Dingus

[quote name='thisnameistaken' timestamp='1379543276' post='2214136'] Honestly I've never heard so much nonsense written by otherwise seemingly-rational adults. [/quote] Never spent much time on Mumsnet , then ?

Some basses are designed to be active , some are better passive , some work fine either way . I used to favour active basses , probably because when I started playing in the very early 1980's active basses were de rigueur and received widsdom was that they were superior and more useful than passive basses . Fashion is , however , always cyclical and nowadays " retro" basses that you couldn't give away in those days sell for silly money . In truth , though , the whole active-passive debate is a bit of a red herring in so much as all active basses are not alike , and not all passive basses are equal either , so you would have to subdivide each category . The original high-powered , low-impedance active systems developed by Alembic are incredibly dynamic with a very wide bandwidth and create a sound which is unique to those particular kind of active basses . As active caught on as a marketing byword , the simplified circuits that most manufacturers adopted were a poor relation in sonic terms to the the original active concept pioneered by Alembic with such spectacular results . The naked truth is that a great many active basses have very average-sounding electronics in them , and some manage to squeeze much better results out of them than others . The Music Man Stingray , for example , has a crude but effective and very musically satisfying preamp . What people have come to realise in recent years is that in the final analysis ( i.e what comes out of the speakers when you play them ) the sound of passive basses can be just as pleasing as that from their supposedly more sophisticated active counterparts . Passive basses can give the impression ( be it real or imagined) of a more immidiate and less processed tone that seems more directly linked to the player and the way he ( or she!) is attacking the strings . In terms of high-end basses , there is an interesting trend towards what you could term " super-passive" pickups that are specially designed to have the high output and wide frequency response of active basses but are in fact purely passive with all the perceived benefits of that more simple approach . Some of the custom -wound Aero and Seymour Duncan pickups that Fodera are using on their upmarket signature basses are examples of this approach , or the awesome -sounding pickups on the Yamaha BB2024/25 basses , and also the Lakland Chi Sonic's and Hammond Dark Star ( currently not in production ) pickups . Myself personally , I will play any bass , active or passive, and accept or reject it on its' own merits .

If you are willing to buy used then just keep an eye on the Basses For Sale section here on Basschat and I am sure something will take your fancy sooner or later . There are probably more Jazz- style basses out there than any other design , and Basschat is usually awash with them . Just looking at what is out there for sale might give you some ideas that haven't yet come to mind .

[quote name='Fat Rich' timestamp='1379526099' post='2213745'] All these mods sound like a great way of devaluing a vintage bass. I'd just change the strings first and see if that does it. My '74 is completely stock, sounds plenty Marcus if it didn't have me thumping on it [/quote] A very good point, Rich . You can put a Badass on using the existing screw holes for the stock Fender bridge , and you can get a Sadowsky outboard preamp that clips to your strap ( or indeed choose any of the other fine external bass preamps currently on the market ), so no need to butcher a vintage investment . The East J-Retro is also usually a direct retrofit that doesn't need any irreversible alterations to a standard Jazz Bass, if I understand correctly .

