kerley

That advice is not specific to Fender, it is not as though all other manufacturers basses are perfect is it? Fenders QC may be worse than others but who actually has any data on it as to me it just looks like anecdotal stuff is all we have (which is next to useless) And what is with all this 'haters' stuff, is everybody 12 years old?

Haredst working is debatable and clearly has not direct link to number of shows headlined. The correct headline would be; [i]JLS have headlined more major concerts than any other artists in 2012[/i]

4. Masterclass is a misnomer and just because you are a master doesn't mean you can, or should be, holding any sort of class.

Yes, masterclass if the wrong word, maybe 'Show and tell' would be better but most master classes are not really classes if when teh player is a master. I have seen a few and never learnt anything from them other than the same sort of stuff Peter Hook would give you. They are what you make of them and depending on questions and where it may go it can be good or dreadful.

If he is accountable then it is his fault, that is what accountability is. He may not know what every one of his employees is up to on a day to day basis but he should know the companies strategy, how it is tracking, where the money is being spent, sorting out higher priority issues etc,. He must have known the company was on the slide for years and the actions he took to address were not the correct ones, again totally his fault. Just as if he had turned the company around to be the most successful company in world would also be his doing.

[quote name='Marvin' timestamp='1358418191' post='1938659'] More "An Audience With Peter Hook". [/quote] That would need loads of celebrities in the audience so they could cut to shots of them laughing so we know what he has said is funny.

[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1358415225' post='1938606'] I’m sure he’ll be able to hold an audience with his playing and anecdotes. [/quote] Exactly and that is what it is about. Maybe they need to use a word other than Masterclass as that implies a- they are a master and b- it is a class. It is more of a general talk from a bassist in my experience.

Having been to a few masterclasses at previous shows you don't always get much in the way of learning from even the most technically competent and it is more about just listening to what they have to say and the chance to ask them questions. Some of the technically more competent cannot get a message across or present well at all and it is as much about that as anything. As someone who likes Joy Division and appreciates his basslines in their songs I will be there listening and asking questions and I am glad he is there.

[quote name='4 Strings' timestamp='1358331934' post='1936988'] Squiers are considered 'great' (with a silent 'for the price, but its not a real Fender'). I honestly believe that the vast majority of us (everyone?) could not go into a music shop, blind folded, play a number of basses and, with any consistency beyond 'random' and chaos theories, pick the Squiers from the Fenders based on playing and sound. I know I couldn't. [/quote] And blindfold tests are what should be done first as you will then get the instrument that plays and feels the best to you. You may not be able to pick the difference between Fender or Squier but the Squier may be the one you choose blind. You then at least know that if you don't buy the Squier it is because of issues you have rather than issues the bass has...

[quote name='Dave Vader' timestamp='1358283204' post='1936430'] I don't mind the idea of doing worthwhile voluntary work for benefits, but working on a factory line to lower profit margins just doesn't sit right. [/quote] Fair enough, just an idea. Although voluntary work would also be good. Anyway, this came from the thought of having a "Made in the UK" Fender Precision or Jazz to the same build and standards as the USA model but half the price. Would the USA model still have an allure because it is US and that is where Fender originates from? I can sort of see why it would just as a Rolex needs to be made in Switzerland and a cheaper one (still official Rolex) made in China just wouldn't be the same for some reason.

It gets in my way when I am using a pick as my last two fingers hit it. It is pointless to me as I have never once used it and probably never will and certainly wouldn't have it on there from new by choice.

[quote name='Dave Vader' timestamp='1358268118' post='1936003'] except perhaps for the guys doing the work for benefits. But that's ok, cos they're scroungers right? [/quote] Some are scroungers, but majority are not but that is irrelevant. While people are out of work and receiving money from the state they should have no problem in working in return for that money should they, after all they are actively seeking work? They would receive minimum wage in place of benefits and they can continue to look for better paid jobs/jobs of their choice in the meantime. This is all about everyone contributing to society for the good of the whole society. It is better for morale, the country is getting more from it's citizens and parts of the manufacturing industry can move back to UK to serve the UK. Problem?

[quote name='Dave Vader' timestamp='1358265976' post='1935959'] Yeah, cos there's all these unfilled manufacturing jobs being advertised all over the country right now..... [/quote] Of course there aren't, they would need to be started back up. Starting from scratch and manufacturing what is in highest demand from within UK to start with. UK businesses could then use those UK manufacturers at very cheap cost from government (no wages to pay just the overheads) As long as it was cheaper than China then quids in all round.

[quote name='flyfisher' timestamp='1358255177' post='1935617'] I wonder how long before labour costs begin to equalise as the Chinese standard of living increases rapidly in coming decades? [/quote] It will take a long time to equalise and probably never will. The services industry in India has been on the rise for 10 years yet the average salaries are still low compared to the west (even though they are increasing by 10-15% per year). When it does get closer then China will start to lose it's grip and you will suddenly find basses coming from another country (Africa?) This will always be an issue as the west will not lower their wages and will always be far higher paid than a whole load of other countries. My solution - use unemployed people to do manufacturing jobs in return for their benefits while they are looking for other work. The country is already paying for them after all. The UK could then partially compete with the likes of China.

