drTStingray

Steve Pearce is listed in the band bio on that page. Has Paul Turner replaced him or is he also covering?

[quote name='rodney72a' timestamp='1461719165' post='3037144'] [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]You call this wear?[/font][/color] [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Take a look at this one then - a 1961 stack-knob which was sold several years ago by an American dealer:[/font][/color] [url="http://s1275.photobucket.com/user/72arodney/media/p2_uvy40uh0p_so_zpshlxhxbku.jpg.html"][/url] [url="http://s1275.photobucket.com/user/72arodney/media/p3_u25an430t_so_zpssmvrvb0b.jpg.html"][/url] [url="http://s1275.photobucket.com/user/72arodney/media/p1_ugu5ptgpc_so_zps0lzstkim.jpg.html"][/url] [/quote] Good grief - that's what you call distressed finish! Hardware looks pretty good though. I noticed even the stack knob Jazz Fullerton reissues from the early 80s have a higher price - one at Andy Baxter for £2750 currently.

[quote name='Jebo1' timestamp='1461444130' post='3034746'] Whatever people decide to play is cool with me as long as they've got groove and a bit of soul it's all good! [/quote] Yep + 1

[quote name='Jebo1' timestamp='1461439407' post='3034697'] I couldn't really stop the gig and go and get a battery, so I plugged in a passive Fender. Problem solved, Warwick sold. Extreme example and certainly nothing to do with the quality of Warwicks, I just won't use them after that. Superstitious nonsense I'm sure. [/quote] I haven't gigged with a passive bass since around 1980 - always carry spare batteries after a problem many years ago. Good job your spare (vintage?) Fender didn't need a quick truss rod tweek as well eh? I don't think this thread was intended to morph into a passive v active thread but in response to this, it has to be said that a passive Fender creates a significantly thinner and certainly different sound from your typical Warwick/Wal/Musicman bass - I went to a gig of a famous band whose sound was founded on a Warwick sound - the bass player used a passive vintage Fender - it actually changed the sound of the band (for the worse as far as I was concerned) - love the bass player, one of my favourites - just couldn't hear them properly. I've heard the reverse as well - famous early 70s band - famous player used a (now) vintage Fender in the day - used a Wal and suddenly you could hear the intricacies of their playing. So swapping to a vintage bass may suit some sartorial/fashion/bassist's current preference imperative - but it can play havoc with the 'band' sound. All dependent on your personal perspective and preference.

You are right, it's personal opinion and quite a lot of people would agree with your view. Is the price of the vintage hyped - in terms of sound and playability my view is yes. If you look at it like antiques, the prices go up and down as they are more or less fashionable. Certain types of antiques which were worth a lot 20 yrs ago aren't any longer and vice versa. They're hostage to fashion and the views of different generations towards them - and some of the changes happen when whole generations pass away. Put it this way, it seems entirely possible for vintage instruments to dip and rise in fashion.

[quote name='paulmcnamara' timestamp='1461415998' post='3034460'] Just thinking lately about bass icons such as Jameson and Jaco and how at their pinnacle they were using Fender basses that were probably no more than 10/12 years old, and yet we seem to put so much emphasis on 'needing' to use or desiring a vintage bass when really these guys show us that its all in the fingers and head? [/quote] Indeed - and back in the 70s most of the best bass parts seemed to be played on newish instruments. Back in the 70s I played in a soul band and the Jamaican origin guitarist, a self confessed Hendrix fan, played a daphne blue Strat with a small headstock and non TV style logo - I was deeply suspicious he'd been ripped off with a copy because it wasn't the sort of Strat anyone played then - however it was a 50s guitar ........... these days I'd instantly recognise that. The point is that these things come into and go out of fashion - I suspect there are a whole lot of reasons other than playability why 'vintage' instruments are so sought after that even knackered examples command decent prices. And despite what anyone protests, unfortunately this does currently afflict Fenders (guitars and basses) and Gibson (guitars mostly) where some command silly prices. Take 80s Fender basses for instance - panned and uncool at the time, yet some are now becoming reveered! I quite like the idea of owning a vintage bass but every time I explore the idea I have an overwhelming desire to buy a new or newer bass. I suspect the allure of vintage guitars has as much to do with individual's nostalgia as anything else - retired chaps buying them as some have plenty of spare money and tons of nostalgia for the late 50s/early 60s bands. As a youth of the 70s, will my generation, which is associated far more with 70s instruments, cause the price of 70s stuff to rise in price when it becomes like the Hank Marvin followers of now and the latter are not around - and will the 60s instruments become less popular? Who knows but some of the old basses are very lovely - worth the value of a new Wal? Daylight robbery in my book but that's just me! I'd take a new instrument any day (and remember when the bass is mixed in a recording, who would know whether you've used a £5000 P bass or a £500 one?).