[quote name='dr Szelma' timestamp='1379524519' post='2213708'] agreed, apart from : 1) pickups, ultra jazz are not kosher single coil and Marcus has alnico V magnet in his pickups. 2) +1 for heavy ash (12 lbs, at least 5.5kg), heavy alder will not sound exactly the same. If I can add one thing - his string action is not the lowest in the world Badass will make huge difference, that's the reason he has it in his bass. Another one thing what is worthy doing : take the pickguard off or install neck pickup cover. Stainless steel strings are MUST when it comes to naling his tone as well. Take the bass to experienced luthier, who will level the neck pocket in the body, you can ask him to change the angle of the neck as well. Don't take off the varnish from that part of the neck what sits in the body and throw away that micro-tilt, don't even think about using it. Your bass has the potential to sound right from what I can gather. BTW - forgot to mention good compressor like dbx160x, or (in ideal world) distressor, don't bother using stomp boxes as they'll take you further away from his nice, organic tone. [/quote] Wow , if Marcus' bass weighs 12 + pounds then he is even more a awesome dude than I had previously thought ! I think that Marcus still has the stock Fender pickups in his basses , which as you quite rightly point out will have anlico magnets . I only mention the Di Marzio's because , even if they are not true single coils , they sound great and , to my ears at least , have a nice gritty , raw edge to them that reminds me of Fender pickups from the '70's . I also mention them because Sadowsky Jazz pickups are made for them by Di Marzio and are very closely based on that pickup . According to an article by Roger Sadowsky in a Bass Player Magazine article that I read , Marcus has raised his action very slightly over the years , but still has it fairly low by most standards . In the early 1980's Marcus had an action of 1/16" on the G to 3/32" on the E , whereas nowadays he has gone to very slightly more than that to enable a bit more articulation . I once read Marcus say he lowers his action until it is buzzing and then backs it up slightly so it isn't choking . Apparently , he like to hear a bit of rattle and fret buzz when he digs in and considers it an essential element of his sound . How much difference ash will sound to alder is , of course open to debate , but one major bass builder I have spoken to says that he hears a difference between light and heavy basses far more than between alder and ash . The Northern Ash that Fender was using in the Seventies was , for the most part , heavy and very dense , and so allegedly gave a very slightly more compressed sound with more top and bottom end , but with a slightly recessed midrange compared to alder . I say" allegedly " because myself personally , I dont hear a huge amount of difference between alder and ash or for that matter, between light and heavy basses , to be honest with you . What I do hear a big difference between , however , is between laquered and unlaquered maple fingerboards. The unlaquered boards that are fashionable nowadays have a far less pronounced and less brittle treble response , leading me to think that a lot of the brightness traditionally associated with maple is actually as a result of the finish applied to it and not the wood itself .

I think any decent preamp that allows you to boost the lows and highs will get you in the right territory . By boosting the bass and treble it gives the illusion of cutting the mids , when in fact they haven't been directly tweaked and are still present . Bear in mind also that quite a lot of the time when he is playing fingerstyle Marcus has his preamp turned off , too . I know Marcus says that many people get way too hung up on the ins and outs of equipment when in reality it is just a question of finding something practical that works for you . Marcus has got the preamp in his bass that was available at the time he was putting his sound together in the late 1970's / early 1980's . If he was starting out today , no doubt he would have chosen or been directed towards the the brands and models that are current nowadays , and he would have ended up sounding exactly the same ! EDIT: I've just seen your bass in the YT clips and that is a MM funk machine waiting to happen ! Stick a Badass on there and get a preamp and you're away !

At the risk of being boring , the latest Fender American Standard Jazz Basses with the Custom Shop pickups ( post -2012) are great basses , in my opinion , and take some beating as a good all-round Jazz Bass that doesn't need any after-market upgrades to be at its' best . Failing that . the Sandbergs look good and very solidly built , but a lot of then can tend to be on the heavy side compared to recent Fenders , so look out for that if weight is an issue for you .

To the best of my knowledge , Marcus' bass originally had a Stars Guitars ( they were one of the first replacement guitar parts companies that started up in the 1970's and were based in San Francisco ) preamp , and that was soon replaced with a very early version of the Bartolini TCT circuit . When the Fender Custom Shop built Marcus a replica replacement of his main bass recently , they had to scour the World to find the exact same vintage of Bartolini preamp from the early 1980's . ( Not that having a slightly different preamp would make much difference , in all probability) . Marcus also has a Badass bridge on his bass. My advice on your own bass and quest for the Marcus tone would be to get a decent preamp - Sadowsky or a J-Retro would be my personal choices- , a Badass bridge ( I definitely do think they make a positive difference) , and maybe even change the pickups to some Fender Custom Shop Vintage 60's or Di Marzio Super Jazz ,[i] [u]if[/u] [/i], that is, you find the stock pickups in the Fender a bit weak after the other changes . My experience is that a lot of very old Jazz Bass pickups tend to degrade and start to sound thin and microphonic over time . That is the time for a replacement or rewind . An ash body and maple board play a big part in the bright tone Marcus is famous for , mostly because of the huge amount of thick laquer Fender were using on their basses at that time . In effect , it is like playing a bass encased in plastic . In practise , a heavy alder body will sound very similar to a heavy ash body ( and chances are your 77 Jazz is not a lightweight ), so I wouldn't get too hung up on the kind of body wood your bass has in comparison to Marcus' bass . A big +1 on the DR Fatbeams , too . They are fabulous-sounding strings and will be a great match for any Jazz Bass.

