molan

Just realised that I hadn't actually replied to title of the thread so apologies for that. Having helped out from time to time in a retailer I've seen a lot of instruments come and go at all price levels. Picking the worst bass is easy, it was a 'custom build' eBay purchase that a friend picked up. It weighed a ton, balanced atrociously, had a neck attached with huge wood screws and the fretting was so bad it could tear the tips of your fingers if you tried to slide or even move quickly. The crowning glory was that the fret markers were at 1, 3, 5, 7, 9, 11, 13 etc. However it only cost about £40 and the owner spent a lot of time playing it and really getting back into bass playing (he's a drummer) so, for him, it seemed a fair price. He most overpriced bass I can remember has to be an Olympic White Squier jazz. It was nearly new and just a nasty, cheaply put together instrument. The fretting was atrocious, sharp ends, badly seated and really unpleasant to play. Neck pocket was poor and badly finished as well. It had a thin nasally tone and pots that were mostly on or off with little variation. For something that the previous owner had paid a few hundred quid for from new it was singularly the worst value for money I've ever seen in a bass so that gives it my, personal, 'Most Overpriced Bass' award

[quote name='Lowender' timestamp='1383157978' post='2260997'] As for a company doing well, that's fine. (Of course, they don't sell very many overall, but the prices are so high and there's no middleman so they only need to sell a few each month). [/quote] I know you've owned a Fodera in the past but I don't think you have a very clear picture of their business (as evidenced by other comments you've previously made) This year they will make a lot more than just a 'few' instruments. Current estimate is that they will produce just under 500 basses this year, that's about 40 a month. They also have a full dealer network in place and sell a lot of these instruments through them. Each dealer has to adhere to a fairly strict quality control agreement and is able to act on Fodera's behalf for both standard and custom builds. They will sell direct to customers but rely on their dealers to represent them in many cases because they are a manufacturer of instruments rather than a retailer. These dealers will be adding costs to each instrument sold (although Fodera dealer margins aren't anywhere near as large as many other builders) but they are taking care of much of the operation that a manufacturer can't - thus allowing the builder to do what it does best - make guitars Fodera simply aren't the tiny business with massive overheads that charges a huge premium, without middlemen, in order to make excessive profits that you seem to think they are. They're just a, very professional, operation that makes a decent profit (and there's nothing wrong with making an OK profit - all business should be expected to do this) and exercises a genuine duty of care for its employees. I really can't see what's wrong with that. . .

[quote name='Lowender' timestamp='1383089921' post='2260208'] Actually, no, it isn't about just price. It isn't that the more you spend, the better it gets. Some stuff uses expensive materials or has only two people making basses instead of an assembly line and THAT accounts for higher cost, but doesn't produce a necessarily better sounding instrument. [/quote] I don't think anyone has said that the more you spend the better something gets? All I'm doing is pointing out that there is a significant difference between 'overpriced' as an adjective and 'expensive'. In simple terms my understanding of overpriced is that something has been deliberately marked/sold at a price well beyond both its intrinsic worth and its functional or aesthetic value. Expensive is a much more subjective term and open to a far wider interpretation. My thoughts are that there are quite a few expensive instruments out there but, in most cases, I can understand why they are priced at a high level because of materials and manufacturing costs. Meanwhile there are way more overpriced instruments on the market that have been produced cheaply and then marked up by a significantly higher margin because of 'perceived' value / brand heritage / clever marketing / dealer incentives etc. etc.

GigRig make something that works with multiple voltage requirements I think. I know someone who uses them to power all of his pedal boards (he has three I think) and they all have various differing power requirements

Tapatalk can be really glitchy as well - some functions are awful, especially search. Big step backwards when Talkbass moved over to this platform. For my purposes it's virtually unusable on a mobile device now

I think these last two posts kinda sum things up - there's a world of difference between overpriced and expensive. A Fodera is expensive but you're paying for lots of quality materials and an incredibly labour intensive build process. A rubbish low priced instrument that doesn't even perform its basic function is overpriced because it has virtually zero intrinsic value

The complete opposite! Our drummer was ill this week and I got hold of a dep at very short notice for a rehearsal. We paid him £20 for the rehearsal and £5 petrol money. Hs not a pro musician or anything but he gave up his time and we really needed his help so we were happy to pay him for an evening's 'work'.

