peteb

To be fair, Simon has posted a lot about how to use a compressor. I have certainly learnt quite a bit from his contributions and I'm sure that others (at least those who want to) have as well.

It is not the audience’s job to notice details about the bass player’s sound. However, what they are very good at doing is comparing the band they are watching on any given night to the one they saw last week. Generally, most punters can tell the difference between the better bands and ones that aren’t that great. What the band sound like is obviously a big part of how a band is perceived and how the bass sits in the mix is a small, but important part of that. Compression is a tool to get a bass to cut through the mix and there is a reason why most of the better bass players I know (but by no means all) use a PB compressor when playing live. You may or may not need a compressor, but you should at least appreciate why many bass players use them live. I am not speaking as a compressor ‘fanboy’, but as a musician who has worked with a fair few decent players and several pro sound engineers. Frankly it’s no skin off my nose whether you choose to listen to me or not…

The thing is, back in the day they were so big and didn't release that many albums (and no singles), so virtually every song was analysed by fans / critics and seemed to be almost an event in its own right (if that makes sense). If you are looking for the ones that perhaps are not the best known, I would suggest Ten Years Gone, The Rover, Tea For One, When The Levee Breaks, The Lemon Song and Babe I'm Gonna Leave You. But that's just off the top of my head, there are so many others.

Is there such a thing as an obscure Led Zep track??

I think that this also demonstrates that a good FOH engineer will add compression at a big gig if you haven't already done so yourself. To get the same quality of sound at a smaller gig with no experienced engineer at the desk, then the onus is on you to sort out what compression should be on the bass.

But they could only do that if they take a DI straight from your bass, thus completely taking out your pedalboard. They could ask you to turn your PB compressor off, but I have yet to be asked to do this. If you can control your signal to the FOH engineer then you can make his job easier / quicker and still maintain some control over your FOH sound.

You thing that you have to bear in mind is that the reaction you have to people like that is similar to the reaction that guys like me sometimes have to your posts. I am always aware that guys who play at a higher level than me (say, someone like SteveK, for example) may have the same thoughts about what I say on here! Ironically, if someone in a similar position to you were to ask my advice on if there was anything that they could do that would be an easy way to improve their onstage sound, the first thing I would suggest would be to put a PB compressor at the front of their chain...!

Can we ask how many gigs you have done, how many were more than 50 miles from your front door, what's the biggest audience you've played to and what level of musicians you have gigged with (have any of them toured / played with anyone famous, had a record contact, etc)??

But you have to ask yourself, if you were starting out as a bass player, would you listen to advice from someone like you?? Not that I would necessarily disagree with much of what you have said there. What I would add is that the main thing by far is to learn to play, learn what theory you need to get gigs, work with a metronome and play with as many other musos as you can (especially those who are a level above you). Also, remember that there are certain things that will get you gigs ahead of people who are broadly at the same stage of playing as you. These are basically about how credible you are to prospective band leaders and include: can you sing, how quickly can you learn material / lock in with a new band, do you look the part and do you have a good sound? It helps if you’re not a d1ck as well and can socialise with people that you don’t know that well. As far as gear goes, get the bass / rig that will get you the gigs that you want and FFS don’t take a cheap multi fx to an audition for a pro (or decent semi-pro) gig. You certainly don’t need a 5k bass, but avoid the cheapest option that you think might do as well. Things like knowing how to use a compressor may help to make you sound more professional than your rivals (details matter). Remember that your gear has to work for the gigs that you aspire to get and it does help (like it or not) if it will be seen as credible with a potential new band leader or band members.

You would think that someone who perhaps hasn’t had the opportunity to gain the experience that others had, would listen to those who have been around the block or who obviously have knowledge in this area and think that perhaps it might be worthwhile to at least try a compressor at a few gigs and try and see if they have a point. Instead, we get ‘it’s the emperor’s new clothes’, ‘Willie Dixon didn’t use a pedal compressor so are you saying he was cr*p’ and can everybody post iPhone videos to demonstrate some thing that is obviously difficult to capture on a phone. Of course, when someone does manage to do just that they then ask for another twenty people to post videos so they can pick on the worst one as evidence that compression doesn’t work. It is bizarre and it does amaze me is how some people are so keen to embrace mediocrity (on this and other issues). The thing with sites like BC is that it should be a great resource for kids starting out to get advice. However, so much of the advice given is just nonsense then how is a kid supposed to know who to believe? At least when I started out, I knew if the person giving advice had any credibility, even if there was far less opportunity to access advice in the first place.

