peteb

My wife used to be a Catering Manager for a large company who had held loads of franchises for schools, hospitals and businesses etc. She used to regularly recruit kitchen staff for minimum wage positions and had the same experience.

This has really gone into the politics of the situation, which is inevitable. IBTL what we are talking about is the death if an industry. And its not just musicians who will 'have to get a day job', it's all the small businesses and individuals who make a decent living in the high tech and creative industries that the UK has excelled at...

What it really means for many people I know is forget about making a living from playing music and go and get a job in a call centre. Meanwhile, all the decent work will go to those with an EU passport.

The real issue (apart from the cost) is will a UK band be able to get the necessary visas at short notice to play five dates in 200 capacity clubs over seven days across Holland, Belgium and northern France when there is no reason why an Italian band couldn't do those gigs.

But people are panicking, because they are already losing work! The perception is that hiring UK musicians will be too much hassle and too expensive. The final visa regime may not be too bad / expensive, but then again it could be terrible. Remember, it is Brit musicians who need the relatively lucrative EU market, rather than the Dutch lads who are laughing that they may be forced to go and play in Germany for more money instead! Interesting take on the EU playing hard-ball, but let's not get into the specific politics of it.

You're not talking about a thousand tickets, you're closer to 300 or so. And yep, many of the European bands are just as good. Quite often, a British band leader will have a European backing band. I can think of one guy (moderate name on the blues circuit) who just moved out to Amsterdam. At Colne Blues festival last year, the Dutch guys were joking that it was nice to know us, but we'll never see them again. The real issue for small time pro uk musicians is that they may be cut off from the relatively lucrative European club circuit.

I don't know the specifics, but they are very concerned. Apparently, bookers are already looking for alternatives to UK acts, as it will just be easier and cheaper to book European bands.

The answer is yes they do, which is why you don't see too many touring at club level unless they have a bit of organisational backing or money behind them. The other factor is that you generally don't make money from touring the UK at club level, whereas you do in Europe. It is very worrying for some of my pro mates who are wondering how they are going to make a living.

The issue is that the EU will reciprocate and UK musos will need Visa/ carnets to play on the mainland. I know plenty of pros who make a lot of their income by popping over to Europe several times a year, who will be pretty much out of business in a year's time.

To be fair, its a pretty low grade problem in the scheme of things, but yes, I totally agree

All excellent points! When I was playing in an original band first time around, I wouldn't have considered doing a covers band on the side. Looking back, that was a mistake...

The trouble is that is exactly how it is presented in many cases

I always quite liked Steely Dan. Not a massive fan, so I wouldn’t know the albums – more a greatest hits kinda guy! I have been following this thread with some bemusement – the British disease written large on Basschat. While I appreciate not everybody will like SD, I am surprised at how many ‘musicians’ so actively dislike them. It’s not just them though, consider the following common opinions on BC about a few big artists from this (and many other threads): Steely Dan – jazz harmonies and flavours combined with funk beats and a rock feel, combined in well crafted, accessible songs with razor sharp lyrics and stellar musicianship. BASSCHAT – ‘what do people see in the them, beige, how can anyone like this stuff?’ Jaco – a genuine virtuoso who revolutionised bass playing and transcended his chosen instrument in a similar way to a select few others (Hendrix, Coltraine, etc). Widely regarded by the general music community as one of the best and most influential musicians of his era. BASSCHAT – ‘he’s overrated / crap and if you disagree, you’re a deluded fanboy’… Foo Fighters – in an age of overly manufactured pop and contrived rock (and for that matter rap) acts, probably the last of the great classic rock bands. Massively popular with passion, a bit of charisma, decent playing and a set of incredibly accessible hit songs that reference grunge, Led Zeppelin, punk rock, heavy stuff and Tom Petty all in a recognisable style of their own. BASSCHAT – ‘there is nothing about them that appeals at all’. I should say that I only have a SD greatest hits album, the first Jaco solo album and the missus has the FF greatest hits in the house, none of which get played regularly. So given that I’m not exactly the biggest fan and I appreciate that everyone has their own taste, but jeez why are so many people on here so down on what is pretty solid music??

Not necessarily, it depends on both the venue and the band. Covers bands can certainly develop a large following.

There's a line! No one wants to play with a d1ck, no matter how good they are. But then again, you don't want to give the gig to a nice guy who just isn't good enough because you don't want to have to sack him further down the line if he can't cut it. I agree that personality can be just as important as musical ability.

What difference does it actually make?

I'm intrigued by the KiOgon loom. Can anybody tell me exactly what difference it makes and how mush it costs, what are the advantages compared to a Stellartone pot, etc??

That is quite unusual for the UK in my experience. Generally, I've found that UK punters want to watch a band, have a decent break to chat to mates then more music up to last orders

I think that America is generally more like the European mainland, where you are more likely to be playing bars in bigger city centres where there isn't the expectation that the audience will watch the whole set and your job is to try and keep punters to stay for an extra couple of drinks before they go elsewhere. Pub gigs in the UK tend to be more out in the suburbs, where punters go to see meet their mates and hopefully stay for for the whole show (or a set at least).

The way I see it is that I’m a musician (specifically a bass player rather than a songwriter) and I like playing music. I also like being paid for playing music where possible. Most of my friends are also musicians. It makes sense to put together a covers band to make a few quid for playing music together. Of course, there is nothing to stop any of us pursuing other musical avenues. I am currently in three bands: a tribute band, an original band that has an album coming out this month, and I am rehearsing up a rehash of an established band that plays rock covers in pubs, bike rallies etc. I was asked to join the tribute band by the singer who also plays the pub / club circuit and knew of me from an earlier version of the covers band. I was then approached by the new guitar player in the tribute band (who has a bit of a track record in a certain rock sub-genre) to re-record the original bass player’s parts on an album and subsequently to join his band. The new album is getting plenty of interest on social media from all over Europe and hopefully will do well. I’m open to whatever opportunities present themselves, but it always makes sense to have a gigging covers band on the go to keep your hand in. I pretty much approach playing covers in the same way as I do original music anyway…

I'm afraid the Precision is still wearing the same set of DRs that I put on it when I last gigged it two years ago. I do have a new set of strings ready to put on to see if that helps.

It doesn't seem to be so apparent with other basses, certainly not with active ones. My home set up is a Phil Jones Double 4 and a reasonably decent pair of AKG headphones. It sounds fine with my active jazz and seems okay with my passive American std jazz. No one adversely commented on the P bass live, so perhaps I am getting overly picky when hearing it through the phones. I have looked at the Stellartone replacement tone pot, but wondered if there are any alternatives if I decide to do something to the bass??

Perhaps I haven't explained this well. The pot itself isn't scratchy when you turn it, it just sounds unduly harsh when wide open. However, I will give it a good clean with switch cleaner to see if that helps...

I have noticed over past few months that when I fully open the tone control on my 57RI Precision, it sounds, well a bit scratchy and harsh. It's become especially apparent since I've been playing it through headphones a lot recently (I haven't been taking it out for gigs for a couple of years). Does anyone have any suggestions how I do something about this; be it maintenance or changing the pot or wiring or whatever??

For me, the real difference between guys like me and decent pros is maintaining the consistency that he talks about. Very difficult to do while holding down a full time job.