peteb

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1507679405' post='3387257'] Support local live music when you can. I'm well into my 60s and I don't get out to see much as I use to. On weekends when I'm not gigging I really don't want to be in a bar or pub. However, that's not really cool because bands that play the same circuit that we play have come out to see us on their off night. Blue [/quote] Perhaps you should make the effort to get out and see more bands and get your face known. If other local musos see you at gigs when they know you're not working, especially if you get to know them socially a bit, then they are more likely to think of you when they need a new bass player. These days connecting with players (and fans) on social media is essential and may well be where your next gig comes from!

[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1507618330' post='3386734'] I don't think it's the lack of interest it's the lack of need if they've got a decent job. [/quote] The thing is that there are plenty of good players out there who want to play but are just to busy to commit to a full time band at the moment but want to keep their hand in and maybe play the occasional gig.

Me and a few friends are putting together a band with the intention of gigging once a month, playing quite indulgent blues stuff not much money. Three of us are gigging regularly with other bands and the singer wants to back into it after recovering from nodes on his vocal chords. We are just doing it for a bit of fun, playing stuff we all like and getting the singer back on stage. It doesn't matter that we won't be working constantly or earning as much as we could doing something else.

[quote name='Dr.Dave' timestamp='1507580514' post='3386567'] A WMC in Bradford , think it was called the Thornhill or Thornton Labour club. 1979 and I was 17. 1973 Fender Precision that I'd bought late in 78 for £150 - took me months to save for it on my trainee wages. Still gigging with it. Marshall 50w valve head - think it was a JTM 45. 1x15 and 1x12 cabs my Dad made for me. Thin Lizzy , UFO , AC DC stuff plus some originals. There was a stripper on before us. Well dirty. Coke bottles , the works. I went in the dressing room after her spot and she was stark naked , she grabbed a towel and covered up ( I could never figure out why after what she'd just been doing ). Anyway I was so gobsmacked all I could think to say was 'We've got a towel like that at home' ! [/quote] Thornton Labour Club - remember it well...!

[quote name='Japhet' timestamp='1507461681' post='3385551'] More recently, I'm not sure if people have heard Lance Lopez who is an incredible player if you like your blues fast and raw. [/quote] I was lucky enough to play with Lance for half an hour or so at a jam session a few years ago. Not only can he shred with the best of them,but he is a fantastic funk rhythm guitar player as well. Great player...

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1507244045' post='3384276'] Cool story, I've always wanted to play Jail Break. Such a cool authentic rock song. Blue [/quote] Be careful what you wish for! My rock covers band has just got a new singer, so we have desperately being trying to rearrange the set to honour all the gigs we in the next month or so. This has meant chucking in a few easy songs that the singer already knows to get a set together, including Jailbreak by Thin Lizzy - 40 years since I last played it...!

[color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Location/Venue: A youth club summer disco in Bingley[/font][/color] [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Age: 16[/font][/color] [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Bass: Fender Musicmaster[/font][/color] [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Amp: Marshall Supa lead / bass 100w[/font][/color] [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Set list: S[/font][/color]uffragette City / Jailbreak / Wishing Well / Smoke On The Water / Let There Be Rock All in all the gig went pretty well but it was obvious that the lead player wasn't cutting it,so we decided to get another one. The guy we got in was a lot better player and wanted to join us as we had actually played a gig! Unfortunately he was also a bit of a d*ck, so the band broke up after one solitary gig...!

[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1506676029' post='3380296'] A band I dep with has just driven up from Surrey to play in the Orkney Blues Festival. If they'd asked me I'd have done it. Never turn down a good gig. [/quote] I've played the Orkney Blues Festival. If you ever get the chance, do it - great fun...!

Oh, saw the black one last night and thought that it was unusual. Had to remind myself that I would never use it and have already arranged to pick up a Stingray in a couple of weeks time (swapping for a jazz bass I'm not using so much these days)

Is that the black one that was on the various Facebook bass selling groups??

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1504555133' post='3365689'] That's sort of what I thought Dave. And outside of NYC, I'm thinking your public transport is better than what we have in most US cities. Blue [/quote] That's probably true, but generally our public transport is considered to not be as good as the other major European countries. And yes, most of us do want a car to have the freedom to go wherever we want. Having said that, I didn't own a car when I lived in London. As far as dating goes, I'm not sure that English women generally judge a man by his car (although there will be plenty who do) but it certainly makes things easier. When I was 30 years old I used to date a girl living in Leeds (the next city from where I live - a 20 minute drive away) when my car was stolen from outside her flat and burnt out. We used to joke that one of us had to get two busses and a train whenever they wanted to get laid! I think that it is fair to say that both of us were glad when the insurance was sorted out and I got another car...

