redstriper

I got socks. Oh sorry - did you say bass related ?

I hate all other bass players, especially the young talented ones.

[quote name='Vibrating G String' post='1068450' date='Dec 24 2010, 01:27 AM']I don't know if I'd swing that far to one side. Your mind is just one part of the equation, most of us tend to think we are perfect little perception devices and discount our mind completely. If we accept that out mind has a lot to do with our perception I think we make better choices and are less affected by advertising hype and quasi religious hair splitting. I tend to believe that those who think they've nailed their perfect singular tone simply can't hear the changes brought on by other variables and are just convinced of the power of their purchases and how close their gear is to Fleas, Geddys or Justins.[/quote] Oh 'eck - just when it was all going so well - you've gone and lost me again..............! I nailed my perfect tone 30 years ago and it hasn't changed, but I am aware of changes caused by other variables and I enjoy the challenge of working with them at different venues with different rigs etc. I have owned the same gear for many years and only replace it when absolutely necessary. I don't know about 'the power' of my purchases - I just pay as little as possible to get the job done and I'm not interested in having the same gear as anyone else or sounding like anyone else. In fact, I rarely listen to other bassists and I'm completely out of touch with modern music. And who is Flea, Geddy or Justin ?

[quote name='Vibrating G String' post='1068443' date='Dec 24 2010, 01:03 AM']Then I'm clearly misreading you, my apologies [/quote] No need to apologise, my flippant attitude is often mistaken for sarcasm - it's probably psychology again, but let's not go there.

Back to tone and what I think I've learned so far: It's all psychology really - if you believe that you have a good tone, then you do (whatever gear you use) and this helps you play better. But if you think that you have a bad tone, you're doomed to discontent and poor performances. So change the way you think instead of your gear. I know I've got a [b]great[/b] bass tone.............. (which is nice)

I'm surprised that yours are shorter - a friend of mine has a 21" scale Kala U-Bass with the same strings and they have plenty of spare. Mine are still stretching and I'll soon have enough spare to make another set! I think my low tensions are more prone to stickiness - the E and A feel different to those on the Kala. I couldn't resist the 'dreads' because I play mainly reggae, but I have a set of black ones too, for any 'serious' gigs. I was told to be careful with the silicone spray because it can damage the lacquer on the bass, but I've seen no problem so far.

[quote name='TimR' post='1067686' date='Dec 23 2010, 12:22 PM']Have you thought of buying a set of flats and taking them around with you. I'm sure any decent shop will allow you to restring a bass if you find you like the feel and want to try before you buy. As long as you don't spend all day restringing bass after bass.[/quote] Yes, I tried that once and it didn't go well. Most shops just said no and the one that said ok, let me change one string for 2 minutes and then made me feel bad for not buying the bass. Music shops are strange places.

[quote name='Vibrating G String' post='1067424' date='Dec 23 2010, 08:07 AM']I'll pretend I didn't see any sarcasm and say there is some truth to that. Somewhat.[/quote] I wasn't being sarcastic at all, I appreciate your advice here and I'm finding it most refreshing. I have never given much thought to tone or any other aspect of bass playing until recently, it's just something I do and I've been happy with the same bass for over 30 years. It's only since deciding I want a new one and joining this forum that my problems began. I live in the sticks and don't get to see many new basses and all the ones I've tried sound and feel horrible because I don't like round wound strings. The last time I went round music shops in the 70s, most of the basses were strung with flats and the main choice was between a Fender P or J. Now I see what you mean about any decently set up jazz bass being suitable for me and I will look for the lightest one I can find, which isn't easy because they all tend to the heavy side. Another bassist friend of mine went in a music shop recently to check out jazz basses on my behalf. He tried 3, a MIA standard at £999, a MIM standard at £499 and a Squire CV at £269. He said he would choose the Squire because it was on a par with the others quality and playability wise and it felt very similar to his 1964 Fender, plus he couldn't see any justification for the price difference. When I asked what they sounded like, he said he hadn't plugged them in to an amp, because they'd all sound alike depending on the player - a man after your own heart eh!

