peteb

Great song and not a bad bass part. Unfortunately overdone by so many pub bands that you can’t help but groan a little when you hear the intro - like many of these brilliant but simple songs that punters love so much! Lots of bands make a hash of it as it is not an easy song to sing (you really need a vocalist who can nail the high notes) and it helps if you have two guitars to do it properly! If you really want to play the right bass part, the following link is pretty much spot on: [url="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QvjoHhfBw3w"]https://www.youtube....h?v=QvjoHhfBw3w[/url]

Another vote for JPJ & Bonham but amongst those I've seen Roscoe Beck / Tom Brechtlein (Robben Ford) and Muzz Skillings / Will Calhoun (Living Colour) comes to mind.

Good for him! Hardly rocket science though - young guy gets fit, sheds excess weight, gains confidence and gets laid. Still, plenty of people would be well advised to follow his example...

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1445030337' post='2888380'] Remember, for The Beatles it wasn't about being the best drummer. It was about being a Beatle. Nicol's was not Beatles material.IMO Blue [/quote] But he got them thru the gig (or in this case tour) and they got paid, which is the job of a dep...!

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1444962461' post='2887708'] That was Jimi Nicol. I remember that, personally if I had been Brian, I would have canceled the dates until Ringo returned. Blue [/quote] But he didn't! I'm sure that this would have had something to do with money and legal commitments to Aussie promoters, but also because they knew that a dep drummer (who was better than the original) could cover the gig well enough for them to fulfil their obligations without any major difficulties...

[quote name='kulabula' timestamp='1443904531' post='2878670'] Big shout out. I just bought one of their basses. It's awesomesauce. Checkout there web site. That is all. [/quote] Coming to see you tonight - are you using the Alpher??

[quote name='kulabula' timestamp='1444494947' post='2883693'] I'm with Pete. I love Kotzen. He sounds like rock!!! [/quote] Hey Andy! Just setting off to see you tonight - have a good gig...!

I’m with Blue (and others) here. Of course there is nothing wrong with being a bedroom player but to use Blue’s terminology, they are not ‘in the game’. I have a £150 classical guitar in the corner that I sometimes pick up to play a repertoire of about 10 pieces to an intermediate standard – that doesn’t make me a classical guitarist by any stretch of the imagination! Playing live in front of an audience (hopefully for remuneration) is part of a tradition going back to medieval minstrels that is at the core of what being a musician is about. It can be great fun, take you to new places / meet new people and be very rewarding in many ways (not just financially). But to get these benefits you have to get to be reasonably good, which of course is hard work. It is a different world to guys who never get out of the bedroom. Of course, there is nothing wrong at all with writing songs either. I know quite a few people who spend time writing, developing and demoing songs that they have a realistic chance of selling to a library, publisher or even an unknown artist. Of course you don’t have the immediate reaction of a crowd to let you know if you are any good or just wasting your time producing sub spotty teenage angst filled drivel…!

Haven't heard the album yet (will pick it up next week) but gotta disagree about Kotzen - brilliant singer, one of the best! The thing about the first album was it wasn't just about the shredding at all, the songs were very strong. As Kotzen was the chief songwriter, it helps if you are a fan! The songs are similar to a lot of his solo stuff and it is clear that he is the musical force in the band. It's not the riffs and playing that are the focus...

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1444343326' post='2882518'] For me, the bedroom is good for woodsheding and only woodsheding. Blue [/quote] Dude - you are getting old...

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1443888678' post='2878519'] Sideman or not unless it's the star of the band any member can be replaced relatively easy. Blue [/quote] Depends - no one is irreplaceable but if someone is a major contributor to writing songs or is seen as a core part of the band by the audience, then it is a lot more difficult to replace them without significantly changing the character of the band...

[quote name='Billy Apple' timestamp='1443768264' post='2877466'] Can someone give the definition of sideman and pick-up band? [/quote] A variation of a pick-up band is a 'scratch' band, which is put together for a specific performance and without any rehearsal.

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1443719583' post='2877173'] Agreed, gotcha. To me Beatles and Stones music is timeless and not old fashion. [/quote] Actually, on this issue I don't think that it really matters so much whether you think that the Beatles / Stones are timeless and still relevant today! I would say that the point is that past generations of men would hit their fifties and would start ‘acting’ middle aged – you know, investing in a pipe and a good pair of slippers from M&S and dressing from the sales rail at Greenwoods!! Whereas people your age are part of the ‘rock and roll’ generation that were brought up in the 60s and even though you are now in your sixties still have pretty much the same attitude that you have had all your adult life, as evidenced by the way you dress and general lifestyle! Obviously it is pretty much the same for the subsequent generations, including people like me and my mates who were first introduced to music in the 70s. These days middle aged people obviously still get older, but they don’t always choose to grow up into middle / old age in the way that their parents did…

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1443727707' post='2877273'] Nope, I'm always a sideman as I don't do the gig solo and I play the bass part. And as a sideman, I'd expect input and to contribute. [/quote] [quote name='blue' timestamp='1443729047' post='2877296'] I meant, I'm a sideman and I was hired to play bass and sing, not pick or make decisions on material. I don't expect nor do I have any interest in song choice or creative input. That is why, for me , I come up with new bass lines , positions or other things to make songs I don't care for fun. And when I say sideman , I mean guys that play in only 1 band. So my point was or suggestion was aimed at other sideman like me that don't have the interest or the option to can songs. It might be different in the UK, in the States I don't know of any [i]"sideman" [/i]bass players that make decisions on material or any other band decisions. You show up and you play the songs that are called. Blue [/quote] Surely by definition a sideman is just there to play bass, can be replaced relatively easily and doesn’t have much input on material and other creative decisions. I would have thought that being a sideman would make it easier to play in multiple bands. In one of my current bands I am definitely part of the frontline and not a sideman. The band is run as sort of a democracy but me and the guitarist (as the most experienced players) tend to choose material (although we take care to pick songs the other two will be happy with) and MD the band between us, whilst the drummer does most of the marketing / social media stuff, etc. In some of my other bands I take on more of a sideman role…

Awesome gig with BALLS TO THE WALL at the Lion in Cas Vegas (Castleford to non-locals). All rock pub gigs should be like the Lion...!