[quote name='mcnach' timestamp='1379446541' post='2212890'] Look at the wide range of pickups available for Jazz basses, from any single big decent manufacturer like DiMarzio. I would not say one set is better than another, but they vary A LOT in sound. You may not like a perfectly respectable pickup, but like another also perfectly respectable. Jazz bass pickups in particular, I have gone through quite a few in a limited number of basses,, so I got to try the same bass with different pickups: there is quite a big difference between, say, Seymour Duncan SJB-2, Fender USA (forget the model) and DiMarzio Model J. Oh, and Nordstrand NJSE. Which one is better? That's subjective, and it depends on the actual bass too. [/quote] I agree , and most half- decent pickups sound perfectly good to me, and all the ones you mention are top quality examples . I am a big fan of Di Marzio , and not quite as keen on Nordstrands on the whole , but that is purely my personal taste . . Some pickups may sound preferable to others on any given bass , but none of them fundamentally change the character of the bass , in my experience . A Jazz Bass will always sound like a Jazz Bass by virtue of the overall design and specific placement of those pickups , regardless of what brand you have in place .

I have got an eye on these , too . I prefer the solid finish on the cheaper 300 series , but the pickups look better on the 500's ( and we all know the most important thing about a pickup is how it looks ...) . I love the shape of these basses , especially the headstock . I look forward to hearing more about how they perform . In keeping with what White Cloud says , my experience of Yamaha is that , on the whole, at every price point they deliver a lot of quality for the money .

[quote name='neepheid' timestamp='1379358711' post='2211782'] A majority of my basses are from the 80s for some unknown reason. 1981 Gibson Victory Artist 1985 G&L El Toro 1985 Yamaha BB450 1986 Yamaha BB350F 1987 Gibson IV I suppose only the Yamaha BBs (and not my ones) are ones that people would think of in a top 10 80s bass list. [/quote] Those G&L El Toro basses have become very sought-after in the States in recent years .

[quote name='Gust0o' timestamp='1379432566' post='2212634'] A manufacturer makes for a market. No bad thing, in my book. [/quote] Absolutely . Manufacturers that don't tend to go out of business . Fenders' biggest problem is that they already dominate that market , so how can they make further inroads into it without taking business away from themselves? At the risk of stating the obvious , by taking sales away from their major competitors is their answer , judging from these latest offerings . My observation about the aesthetics of these basses is that the old adage that what is most current at the time is what ends up looking most dated in the future . The cheaper ones won't age well , but the Am Deluxe ones are classic enough to withstand the scrutiny of time , in my opinion .

Regarding the Am Deluxe version , it would be a bit more enticing a prospect if Fender had actually got round to designing a good-sounding preamp . All their previous efforts have been depressingly dull and unsatisfactory, to my ears at least . Fender make some excellent pickups here and there , and it's about time they had a preamp that was worthy of them .

[quote name='Gust0o' timestamp='1379428849' post='2212578'] That's my hypothesis. Still, I could quite imagine getting on with something that had an approximate Stingray sound, yet was passive and with the neck of the much-loved P-bass - which is pretty much what we have here, no? [/quote] Yes , that would be a winner in the current musical climate , where retro and lo-fo are the dominant trends and show no signs of abating . You only need look at the demo videos of these basses to realise what market they have been created for . Just as their were legions of interchangable also-ran hair metal bands in the '80's and armies of would -be dissaffected grunge rockers in the 1990's , so nowadays we have a plethora of sensitive men with indie beards , plaid check shirts and way too many effects pedals . The fact that they showcase how the bass sounds with distortion ( ironically, most basses sound approximately the same with a fuzz box on them , truth be told) is an indication of the target audience for these creations . Like I said , I can't see myself with one , but, as ever, I reserve the right to change my mind if Geddy Lee starts using one .

These basses don't appeal to me particulaly ( yet ) , but, objectively, I think that the Am Deluxe ones are quite attractive , if you can divorce the uncomfortable association of Fender making a bass that is reminiscent of a Music Man Sabre . It would be interesting ( and probably quite entertaining) to hear what Sterling Ball thinks of these designs . I think folks would find these basses rather more appealing if it was someone else rather than Fender making them .

I would say that a Rickenbacker is one of those basses that you would buy to sound like itself , rather than to give you any kind of a non-descript , general purpose bass sound . They have got a distinctive tonal character , but there is still plenty of variation within that . For me though , the sticking point with Rickenbackers is the overall playability rather than anything to do with their glorious sound . If a Rick' was as playable as a Fender then the World would be a better place !