[quote name='dave_bass5' post='1067301' date='Dec 22 2010, 10:32 PM']That sounds exactly like the CV Jazz.[/quote] Thanks, I was hoping you'd say that cos I'm a cheapskate ! There is one for sale on here now, but when I asked for the weight, the seller said 15 Lbs which is 4.5 Lbs more than my old bass. I'm sure they vary in weight and hopefully I'll find one more like 9 Lbs.

[quote name='dave_bass5' post='1067108' date='Dec 22 2010, 07:13 PM']The Squier is a lovely bass but it doesn't have the growl ive been looking for since i got rid of my HW1. I thought i could get it with a pup change but that didnt work. So i went looking fora bass with a different tone, but still a Jazz. The first was the 70s classic. It had a raised 11th fret. It was pretty bad. I also didnt get on with the neck but thats not why i sent it back. The 3 MIA had QC issues (that no other basses ive owned have had), including gaps under some of the frets. [url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=97047&hl="]http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=97047&hl=[/url][url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=97047&hl="]PUP issues[/url] So,knowing that i liked, or rather missed the HW1 tone the obvious choice was a new HW-one. Even that has a raised fret but its so far up the neck that its not a issue for me. It does have that lovely growl though. The Squier CVP was supposed to be a cheap way for me ot get to grips with a P neck but its such a nice bass that im using it as my main bass on some gigs. Compared to some of the higher end bases ive had over the past few years im a lot happier with the ones i now have, and they are all a lot cheaper.[/quote] Dave, I just read your thread about the MIA jazz bass problems and it put me right off buying one, (not that I can really afford one anyway). I'm looking for a new jazz bass to replace my old heavy one that has been my only bass for 30 years. I want it to be as light as possible, with thin frets, low action and fast rosewood board. I'm not looking for growl or zing, just smooth deep bass from the neck pup which is the only one I normally use. I don't mind where it was made and the cheaper the better. From what you have said, it sounds like the Squier CV might be my best bet, or possibly the MIM classic 60s. Would you agree ? Steve.

[quote name='dave_bass5' post='1066611' date='Dec 22 2010, 11:39 AM']tried to get a MIA Jazz (had 3 sent 3 back), had a MIM 70's Jazz, sent it back, got a Squier CV Jazz and was happy with that for a while but still ended up buying a HW-one Jazz and i love it.[/quote] What was wrong with the 4 jazzes that you sent back and is the Squier better than all of them and the HW One even better again ?

[quote name='TimR' post='1062730' date='Dec 18 2010, 06:24 PM']Buy something that [b]sounds good[/b] and concentrate on the notes.[/quote] Why not buy something that sounds bad, if tone doesn't matter ? In fact why bother listening at all ? Your 'sounds good' will not be the same as mine - tone, like everything else is subjective and I want to 'sound good' to me, not you.

[quote name='Truckstop' post='1066779' date='Dec 22 2010, 01:55 PM']So, you had a '63 Jazz, then changed the body and the fingerboard in '78? Isn't that a bit like that bit in Only Fools and Horses with Triggers broom? Truckstop[/quote] I am not familiar with Triggers broom, but thanks for the analogy. Your analysis is incorrect though - I never said that I changed anything on the bass. It is exactly as it was when I bought it in 1980, I didn't buy it as an investment and I have played countless gigs with it. The previous owner changed the body and board because the originals were so badly burnt by the first owner who often set fire to it as part of his stage show.

