4000

[quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1342783132' post='1740833'] Why? A Rickenbacker bass is far more complex in construction than a Fender. [/quote] +1. Whichever you prefer is entirely up to you, but that doesn't have a bearing on the actual cost to produce.

[quote name='bubinga5' timestamp='1342720189' post='1740001'] arent alot of Mcartneys recorded lines played on a jazz bass.. ? im not really keen on Rics.. i might be shot for saying this but the one i played seem to be more style over substance.. [/quote] Most of McCartney's Beatles lines are recorded on either Hofner or Ric. As for the rest, see my post above.

[quote name='Beedster' timestamp='1342774254' post='1740632'] Good post [/quote] Indeed! Firstly, playability. Everyone is different so everyone will give a different opinion on this subject. For instance a s a general thing I like my basses set up really low so that for me they're easy to play, but to some that renders them unplayable. Why? Because they like high action and/or dig in more than I do. With regards to Rics specifically, the first issue is that the scale length is slightly less than the more common 34" which may make a difference to some. Secondly, and this is the thing that seems to really divide opinion, the necks are a pretty similar width from the nut to the heel. Some people just can't get on with it. For me, it's the only way to go; all my favourite basses have that sort of neck. There's the fact that the fingerboard is lacquered, which many don't like but for some is great. Then the necks vary massively over the years. My '72s are very slim and slightly wider and flatter feeling than most post '73 basses. There are ones with pencil thin necks and ones with baseball bat necks and everything in between. Take your pick, or don't if you don't get on with any of them. Sound wise, people seem to expect Chis Squire or McCartney. In reality you've got twin pickups with two controls each and obviously stereo on most basses. If you actually use those controls you can get loads of different sounds. I can get more varied and useable sounds out of my Rics (maybe because I've spent years playing them and really know them) than I've got out of most boutiques I've owned; only Alembic have been arguably more versatile. I'll add that I prefer ones with a toaster in the 1/2" neck position, rather than a neck high gain, although it could be argued the neck high gain gives a bit more oomph in a band situation. Still, I can get loads of different useable sounds out of a P, more than I can from a J. If you take James Jamerson and Jean Jacques Burnel (or as someone mentioned before, Entwistle Live At Leeds), they both play Ps but sound very dissimilar. Different strings (and not even simply rounds vs flats, a different brand or gauge of strings can make a massive difference sonically and feel-wise), different rigs, different technique. These will all make a difference. Rics-wise, if you hate that clank, try 'em with flats and just use a toaster neck pickup. Roll the tone off if necessary. If you like clank, stick on some Roto rounds and crank your treble. Most types of bass are pretty versatile when it comes down to it, if you're prepared to do a little experimenting. Ergonomically, tonally, playability wise, they are a bit marmite. But everything can be. I just can't get on with Jazzes, as much as I want to. Some people get lovely tones out of them (JPJ and Gary Thain spring to mind); I never can. Also to me they're incredibly uncomfortable on my body and the necks are as wrong as wrong can be; I'd choose a good Ric over any Jazz in terms of playability, but thats because they suit me better, no other reason; I don't believe anything is inherently better than anything else in terms of feel. It's all horses for courses; it's down to what feels comfortable to you and what suits your body and ears.

I've probably played 4 recent ones; two I really liked and two I could take or leave. Can't say I noticed the problem you're describing though. That's worrying. A couple of things; did you play them through amps you're familiar with and that you know suit them (I'll assume you did as you sound pretty experienced with them)? Rics are funny beasts and don't work well with some amps, hence my often having to run two separate rigs, one for Rics and one for non-Rics. I also find that some rigs (even very high quality ones; mine sounded pants through my Epifani gear and not much better through EBS or SWR) don't seem to reproduce the low strings on Rics very well for some reason. Which isn't to say of course that there isn't anything wrong. I would tend to say even many of the best Rics (whatever they are) don't tend to kill you with the might of their Es, which doesn't bother me because of my style but I know would bother many. The other thing I would say is that all Rics vary from instrument to instrument(as pretty much all brands do), but the newer Rics I've played definitely don't sound like the older ones (mainly down to pickups etc). The 2 I played in Dawson's really were very different animals than my two '72s, which exhibit far more of that famous hollow grind; horses for courses I guess.