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1504553672' post='3365672'] Good to know, so most of these "no car needed" posts are probably from young guys that live in the city. They're the 10%. Blue [/quote] Not necessarily young guys, but [b]mainly [/b]those who live in London

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1504552636' post='3365660'] I'm starting to think we have more of a car culture here in the States. The only people I know that don't own cars live in NYC. Without a car I wouldn't be able to buy groceries or even get to a doctor appointment. Blue [/quote] The certainly is more of a car culture in the US but don't be misled - for 90% of musos over here a car is pretty much a necessity...!

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1504123069' post='3362889'] Many newbies have no clue what it takes to play 3 four hour bar gigs Friday, Saturday & Sunday. [/quote] To be fair, neither do I

[quote name='Nicko' timestamp='1504013403' post='3362110'] Well, as the OP I quite enjoy lighting the blue touchpaper and lobbing the metaphorical firework into a forum. Don't stop on my account I definitely haven't said the questions been answered either. I think it has simply polarised opinion. [/quote] My answer to your original question is that Tab is a useful tool for learning songs you have heard before quickly but if you rely on it too much you may slow down your musical development and it is not used in any professional situation...

[quote name='lowdown' timestamp='1503752582' post='3360720'] Mostly always the case with this musical style of gig, along with non Big Band Jazz as well (although chord charts or fake books do appear at times). Professional shows/TV/film sessions/selective recording sessions/backing turns or acts. Depping in certain function bands and corporate event productions/cruises/classical concerts and broadcasts, amature drama orchestras and bands, marching bands, forces bands, arranging/orchestrating and engraving (the list goes on and on). Fluent, or good reasonable sight reading is still big business. TAB readers/musicians who want to make the step up to any of the work or opportunities mentioned above these days, would know deep down, that TAB knowledge only would not be enough to get you anywhere near the front door. They will have to raise their game. However, not all do and are perfectly happy doing what they do with TAB, which is mainly (I guess) for education and learning purpose. It is pointless ramming it down their throats. The OP question was about using TAB when learning songs versus ears. TAB is no more EVIL than Notation is '[color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]incomprehensible gibberish'.[/font][/color] [font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif][color=#282828]I became fluent in sight reading over a period of time, I didn't just wake up and it happened. Luckily enough, a lot of my reading experience was gained in the heat of battle when I was young [/color][/font][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif][color=#282828](winging it on gigs/cruises and shows using my ears, and accommodating MD's of course)[/color][/font] [font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif][color=#282828] [/color][/font] [/quote] Surely it is undeniable that if you want the gigs that you mention then you must be a proficient reader. Equally there are many pro gigs where reading is a non issue. As far as tab goes, it is just a tool to show you how to play a certain piece that you have already heard. I would say that if a guitar player wants to learn to play Eruption, then an accurate tab will be of more use than notation! But obviously it has no professional applications and you will learn more developing your ear rather than using tab as a shortcut.

[quote name='Bilbo' timestamp='1503730982' post='3360539'] To quote Marcus Miller: 'why wouldn't you'? [/quote] Because of all the (blues and rock) gigs I've been offered, I have never once been asked if I can read or even seen anyone with a score. When I have been up for gigs that I would consider a step up from what I usually do, whether I could read or not has been a non issue, more can I commit to going away for a few weeks at a moments notice! I'm currently helping out with stage management with one of the biggest blues festivals in Europe. You see quite a lot of the same players turning up in 'name' artist's backing bands - all jobbing pros, many of whom I imagine can read. However, I very much doubt (to the point of absolute certainty) that when they were offered the gigs that they are getting paid for over the weekend that they were given any score to learn, or even asked if they could read. Certainly they there is no musical score backstage whatsoever...!