[quote name='Vibrating G String' post='1066399' date='Dec 22 2010, 07:30 AM']I would consider that maybe there is another bass that sounds like yours. Once you hold and see a bass you opinion of the tone has been prejudiced. Or work on the skills needed to control tone. What is this one of a kind bass you have?[/quote] Thanks for your response, I appreciate your wisdom and it is helping with my rehabilitation I have a 'customised' 1963 Fender jazz bass, it had a new maple body and fingerboard fitted in 1978, which brings the weight to 10.5 pounds. It's been fine for me until I got a bad back and find it too heavy on long gigs. In the past year I've been looking at new basses and none of them seem to have the tone of my old bass, although they are often much nicer to play. A big part of the problem is that they are usually strung with roundwounds and I have only ever used flats, so I find them over toppy and lacking in depth. It's hard to see beyond the shop set up and it's not until I've bought the bass and got it home, that I find out if it has 'my' tone. I play fingerstyle, mostly over the neck with just the front pick up and the tone rolled off. I bought 3 new basses this year, (all cheap - I've never spent more than £200 on a bass) and sold them all on because I couldn't get 'my' tone. I've also borrowed and played a lot of basses this year and they all sound 'wrong' compared to my old beast. I have now become over fussy about tone and I am very 'into' the sound of my old bass. In breaking news, this changed a few days ago when I played a MIM Fender jazz at a friend's house. It was beautifully set up with flats and a low action and it wasn't too heavy, it was the closest in tone to my old bass that I have found. It isn't for sale, but my friend said he can set up almost any Fender or Squier in the same way and I have decided to look for the lightest jazz I can find. There are always a few available on this forum, but I'm wary of buying blind and there's too much choice - it was so much easier 35 years ago !

[quote name='Vibrating G String' post='1064212' date='Dec 20 2010, 12:49 AM']Wanting to learn and not just win on the interweb.[/quote] I do want to learn and I really don't want to win anything. I have played the same bass for over 30 years and always been happy with the tone and I still sound like me on any other bass, but I only [b]really[/b] get into playing on my old bass because I can't get the same tone on anything else. Now I'm finding my old bass too heavy and I want a lighter one, but I can't find one with the same tone. Should I stop looking and learn to love a new tone?

I have to be happy with my tone to play anything really worthwhile.

Of course everybody sounds like themselves whatever bass they play and what's wrong with that? But if tone is only in the fingers and not the instrument, why do I choose a particular bass over another? Eg. You have 2 basses, both sound similar but one has something extra in the tone - maybe it goes deeper, sounds plummier and fits the sound in your head better than the other. The other one is more playable and comfortable, but doesn't quite have the tone of the first bass. Which one do you take to the gig ? In my case, it's the one with the best tone, because it makes me play better and I get into playing so much more, even though it's a heavy, hard to play beast. I know, it won't sound much different to the crowd, whichever bass I use, but the one with 'my' tone will always ensure a better performance.

[quote name='Vibrating G String' post='1063087' date='Dec 18 2010, 11:36 PM']The first step is admitting you have a problem [/quote] And what is the next step, oh wise one ?

[quote name='Vibrating G String' post='1063102' date='Dec 19 2010, 12:04 AM']I think people often confuse tone with playing and experience. When Jeff Berlin played my bass he got the exact same tone out of it that I did. I played it, handed it to him. Nothing changed, no knobs were turned no pickups were swapped for their slight edge in round transparency that can only be heard by lemurs. Yet it was a completely different experience. But the exact same tone. I think too often we confuse a great player with gear choices and attribute way too much to the gear and dismiss the performer. It's like attributing great basketball playing to the right shoes, which makes way more money than telling bass players they need the right gear. I've made most of my money in advertising, I can only share the way we think of this.[/quote] Every player sounds like themselves, whatever instrument they play and a great player is a great player on any instrument But the tone of those instruments can vary a lot and most players, (great or otherwise) try to choose an instrument that has a tone suited to them. It is obvious that advertisers will exploit this, like anything else, but that does not deny the human experience that drives it. Or perhaps you would prefer a single State produced bass suitable for all - come the revolution

When I play different basses through the same rig, I notice they all have different tones, influenced by the type of strings, pick ups and construction materials etc. I know the kind of tone I like and when I hear it, I call it 'my tone'. So I'm a faith accepting egotistical chump programmed by marketing - blimey!