[quote name='badboy1984' timestamp='1461216896' post='3032465'] Well after trying to get a similar tone last night, I come to a conclusion is myself that has the problem. I can get a similar tone with the right EQ but is me thats no use to playing with the tone. Is one of those things, I got a tone in my head that i want or like but when i actually come to use it I can't get use to it. For some reason when something is not sounded right I just crack the bass up abit and gone back to my fretted tone. I do get more of that fretless tone when i play near the neck tho. [/quote] If you haven't got a mid range tone EQ control on the bass have you tried upping it on your amp a little? That in combination with where you pluck the strings may help.

As I understand it (and my understanding of vintage guitar collectibles is not great) but generally vintage basses are nowhere near as collectible as vintage guitars. So it's not unusual to see vintage Strats etc going for 4 + times more than an equivalent era Fender bass ....... I guess this simply reflects the respective value of guitarists v bassists ....... cough cough no that was a mere jest - I suspect it reflects the difference in demand. THAT IS EXCEPT the stack knob Jazz bass is the only bass generally on a par with the most sought after guitars, collectibility wise. So that's why pristine ones are £20k and this 'distressed'/'well worn' one is the price it is - plus it's said to have been owned by one of the most iconic bassists of the last three + decades. No I don't get it either - in fact I'd much rather buy a new bass as, like with a new car, I love the feel, smell, notion of a brand new item - plus I tend to not buy makes where its alleged you need to try 25 before you find 'the one', be it cars, basses or anything else - come to think of it only shopping with women (who all seem to want to try 25 items in different shops before buying the first one they looked at) seems to be on a par with the established method published by some for buying some types of musical instrument. I certainly didn't buy 25 Golf GTIs before I found 'the one' either - I may have changed my mind on the colour suitability for example after a time but that was me changing my mind rather than anything to do with the car. Going back to what I said - yes I can see why it's the price it is - but no I don't get it either!!

I have a fretless Ray (largely because I like Pino's playing so much from that era - well from all eras, and Jaco, who you can also attempt to emulate with it). Several points - that type of sound (note swell/mwah) is present on my fretless Ray acoustically - the construction/design of the bass create that - the tone controls/pre amp etc add to that (in my case, the guitar has a three band EQ and the mid range control can be used to pump up or lower the amplified sound of the mwah and harmonics - a 2 band Ray like Pino's can be adjusted by dropping the bass/treble controls to bring up the mid range). Notice where he's plucking the strings and how he varies the position/intensity to change the attack. The level of skill and control is great (way beyond me). Finally, if you watch him playing the same bass with Paul Young on the Live Aid show and other performances you'll see how he turns it from a fretless tone monster into a snarling funk and slap machine at will. It's the characteristics of the bass plus an extremely talented player.

[quote name='Grangur' timestamp='1460995570' post='3030488'] If the "customer requirements" are lower prices then, if you're building in the west, then there's only so far you can go. If a factory worker in China earns £250 a month, that's always going to present a problem to a western commercial organisation. At this time, whatever you make in the west, you will never beat the Chinese on price until the worlds economy changes. But it is changing, slowly. [/quote] This is true now but doesn't explain why UK and US motor markets (and electric instrument and white goods markets) got infiltrated by Japanese manufacturers in the 60s/70s/80s. They simply produced a more consistent product which met customer expectations - all the more surprising as in the 50s and early 60s, anything with the moniker 'Made in Hong Kong' or similar was a watch word for cheap rubbish. The later Japanese stuff was anything but and even more so now, the brands have a good reputation for making well engineered stuff which is reliable and lasts (eg Toyota cars, Yamaha instruments etc etc).