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1342280832' post='1732778'] You know, I don't know as I don't focus analally on anyone any more. I am quite happy catching snippets here and there although I was never a slave to any one guy. I knicked things from whoever I liked... Or whatever I liked and threw it altogether.... But I always used to hum licks when I was away from an actual bass and I actually sound like that now when noodling. I have pretty much always done my own thing and I am less convinced I copy well... Which is just as well as that whole rip thing bores me senseless. I want to hear people who put it down well and convincingly and I no more want to hear Flea clones than mm or mark king but I do want personality and a good technique with effortless fluid lines. I have a few influences from afar.... Up to a point... But I never have 'heroes'. I guess you would never be able to say who I have spent a long time listening to as it is all buried and mixed up with so many but I have listened a lot.... And with a decent ear and reference, I think. But that is just my opinion. [/quote] I'm not interested in people copying other people either and I certainly wouldn't say I focus anally on anyone. I've had heroes in the past and certainly have players I look up to now but that's not to say I try to play like them or copy them. There are players I love who I couldn't be further away from. Sometimes I like them [i]because[/i] they play nothing like me. I don't think that because someone likes someone's else's playing it means they're obsessed with them and just want to try and copy them. FWIW I think you have to remember that Flea has, at his core, a punk attitude and that's always there in his playing. I suspect if anyone ever described him as slick he'd probably vomit on their shoes.

Thanks for the reply. That's true, and something I had considered. However I know that when I've used a Markbass LMK and my old Epifani through it I haven't been particularly happy (although the Ashdown does work much better).

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1342272003' post='1732618'] I use the word 'chummy' as in he tries hard but it doesn't really work. There is a lot of huff and puff but no real zing or panache in the end product. He isn't a slick enough player for the things he tries to do but hey, I bet he is laughing all the way to the bank. In a way, not the type of player you'd recommend someone check out but his lines are flash enough to impress on a basic level. I think they work as a band though... Although I wouldn't call them my thing. [/quote] I don't generally like "slick" players or music. Again using Flea's parlance, it's generally "all flash and no smash". I like to hear people playing on the edge a bit, going for it. Probably why I've never been that interested in many of the session players of this world. So, who do you rate these days?

[quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1342007764' post='1727863'] *Grin* That's a visual thing. We put on a show so that people who come to see the band live have something worth watching otherwise they might as well stay at home and play the CD loud. I think the issue with Flea and RHCP is that musically he overshadows the band. I doubt whether anyone who rates Flea as a bass player, but isn't particularly a RHCP fan could name either the drummer or the current guitarist. And while their sound is to a certain extent dominated by the bass playing it's still a band and each part should be equally important. In the end though it's probably down to the fact that their music does nothing for me so I can't really appreciate Flea as a player because of that. [/quote] I'd also say that Peter Hook's playing (in terms of style / sound) overshadows the bands he's in but you like him, right?

[quote name='lettsguitars' timestamp='1342258234' post='1732347'] Yes were always hit and miss (mostly miss, no groove).[/quote] Oh I forgot, groove is the only important thing in music. Yes, up to and including Close to the Edge, are arguably my favourite band of all time. I think very few of my favourite bands have much to do with groove.

I'm looking to possibly replace my big rig (Barefaced Compact and Ashdown ABM500) with something lighter and smaller but still with decent power. The band I'm currently playing in just doesn't need a big rig (acoustic, no drums, just cajon); I'm currently using a Hartke Kickback 10 which is fine for most of our gigs (sounds great in fact, surprisingly so), but would like something with more clout for bigger rooms. I've heard great things about both the above; a friend has a Promethean combo and swears by it. I keep trying to borrow it but he's always using it! I was wondering how a Reidmar and single Classic cab would compare with a Promethean combo, assuming anyone has any experience. I gather that the Promethean punches well above its weight and I've only heard good things about the Reidmar. Of course I could always keep the Barefaced and just get a head but I'll admit I'm a little out of love with the sound of it at the moment, although that could be simply because it has no drums to shine against.