I made the same change about a year ago and I've never looked back. Mine are the shorter scale low tensions, which I got from Roadtoad in the US and they arrived within a week for about $25 inclusive. I didn't use any cable ties, I just stretched them round the posts and they've held fine - and they have continued to stretch, but they are more stable than the original strings and it's nice to be free of the white powder - it was giving me a bad name! Mine do get a bit grabby and sticky, so I spray my fingers with silicone spray and rub the strings occasionally - this makes them very slippy and fast and a £2.19 tin has lasted me over a year so far. [attachment=66670:P1040821.JPG]

[quote name='tauzero' post='1061319' date='Dec 17 2010, 09:08 AM']What about that new solid Kala U-Bass? Pahoehoehoe strings (just right for Christmas) and (I assume) available fretted. Buggerall information available though.[/quote] Yes I had one on loan from BC Owen and while it solved the intonation problem, it wasn't really for me. Great tone, but the frets being so close together mean you have to be more accurate than on a normal scale bass, to avoid choking and buzzing. I would probably get used to it, but I'm lazy and the Ashbory is smoother and faster, despite the intonation problems. I might buy one if they were half the price and I like the look of the new solid body models that are coming out soon. I bought a stick on fret board for the Ashbory and had the same problems with choking and buzzing, so I removed it and I still like the sound and feel but wish the scale was a bit longer. It's got a lot of character though with fantastic tone and it's great for taking to jams, parties and well lit gigs! After trying (and buying) lots of basses this year, I finally know what I want - a nice lightweight jazz bass please. Not so easy as it sounds because they vary so much in weight and quality, but at least I know what I'm looking for now

[quote name='tauzero' post='1060755' date='Dec 16 2010, 05:09 PM']You don't want to use your Ashbory?[/quote] I used it at every gig for over a year and then went back to the old jazz for some reason. I still use the Ash sometimes, but I've become a bit paranoid about playing out of tune because the intonation is difficult on such a small scale. But it's got the tone for me and it's fun to play, ideally I'd like something between my great heavy jazz bass and the Ashbory.

[quote name='martthebass' post='1059699' date='Dec 15 2010, 04:28 PM']We're obviously using completely different rigs (can't help you with the 'sampling' btw - I never stick a lead into the PC ) I generally use a 15" cab (the MB115HR in my sig) - with judicious use of the V'whatever EQ controls on the LM and dialing out some treb/adding some bass the Streamline does a good thump (finger style), though I admit it takes more effort than using a straightforward Fender P. It's rare that I look for a woody tone but in my functions band I usually have to do anything from Dean Martin to Stereophonics and I've found the versatility of the little Status very useful. I'd accept that if all I played was old Motown or Early Rolling Stones then I'd probably pick up another passive jobbie but then I'd need to take 2 basses if I played anything else! I struggle with the EB0 through my set up.....all I get is a fairly dull thud through 15"s or 12"s.....the only time I can get anything approaching 'clank' is through my 10" practice combo. I think all this proves is it depends how much the amp/eq/cab make to the end result; the bass is only one part of the overall equation - and lets not get started on strings![/quote] It's funny because I have a very similar rig to yours. I use an LM2 through one or two lightweight 15s and I make much use of the filters especially when recording, but I do like a very deep and smooth tone. I don't play much variety of music - it's 90% dub reggae, with a bit of blues, funk or jazz thrown in and I add a tiny bit of treble on the bass sometimes for that. The Streamline was too rich for me tone wise like most modern basses, but it's very versatile and I can see it being perfect for most players needs - just not me. The EB-0 was also not smooth enough for me, I don't like any growl in the tone and the clank came from the low tension short scale strings clacking on the frets, due to my poor technique. I'm just a fussy old Hector