The Japanese copy basses became quite popular in the 70s - I had one (an Antoria Jazz Bass copy). It was a good intrument that I had as a present - I would have preferred a Fender as that was the bass of my dreams but hey ho, this was a good second best. The Japanese imports started to gain favour with motor cycles starting in the late 60s and then cars in the 70s, and basically gave a reliable, well built (for the time) vehicle with decent performance but more importantly came fully loaded (eg radio and everything else as standard). Your average British car didn't always meet all of these requirements and the manufacturers attitudes to 'extras' like a radio etc was you could have them, but at extra cost. This disrespect for customers resulted in considerable inroads into the market by foreign imports, especially Japanese. They seem to have done something similar with musical instruments from the 70s on with Yamaha covering a range of different instruments. Those guitar and bass copies (which only resembled them - were not totally identical initially) were around at a time when the needs of those aspiring to a decent instrument for a lower price could not afford a Fender or Gibson. I guess the Squiers of the 80s were a response to this but were really entry level basses. The more recent up market guitars (Sadowski etc) seem to meet another niche which the main manufacturers may have been slow to respond to. There was indeed a court case not too many years ago which Fender (I think) lost, but may have outlawed copies (in the 2000s sometime?). IMHO the bottom line is the copies generally started because of an inability or reluctance for the major manufacturers to respond to what the public wanted. Now there's a shock...... Fender/Gibson etc unresponsive to customer requirements!!

Strangely, I'd be the opposite. If I was spending that much money, and knowing what they offer, I'd be wanting to order my exact spec. As I understand it you do it through a custom shop dealer and you fill in a build sheet which details all the options, some of which are only available as master built rather than team built. There's a thread somewhere on Talkbass about it, and a PDF of the build sheet, which runs to several pages. Presumably the quotation you get is for UK prices. Haven't done it myself but have thought about it.

[quote name='Jimbogubson' timestamp='1460057337' post='3022264'] Any love for the dimension bass out there and can it make stingray noises? [/quote] As they have 18v electronics compared with the 9v of a Stingray, if there is any comparison to be made with a Musicman surely it's with a Bongo. never having played a Dimension myself I don't know - from what I've heard in sound samples they don't really sound like either.

[quote name='hiram.k.hackenbacker' timestamp='1459957237' post='3021270'] Just under £2.4k. [/quote] £200 uplift on standard Classic Stingray at GAK - quoted at £2149 - and yes I'm thinking of getting one!!

These Tony Levin OLPs are quite rare. I remember when they came out an article with Tony Levin indicated he worked with the company to tweak the pre amp so they do actually have a 'Tony Levin signature preamp', always presuming someone else hasn't swapped it out previously. People say great things about the John East Stingray pre amp, which I have heard said is based on his 76 Stingray. However, information now coming to light from posts on the EBMM bass forum, based on company records shows there to have been a series of pre amps used on the pre EB basses - and up to a major upgrade in late 1978, they were all doused completely in epoxy - unless John's bass was one of those which went back to the factory for rectification and got the free pre amp upgrade as part of the work. Long and short, it's your bass, up to you to do what you like, but the pre amp should be a TL special rather than the standard OLP.

[quote name='Highfox' timestamp='1459753584' post='3019126'] I'm pretty much the same with them, took them off after one gig, sounded nice but far too stiff for me to enjoy fingerstyle. [/quote] Me too - made my Stingray 5 virtually unplayable. But I love flats (with sensible tension) - you needed to be an arm wrestler to play my SR5 with that particular make and model of flats.

[quote name='Mudpup' timestamp='1459286495' post='3015220'] Thats actually the difference between a 3eq and a 2eq Ray there - its not the fretboard that sounds different....... [/quote] That may well be, without knowing how he set the EQs on the basses it would be difficult to know. However I have both rosewood and maple boarded Stingrays and they sound quite different, particularly the slap sound. Rosewood has a darker sound and is slightly more mellow.