[quote name='flyfisher' timestamp='1358252790' post='1935529'] It's all very well to blame the MD for being a useless dinosaur, but what about the rest of the board? What about all the non-executive directors wheo are supposed to help steer the business strategy? Sorry, it's too easy to lay all the blame on one guy. [/quote] He is the person who is ultimately accountable. He signs off on major strategy, he leads etc,. If the non-exec directors are not putting in place the best strategies it is up to him to know that and change them (the people or the strategies) If it is anybodies fault it is his.

and if you are quick (before it dries) you can set fire to your bass for extra rock and roll points.

Let's say it takes 6 hours labour to make a bass (there is much more to it than CNCing a body). Labour time for moving parts around, cutting frets, putting frets in, sorting edges, doing electrics putting all hardware on, painting etc, and 6 hours doesn't seem like much. An average fully loaded cost for US labour is around $100 per hour (includes holiday, insurance, lighting etc,. etc,) so those 6 hours become $600. Those same 6 hours in China may cost $100 so you start to see where the money goes. Go Chinese builder, go.

Undoubtley some are more picky than others (I am am not picky either). My bass that is perfect to me could probably be given to a picky person who would point out all the things that are wrong with it while I will just happily play on in ignorance of the 'faults' Saying that, it doesn't stop me having an expectation when spending £1000 or more...

Presuming they must go through some level of quality control then a small gap must meet the QC checks otherwise they would not leave the factory. Tend to agree that in days of mass production and very accurate machining there is no excuse for this on a bass at any price but as price increases you expect to never see this. The problem is that people still seem to miss the point that USA basses are only more expensive because the labour rates are so much higher and NOT because the workmanship or processes are better. And the prices would get even higher if they had a tighter QC process that threw out 30% of their basses which may explain the QC standards they adopt. It is a financial decision, people still buy the basses with what some see as imperfections as Fender know full well that to 90% of people the imperfections are not noticed or don't matter. If they had 30% wastage after QC the price may be £1200 instead of £900 and I doubt people would be saying "the price has gone up £300 but the QC is terrific so I am happy"

[quote name='SlapbassSteve' timestamp='1357933198' post='1930879'] I wonder what the price difference will be? [/quote] The standard one is Japanese and £700, and the Pawn shop one has an RRP of $1080 so could be quite close to £700 I guess and aren't Pawn shops made in Japan too?

I prefer the standard Mustang without the Pawn shop amendments.

This is where a shop like Absolute Music in Bournemouth is useful. They have 4 dedicated rooms to go and try and instruments (only one with bass amps in it) so you can sit and play anything you want without any feeling of nerves/stressing out what to play coming in.

[quote name='geofio' timestamp='1357746135' post='1927717'] I hear all this talk that fender basses made in mexico are crap!! utter nonsense, i have one of the fender special precisions made in mexico, and i have owned american made models , this mexican bass is as good as if not better than some american basses i have played , i wonder who started all this nonsense that mexican fender are built less than usa models they are not!!! they all use the same components made in the same factory, just assembled in different locations. its like saying the mexican workers cant put four screws into a piece of wood utter nonsense its time to get real, the mexican instruments are like the usa and jap models there is good and bad. i think a lot of people are brainwashed about mexican basses. time to wise up. [/quote] There are a number of reasons. - The price is lower so people assume the product is inferior. - They are not made in the US so casual racism (especially from US buyers) assumes they will be inferior - Interestingly people who think Mexcans cannot build a guitar think the Japanese can. It is largely based on ignorance and the differences between basses from different countries are down to the budget the bass it set to along with any processes used in that country to keep within that budget. If you put tighter control processes in place, used better hardware, allocated more time to build and finish and QC in a Chinese factory and sold the bass for the same price as a US made bass with poorer processes, less time etc,. the Chinese bass would clearly be superior.

This often discussed topic would be a lot simpler if data was available around the base cost of the parts and the labour time/cost were seperated out. For example, if the exact same Squier Affinity was made in US it may cost £400 rather than £170. That would clearly put in perspective where the cost is going and I would imagine nobody would be buying the US made version (with exception of gung ho US people!) The problem is that it is not this clear and the US Fender is not the same product as the Chinese Squier so justifications are made for the Fender cost around materials and parts where in reality these differences are probably minimal but nobody knows.

I am pretty sure that if you took a Classic Vibe and replaced the word Squier with Fender and put a Made in USA sticker on it people woudl think the bass was worth £600. As I am not a nationalistic American I don't care if an American or a Chinese person made the thing and not sure why having it made in America is such a big deal. Manufacturing and QC are the same all over the world and if the processes in a Chinese factory are better than those in an American factory the better bass will be the Chinese one (assuming parts used are the same)