[quote name='Conan' timestamp='1379343268' post='2211471'] Interesting! My experiences are completely the opposite! Doesn't make yours wrong of course (or mine) but just shows how differently people perceive things. I've found that a new (and decent) set of strings makes the biggest difference. Then pickups (which don't have to be all that expensive, but it is worth doing your research first). Tuners can be a cheap but worthwhile improvement. IME, "upgrading" the bridge makes little or no difference to the sound or playability of the instrument. YMMV, caveat emptor, IME, IMO, etc!! [/quote] I suppose a lot depends on your own definition of "cheap" , but my overall point is that a £250 bass with another £150 spent on it is , in most instances , not going to be so radically transformed for the better that it will give significantly more satisfying results in the long-term . In most instances it is better to spend that £400 on a better bass. It always seems like folly to me to spend a lot of money upgrading an inexpensive bass , because the most you will end up with is a cheap bass with lots of expensive bits on . I am a bit dubious about changing pickups on any O.K - sounding bass , because in my own experience ( and this might upset a few people , but I have to tell the truth as I see it) pickups don't usually make as big a difference as some would like to have you believe . Swapping a set that are absolutely crap for some decent ones will make a big improvement , but swapping one fairly respectable - sounding pickup for another supposedly superior upmarket one can all to often end up being a sideways move , and that is true on expensive basses just as much as cheaper ones . In a blind listening test a stock pickup on a Mexican Fender Jazz, , for example' can often sound just as good as an exotic, high-end pickup . Even if the O.P puts some EMG's or whatever on this bass , it still has an agathis body and ebanol fingerboard, and that will define and limit the ultimate quality of the final sound . I would recommend keeping this bass cheap and cheerful , and very enjoyable for what it is ( providing it is working as it should , ect . )

Are you sure that changing the pickups will give you the improvements in sound that you crave ? Good as these basses are , they are at the budget end of the market , when all is said and done . Spending a lot of money , maybe even half the original value of the bass , on some replacement pickups for a budget bass is unlikely to make it sound that much better or even hugely different , in my experience. Anyway, if you were going to start swapping parts on that bass , I would look at upgrading the bridge at the same time as I would the pickups . I honestly think you would be better off keeping the Squier as it is for now - they sound pretty good to me with the stock pickups- and then eventually selling it and using the upgrade money towards a better quality fretless overall.

[quote name='redstriper' timestamp='1379286830' post='2210966'] But where did [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Stravinsky nick it from?[/font][/color] [/quote] He probably nicked it from Pino's mum and dad's restaurant...

[quote name='discreet' timestamp='1379273954' post='2210747'] I look forward to it. Bring a friend and a tub of Swarfega. [/quote] It's a date! It will be nice to meet a better class of loiterer .

. That was Pino's Mum and Dad's restaurant but they must have retired now . I've never been myself , but I know people that have and the food there is meant to be excellent . It's in a nice part of Cardiff, too .

Hi Spud. The Les Paul -shaped one ( EC414) will almost certainly neck-dive like a bastard , as in all probability so will the S.G - shaped one ( Viper) . In all honesty , the Surveyor is probably your best bet out of the ESP's in terms of comfort and usefulness . The Fender Deluxe Jazz Bass is an excellent choice in this price range and so versatile that it will be suitable for any kind of music you are likely to play . A Fender bass , Precision or Jazz , and Ampeg rig is a match made in heaven , and you should be able to get a great sound for hard rock with that combination without any difficulty .

[quote name='discreet' timestamp='1379262072' post='2210524'] I've been 'wombling free' for decades - mainly due to a lack of investment in underwear. [/quote] I think I might have seen you before now on Hampstead Heath . Next time I will wave .

[quote name='SpaceChick' timestamp='1379259954' post='2210473'] There is nothing wrong with loving the Wombles..., [/quote] There is nothing wrong with loving the Wombles collectively , but loving one individual Womble is a criminal offence . Operation Yewtree has barely scratched the surface yet of what really went on at the B.B.C back in the Seventies . .

In the olden days , Ampeg SVT's used to break down fairly regulaly . They were/are fairly sophisticated and therefore finnicky examples of valve amp technology . One of the reasons pro bass players started gravitating towards transistor amps like Gallien Krueger and Trace Elliot was their improved reliability over Ampeg . The newer Ampeg gear is meant to be more reliable , but you can't completely change the nature of the beast .