I don't think that pedal compressors were a big thing in Jaco's day! My suggestion would be to leave as little to chance and to give the sound engineer as good a signal as possible. This is even more important when you are playing pubs and have no FOH engineer. I play on a circuit where there are a lot of decent bands, know a lot of pros and work stagecrew on a big festival (as well as know guys who work for PA companies who do big events). I can tell you that not every bass player who does these gigs uses a compressor pedal. However, those who don't are definitely the exception rather than the rule...

As a footnote, I have just been talking to a drummer mate of mine who plays in heavy bands who detune quite a lot. Some of his bands have been quite successful in those genres (got a bit of a following, played at Bloodstock, toured northern Europe, etc). FWIW, the bass players in his bands are using Dingwall basses...

I tend to think of a compressor as an utility pedal, rather than an effect. I think that a lot of people have a problem with paying £150 for a pedal that you only notice when you turn it off! I never use a comp when I'm playing at home, but have it running all the time whenever there's a drummer in the room. The whole point of it (for the way I use it) is to use sparingly, be as transparent as possible, tighten up your sound and make you sound a bit more 'professional' (for want of a better word).

For me the whole point is to help the bass cut through the mix, which I think your clip demonstrates extremely well. I have the compressor running all the time, but I will be the first to admit that I find it difficult to set it up. I ended up asking a studio engineer (who is also a gigging bass player) who uses the same compressor as me live (MXR) and he just got me to take a photo of his settings on my phone. I've never had a problem since.

Yes he did. I believe that he had a black P bass for the first tour and then used a 58 P for the second (Pulse) tour in 94 (currently up for sale for £13.5k).

But is it that different?? Once you get above pub level, there is nearly always a band leader (or sometimes two, like Metallica) and they set the direction of the band. They are going to expect whoever plays with them to turn up with what they consider to be the right tools for the job i.e. what they want the band to sound / look like.

When Guy Pratt was offered the Pink Floyd gig, he said that there was an understanding that Gilmore wanted him to use a P bass, rather than what he was playing at the time. He didn't turn the gig down.

Most gigs I do are tuned down a half step, with a D tuner to drop the E string to C#. I assume that you are using a 110 or 115 on the E, if you play the whole set with the bottom string dropped? My basses that are tuned down a half step are set up differently to those in concert pitch. Personally, by the time you're tuning down a whole step (let alone any lower), I would want a 35" scale.

I'm afraid that I have to row back a bit on what I've said - I thought that he was tuning down to A flat (i.e. three half steps). Tuning down a half step on a 34" will certainly work. Absolutely - that's what I thought you needed to do. I know people who do this and their basses are completely different beasts to mine. However, if you are only tuning down a half step then most of what I said above doesn't really apply. If you think that the band is worth it, I would still suggest the best bass you can afford that works with that type of music. But you don't have to look at anything drastic if you're only tuning down to Bb / A#.

No, it won't...! It's all about how much you are prepared to commit to the project and what your ambitions for it are (as well as what you can afford). Of course if the rest of the band are using top quality gear then there is a risk that any deficiencies in yours may be more apparent. Personally, I would look for the best suitable bass I could afford, but look to the secondhand market so I wouldn't lose too much if I needed to sell it on.

But that's the point, if you are going to commit to playing this type of music then you need a dedicated bass that can handle it. You might think think that a standard 34" Jazz bass would handle most gigs, but not this one. I joined a band that recorded an album then told me that they were going to tune down a whole step to play live . As good as the bass that I used on the album sounded, it wasn't going to work live with this tuning, so I went and bought a s/h 35" scale five string. I won't use this new bass for any other gigs that I do, so when that band finishes then I will sell it on.

I think that you have to work out how committed you are to this band and more to the point, how committed you are to this genre of music? If you are going to commit to tuning down to Ab, then you have to say that a multi-scale bass (or at least a bass with a 35” scale) isn’t a bad idea. Whether it has to be a £2k Dingwall is another matter, but if they are all using quality gear and you have noticed that your bass isn’t cutting it, then you can bet that they have as well, even if they haven’t said anything before.

I've not been there for about 15 years. I imagine that even then, it was somewhat different to when my Dad's pal had it...!