[quote name='hiram.k.hackenbacker' timestamp='1503525368' post='3358993'] It's not 'huffing and indignant puffing'. It's called having a professional attitude. The flavour of your post suggests you know more detail of this incident than the rest of us are privy to. Care to share it? [/quote] To be fair, most of the old time pros I've met would have an attitude closer to the drummer in question

[quote name='drTStingray' timestamp='1503131129' post='3355874'] I have made several attempts over the last 40 something years to learn to sight read notation fluently. I suspect the lack of a requirement to do so virtually ever for my bass playing has contributed to the fact that I still can't - other reasons being laziness etc. The vast majority of my requirements have been fulfilled by learning material from recorded work. It's only in more recent years that notated (or tab) bass parts have become readily available - many years ago the closest you would get is a piano left hand part which often did not reflect the bass part - more it provided pianists with an ability to play the piece unaccompanied rather than reflecting any part of the artist's recording. I don't think tab is evil - it has helped me to learn quite complex things I could never have worked out by ear - and would probably have struggled with from the notation - but by using reference books or magazine transcriptions which show both notation and tab, it has given me a speedier reference to the notes and has also helped me to recognise notated rythmn and rest patterns thus helping my ability to sight read (I struggle less with the notes than with the rythmn when sight reading). I have learned (from notation) examples like the entire piano part and trumpet part for Cantaloupe Island - to both supplement my understanding of the piece and also allow me to concoct a solo bass piece. This is purely for personal interest and development - I've only ever played in one project where the song was played and I was required to play the bass part (and a short solo). If I'm depping I might download tabs as a quick reference to speed up the learning process - I'm far more likely to write my own chord charts for reference on the gig. I'm quite in awe of people who can read fluently - several brass players I know turn up for dep gigs with their own hand written notation and play standards (I'm talking things like Pick Up the Pieces, Watermelon Man, Autumn Leaves) accurately - I guess the brass parts do need to be spot on. So I think it has its place, and has its limitations, but can be a quick reference to play at least the notes accurately....... the question of incorrect transcription affects notation as well as tab - the fact there is (possibly) more tab available may result in more inaccuracy (certainly I've seen tab from web sites which is completely wrong - simply using your ear and playing along will clarify if something is wrong!!). This is probably anathema to purists but it works for me and I think has helped my reading of notation. I think a significant proportion of what I play is about feel and even notation is limited in its ability to convey that - I think that's something the player provides. [/quote] I completely agree with this. In 40 years gigging I have never once been asked if I can read. I have played with plenty of guys who I know can read, but it has been completely irrelevant on any gig I’ve done with them. Of course, reading is an essential skill if you want to play in a pit and if I had wanted to do that then I certainly would have learned to read a lot better than I can now. I can’t imagine that you will ever see tab on a gig but it has its uses. After years of trying to work out Portrait of Tracy by ear and coming up with various things that sounded a bit like it but obviously not correct, I found an accurate tab and now I can play it – OK, the Eb artificial harmonic can be a bit hit and miss but still… There is no way I could have learnt that from notation, even if my reading was a lot better than it is. Of course, you could say that I probably learnt a lot more trying to figure it out by ear, but the same applies there for both tab and notation.

Actually no...! All amps must be matched with [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]a cab (or cabs) with an impedance equal to or higher than the amps stated impedance. If you use two (or more) cabs [/font][/color] [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]the combined [/font][/color][color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]impedance is lowered e.g. two 8 ohm cabs = 4 ohms [/font][/color] [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]A Class D amp will work the same as any other amp. [/font][/color]

[quote name='TimR' timestamp='1502975489' post='3354794'] I think it's an experience and comfort thing rather than strictly a personality thing. The more bands you play in, the more different musicians you play with, the more often you step out of your comfort zone and it just becomes easier to do. I played in a band where the drummer was adamant we'd never get deps in as it wouldn't work. When the Guitarist couldn't make a fairly big gig at short notice I said let's get a dep. The drummer threw a hissy fit and said it would be terrible, he won't play with a dep, pulled out and said to cancel the gig. So we bought in a dep drummer as well. The gig actually went better than usual. [/quote] I once did a dep gig where the only full time member was the singer (although though the dep drummer used to play nearly as many of their gigs as the official drummer). A couple of months later they did a gig where everybody on stage was a dep - even the singer / band leader couldn't make t...!

[quote name='Happy Jack' timestamp='1502605546' post='3352370'] What, no U2 stuff posted yet? Shame on you all! [/quote] Oh, go on then https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=_Ye8GLPUVsM

Prefer the second one but I could see the point of playing the verse fingerstyle and slapping the chorus. PS. anyone getting upset about YouTube clips of people playing bass to cover tunes really needs to get out more...

[quote name='Nicko' timestamp='1501322673' post='3344002'] Aside from the 4 hour set I dont understand why he would insist on at least 2 lead vocals i a 3 piece. [/quote] Two lead vocals make a 4 gig feasible as a single singer is obviously going to struggle for such a long set. I'm guessing he is targeting three pieces for logistical reasons i.e. there is only a small stage / PA and ease of changeover between bands if necessary. Also £100 a man might tempt some people, whilst any less would appear too much work for the money!