[quote name='Funky Dunky' timestamp='1443385676' post='2874339'] Still trying to figure it out, but a straightish neck, low action but no fretbuzz. I do like quite a high tension in the strings though, that's a recent development. [/quote] Same here - neck straight as possible, low action without fretbuzz and a tight feel in the strings (45-105)...

I carry round a GK micro amp in my gig bag. It's not really loud enough for a gig but at a push it will do for onstage monitoring and then it can be used as a DI to go thru the PA as well...

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1442960818' post='2871035'] Hi Pete, No, not at all and this is where there might be a cultural difference. Not many stay for the whole 4 hours. The club will stay packed ok, but we get different crowds. The crowd were playing to at midnight is a different group of punters than those that were there at 9:00. When we play at Kim's we know a whole new crowd, probably coming from another bar will show up around midnight. This is something the band has to pay close attention to, because there's material you will want to save, the stuff you know will be better suited for that late crowd. They usually have been drinking longer, so we save most of our dance material for them. Bar bands really have to have 4 hours worth of good stuff. We probably have over a hundred songs, so you pick and chose depending on the crowd. Like most bands we save our best show stoppers to close with. You might have seen our version of Nancy Sinatra's [i]"Boots Are Made for Walking" [/i]If you haven't I'll post it. Old Clip https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=owoulj3y-vY Blue [/quote] That's pretty much what I imagined. You used to get some gigs like that over here but not many these days In my neck of the woods. As I said before, lots of gigs like that in mainland Europe. Audiences who come to see bands like mine in pubs tend to stay for the whole performance (usually just under two hours with a break). Some will then go on to a club afterwards to finish the night off.

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1442958403' post='2871011'] I just don't get the only playing for 2 hours. That's just about when I'm getting warmed up. I think I'll make the point that many of the bars we play are more like real music venues. Were playing a bar called Kim"s Lakeside. Really small place. People come there specifically to hear live bands. Are bands more of an after thought or like background music at pubs? Blue [/quote] Depends on the pub! Virtually all the pub gigs that I play are where people come especially to see the band... Funnily enough, I think that two hours is quite a long time for an audience to engage with and watch a performance by a band, unless of course they have loads of their albums! I would think that playing for four hours is more likely to make an audience treat the band as background music?

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1442949453' post='2870909'] From what I'm reading, playing pub gigs is really different than a bar gigs. Blue [/quote] I'm guessing that US bar gigs are more like bar gigs in Holland / Northern Europe! Actually, this thread is quite apt as the drummer in one of my bands announced that he was going to jack it in for a while at the gig on Sunday. His reasons for quitting (at least for a while) is that he is having to work shifts for the foreseeable future and, more importantly that his wife is struggling to recover from a serious operation. Something has to give and unfortunately (but understandably) it's committing to gigging regularly with a band…

[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1442911988' post='2870365'] Exactly. Sad I know, but I get a kick out of every part, from putting the gigs in the diary and loading the car and driving to the gig. When people say "worst part of the night" at the end, it isn't for me. I love the load out etc. It means I've done a gig. Of course I'd prefer to be playing with Clapton at the Albert Hall, but I love doing good gigs and, as long as I play well, I'll take a bad gig over a night watching TV any time. The worst part about gigging for me is waiting for the next one. [/quote] I kinda know what you mean. I don't mind breaking gear down and the load out at the end of the night and sometimes I quite appreciate the motorway drive home, knowing that you have just done a decent gig. What I don't like is having to get up to go to the office the next morning! Also, as much as I appreciate the odd weekend off, two gigs a month is not enough for me. If nothing else, I know that my playing is a lot better when I'm gigging regularly...

[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1442830249' post='2869709'] +1 The reason I learnt to play an instrument was so I could join a band and gig. [/quote] I read an interview with Leland Sklar last night where he said that he still gets excited when gets a call for a live gig, 'even in a bar'! So after playing some of the biggest gigs in the business, Sklar still looks forward to a local bar gig!

[quote name='TimR' timestamp='1442693343' post='2868857'] They're obviously good enough to get the gigs. Next time you see one of these bands, ask yourself, what is the magic ingredient they have. Study the way they interact with the crowd closely. A clue; it has nothing to do with the quality of the musicianship. . [/quote] I think that you maybe missing the point - it's not that they've got a great act without being technically great players, just that they are very mediocre bands who wouldn't get work in progress places like America where the standard for bar bands is higher. I've just come back from an established rock gig where we had a very good night. Talking to a local biker guy who's been watching bands for years who said that we were the one of two credible bands on the local rock circuit, whereas a few years ago every band was that good. I didn't agree and said that the time he was taking about there were maybe five decent bands around. The point is that there are not enough quality bands on the circuit, both in terms of musicianship and performance....

Wharfedale EVP powered monitors are good quality, simple to use, do the job and are good value (you can always pick them up cheap on ebay). Ideal for pub / club type gigs. http://www.wharfedalepro.com/product-detail.php?pid=123