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1342201460' post='1731630'] Not much of a fan... I think the playing is a bit too chummy and always left me thinking it could have been a bit more... Can't say I have listened to him loads tho... [/quote] Chummy? That's a new one on me, I have no idea what that means other than being a bit "matey" as in "like a mate"! I really like his playing, always have, although he wasn't really an influence as I'd already been playing over 10 years before I'd heard of him. In his own parlance, he gets the right mixture of flash and smash. I remember the 1st time I heard You Oughta Know by Alanis Morissette, thinking "oh yeah, the bassist has really got it going on". I only found out much later it was him. I'll add that I'm not much of a fan of "every hair in place" type playing, which his certainly isn't. FWIW I don't believe in too many notes or too few notes. I believe in the right number of notes for the piece of music in question, and that is an entirely subjective concept. I'll add that the first time a friend of mine, a great guitarist who I played with for many years, heard Soul To Squeeze, he said "that sounds like one of your lines". Was quite pleased about that one!

[quote name='wingnutkj' timestamp='1342077391' post='1729020'] Oh! Oh! I know this one -the drummer's Will Ferrell! [/quote] Ah, it's not just me then!

[quote name='peteb' timestamp='1342002865' post='1727697'] But surely the logical extension of that is saying that anyone who achieves recognition as being a great player must, therefore, be rubbish! I'm all for great songs but (IMO) there must be room for outstanding musicians as well...... [/quote] Despite being a "song" guy, I completely agree with this. Many of my favourite bands have musicians you can't help but notice, but that's part of what creates the music and makes it work.

I sympathise. I've been trying to get a definitive diagnosis for my arm/hand problem which has some not dissimilar symptoms (started in in earnest December), although there are other issues too, for 6 months now. What's depressing is not only is it dragging on, but nobody really seems that interested, despite me pointing out that I'm a musician and that it's also affecting my full-time job. When I asked my doctor what I should do in the meantime she said, and I quote, "I'll leave that up to you". I wish you the best of luck because if my experience is anything to go by you'll need it.

Never understood the "Bill's not much cop" thing. I thought he fitted the band far better than Darryl Jones, who IMO gave them a different feel which (also IMO) didn't work half as well. I really like Bill's playing in the Stones, always have.

Re the Geezer / Gruber H&H thing.... [url="http://www.black-sabbath.com/vb/showthread.php?37088-Did-Geezer-Butler-REALLY-pay-bass-on-Heaven-and-Hell"]http://www.black-sab...Heaven-and-Hell[/url]

My Barefaced (a mere Compact) is very, very neutral sounding; it is how you eq it. If you don't eq it it sounds (with me through it at least) very "meh". In an ideal world I'd like a bit more bark from the cab (my very early pre-vinyl, pre-Kevlar Trace 4x10 had that in spades) but I haven't been able to find it in anything like as light a package. FWIW I've never liked any Ampeg cabs I've tried (or SWR for that matter). I had a pair of Aggie GS112s at one point and they were arguably my least favourite cabs I've ever owned (my Compact is way better than they were), but I have to say I don't generally get on with the tone of 12s.

[quote name='Bass-Thing' timestamp='1339780168' post='1694335'] I has no idea BWW were still going and I assume you mean Matthew Ashman. Has he passed away then? Shame. Where are they playing cos I might try to come if its not too far away. I always wondered why Leigh Gorman never achieved similar dizzy heights to folks like Tony Levin or Stanley Clarke or Victor Wooten or Marcus Miller etc. Even Adam Ant used to say he was the best bassist in the world and probably still does. Good call on JJ Burnel. He was my 1st bass hero. [/quote] Sorry, I missed this. BWW recently did a brief UK tour (first one since '83 IIRC) which I missed due to not knowing about it. However they're playing the Rebellion Festival in Blackpool on Friday 3/8/12. Yes, sadly Matthew Ashman passed away some years ago (diabetes IIRC). I suspect Leigh never reached those heights because people either never really heard him or considered him just a "pop" bassist (in the bubblegum sense); I know the band were very conscious of not being taken seriously for that very reason. There are arguably more accomplished players these days, but his combination of technique and originality at that time, with that unique tone, was something else IMO. He was a huge influence on me and is still one of my favourite players.