The biggest advantage in vertical stacking MB210's is that you're bringing the uppermost speakers much closer to your ears so the level of personal monitoring is much improved

I rehearsed with one the other week in a pretty loud setting and it was easily loud enough. Didn't go above 10:00 on the master volume. Really helps if you raise them up off the floor though

I've ordered one That's one less lead running across the stage for me!

Our drummer uses a high end Roland kit and it sounds good through the PA. I do miss the crack of a snare firing up into my right ear at times though

I'm a huge fan of big rich metal flake finishes I had an Alleva Coppolo P bass with a heavy flake candy apple red finish and white pearloid pick guard - gigged it a few times, looked great under stage lights!

And he looks good in red boots sporting a White Rickenbacker too! http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/a/a1/Rick_James_-_Street_Songs.jpg

I had a set of Maxima gold stings on a Warwick once and they made my fingers go black and blister! Turned out I have a low level allergy to gold so I can't really blame it on the strings, lol. Really didn't like Chromes and had some Rotosounds that shredded fingers as well

For 'everyday' playing my vote goes to the Aguilar Octamizer. It tracks really well and I don't have to play anywhere near as precisely as on other octave pedals I've had. For gigging purposes I find this make it much more usable than anything else I've tried

[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1382628415' post='2254667'] Low self esteem, white gb with a white finger board and blue leds? You need to come out of your shell! [/quote] My thoughts exactly I must say that EBS_f would be one of my first call people if ever I was buying a new PA setup. I love the way his live rig has been put together. One of the most professional function band rigs out there. Really efficient in terms of number of units and wiring, lights etc.

Excellent stuff - never heard of him before but his cast of musicians is a bit of a 'who's who' of top session guys!

[quote name='Lowender' timestamp='1382577202' post='2253968'] I also think Mercedes are overpriced. But if you want one and can afford one, buy it and enjoy it. [/quote] Ah ha, I think I can see where you're coming from now. From what you've said it sounds, to me anyway, that you think 'expensive' must equal 'over-priced'. I know a lot of people that would agree. from my perspective Mercedes are probably one of the least over-priced automotive brands in the world. Choose the right one and it will last for 200,000 miles with basic maintenance, still look pretty good at the end of its life and they retain value incredibly well. Once you get over the hurdle of initial purchase cost they are one of the most efficient vehicles to run on a cost per mile covered basis relative to their purchase price. The simple demonstration of this is that cab drivers all over the world drive them as their first choice car. These aren't guys who are driving Mercs for any sort of flash reason, simply that they do their job really, really, well, are low cost to run and hold value. Just a great, no-brainer, business decision for them. Definitely expensive but not 'over-priced. This is how I feel about instruments made by Fodera. They are super-expensive but no-one is deliberately 'over-pricing' them in order to make an extortionate profit. They do what they do really well (many would argue they are without equal), they keep on doing it for a long time (my 30 year old one looked immaculate after years of heavy gigging) and they hold value really well. You're also paying for people who, mostly hand-craft their instruments and don't stick a plank in a machine and watch it spew out the other end. Human labour carries a cost and, to my mind, the world would be a lot sadder place if everything was cheaply mass-produced by machines in a faceless low cost location For me an instrument made in a large factory that has £50 worth of cheap materials in it that has been chucked in a machine to be spewed out the other end almost completely assembled and then flogged for £300 is 'over-priced' - it's not expensive but the profit margin on it is huge (and you can bet the low-paid workers who pushed the buttons on the machines won't be seeing much of that money either).

