacturers are having a headache created by not only this but the situation with the new Commander in Chief's plans for the US which would appear to the onlooker to affect most instrument manufacturer's current business models.....no doubt all of these changes (including the changes here with the EU) will create a significant period of turbulence ...... and possibly even bigger prices. I hope you get your Starry Night bass soon.