[quote name='RhysP' timestamp='1459288977' post='3015254'] I'm no expert on Musicman stuff, but I believe the Classic range was introduced a few years back and was meant to be a recreation of the earlier, pre Ernie Ball basses, and also a new 5 string model with the same characteristics as the four string. So your 93 will indeed have some of the features that the Classic range has, but it isn't a classic. I'm sure one of the forums many Stingray fanatics will be along shortly to tell me I'm wrong..... [/quote] You're nearly right!! The Classic series was introduced in 2010, and is a combination of the features of an early 90s bass (figured maple neck; 6 bolt neck joint; long bridge with mute system; wheel truss rod adjuster), with pre EB features like slab, non contoured body and strings through body. There are other features which are different (hollow saddles; chrome truss rod adjuster; 7.5 in neck radius). Whoever said you can't get a 2 band sound with a 3 band fitted bass is incorrect - i can certainly get a good approximation with a specific EQ setting (noting that the 3 band has more mid range at centre detent - thus you have to cut it slightly - boosting bass and treble a little will also help). The Classic model is available only in 2 band EQ form - the regular model in 2 or 3 band form, and the multi pick up version in 3 band form only. There is a neck through model also which is available with all of the pick up/EQ options. They're all available with rosewood or maple fingerboards and the standard Stingray in fretless form also (lined or unlined). The 3 band is a little more flexible than the 2 band in a live setting IMO. In multi pick up form there's further versatility.

Cripes nearly all of you think it's gross misconduct so instant dismissal........ I would confess to having been drunk on stage once or twice in my youth ........ but only as hilariously as other incidents like the drummer's stool breaking and him falling off the back of the stage in the middle of Put Your Money Where Your Mouth Is by Rose Royce - all the more hilarious because this particular drummer was v flash both in dress and his choice of kit - all see through shells with gold and red stripes...... Even if we are talking a fully pro outfit I would have thought a firm rollocking plus a bit of gentle persuasion and diversion at future gigs would have the desired effect. I've seen famous pros pissed on stage before now - and they didn't get thrown out. I think you should all lighten up a bit!! It's not as if he nicked the singer's missus or something!!

The Classics aren't reissues either as they are a hybrid of a pre EB Stingray (slab body) and an early 90s Stingray (6 bolt neck joint, wheel truss rod, long bridge with mutes), figured maple neck. It sounded ok to me - in fact rather good. You clearly aren't a fan (I recall your comments about EBMM necks being appalling - which many including me would take issue with) - so why bother?

[quote name='Schnozzalee' timestamp='1459007465' post='3012807'] Hmm...Can't get past the Marketing BS. [/quote] Well it's obviously a marketing video ultimately but there's no BS in it - I guess you're hearing things or something.........

Interesting video and makes me want one of these all the more. Sterling Ball's bass playing is good as well (and guitar).

Congratulations on your new bass - looks great and a mate of mine has a Lionheart so I know what they sound like and how flexible they are. Btw that's nothing like a Wal IMO - it is sort of more like a Sabre without a pickguard. Wals have exposed pick up poles - the Enfield doesn't so unless you are squinting or partially sighted I don't see it!! The only problem with your purchase - well you'll probably still be wondering how you'd get on with a Stingray fretless - I have one and it's wonderful - but I'd love a Wal and an Enfield as well - love those LEDs btw. Excellent and very intuitive. My fretless came, 20 odd yrs old but seldom used at home, but had roundwounds fitted. The board was not only swirled but there was a slight step in it between D and G above fret 11 equivalent of so - it has EB slinky flats now and sounds glorious - however I still have to kick myself every time I try and bend a string fretted bass style - unnecessary and swirls the board even with flats - you simply need to slide up the string slightly for the bend effect. I guess swirls are ok but wearing horizontal steps in the board will eventually require attention to restore playability.

Ah takes me back to my youth!!! But where do you start with these as there are so many. I picked this one because If you went to a club in 77, 78, 79 they would play this monster at least once - monster because you'd need some stamina to dance for that long but people loved it and the bass parts are wicked!! http://youtu.be/EwjZEEsMJaU

[quote name='Rick's Fine '52' timestamp='1458671733' post='3009734'] Here it is, the pics were taking when i first opened it, and it needed a good clean, its one of the few 100% stock examples still known to exist, many have been modded or refin'd. Very special bass indeed. http://[url="http://s208.photobucket.com/user/rosesguitar_2007/media/Slab/image_2_zps24d15b06.jpeg.html"][/url] Pride of the pack. [/quote] Fantastic - I also looked at some of your other pictures but had to stop - all i can say is Wow - spectacular!!