[quote name='nottswarwick' timestamp='1382607181' post='2254187'] Yes, I'd echo this too. Kick drums un- amplified are not full or deep sounding enough to push through a full pelt back line. I know, it might seem incredible, but it is true, My other life is as a pro drummer by the way. My first pro work was on drums, from pits to large shows, and millions of pubs, clubs and functions. So I stand by this, sorry. And whenever I am I a pub watching a full electric band with tops only, it sounds "ok" but the kick drum is light in thee mix. A bass rig can fill a room, a kick drum won't. End of story. [/quote] I worked as a sound engineer for a while with a really good guy who hired loads of gear and also ran large PA's for touring bands. The first thing he ever told me was that you have to mic a kick drum for it to actually sound like a drum and not a dull thump. Of course, after that he told me a lot more stuff - if only I could have retained his 30+ years of live sound knowledge, lol.

Quick view on Mackie stuff - if you but anything with electronics in it (power amp, powered cabs, mixer etc) and it breaks then you can head straight to the nearest tip with it. Mackie gear is notoriously difficult to repair, I know one amp tech who pretty much refuses to even consider working on them. A friend of mine had a powered mixer fail recently and the potential cost of repair was way more than it was worth. I realise this can be the case with a few brands but my amp tech says Mackie is one of the worst. Maybe they have proprietary electronics in them that aren't easily replaceable I have to add that putting PA behind the ban is asking for trouble in just about any venue. Even with mics that have a super tight pattern you're going to pick up whatever's being fired at them through those speakers. It's fairly simple logic really - the rear speakers must be louder than the unamplified voices going into your vocal mics. This mean that the vocal mics will undoubtedly be picking up other, potentially loud, noise from the PA = feedback loop. Keeping the volume low and/or tuning the hell out them with a set of graphics will help but then that's going to kill your headroom and/or the sound is going to get pretty nasty. I have used side-fills that fire across the stage at larger venues with some success but with a decent set of monitors (an area where modern tech has really improved quality) I don't think it's really necessary any more. As others have said, I'd try setting up in a more acoustically efficient manner and re-tuning the PA to take this into account before lashing out any more money.

[quote name='Roland Rock' timestamp='1382542904' post='2253449'] I think the point was that a chunk of your money is going towards expensive NY rent and wages. [/quote] But there's only one place in the world that they're made. Does that mean they should move to the middle of nowhere to reduce pricing? Or maybe outsource to China? I don't think you can compare a mass market product that's available in multi-locations with corresponding multiple price points to a custom built bass guitar that's only available from one place. Maybe we should be trying to work out what is over-priced relative to geographical location costs and overheads. Gut feel is it's probably the bottom end of the market where the greatest over-pricing is happening on mass produced, machine made, instruments and not the top where the man hours per bass are huge because of the labour intensive construction and attention to detail that's involved

[quote name='xilddx' timestamp='1382570969' post='2253946'] Awesome mate! Thank you!! What's your page man? [/quote] It's the BassGear one [url="https://www.facebook.com/BassGearUK"]https://www.facebook.com/BassGearUK[/url] The post has been seen by 104 people already - doesn't mean they'll watch the vid but it's in their news feed so they might give it a try and/or pass it on. There's live tracking of number of people that see it. The 6,500 come from all over the world. Really interesting to see where outside of Uk. Over 2,000 in USA & 700 in Brazil (I didn't even know there were 700 bass players in Brazil!). London is biggest City followed by LA & then Sao Paulo. We'll often try to promote individual bassists or artists if they send us stuff. Reach tends to be lower than for simple things like a new bass that's arrived but we always feel it's worth supporting real musicians and having a go at getting the word out about new releases or live vids from recent gigs etc

FaceBooked it for you - over 6,500 'likes' to our page so should reach a few more people

[quote name='NJE' timestamp='1382569645' post='2253937'] Does anyone know how to get a copy of the album? I can't see a link on their website. [/quote] Although they had an album launch gig the actual release was help up and it hasn't been officially released yet. There was an initial pressing and a number were sold at that gig but nothing since then as far as I understand