4000

I'd just like to add that I had absolutely no bias either way when I tried both; I wasn't even aware there was supposed to be a difference at the time (many years ago). All I can say is strung through the body the feel was definitely different, the strings definitely felt stiffer (which I don't like, so I strung it through the bridge again).

[quote name='Ou7shined' post='639523' date='Oct 28 2009, 10:17 PM']Being a sort of take it or leave it kinda guy I've not had the inclination to have a bevy for about the last 2 months now. In light of this, 3 pints might have a similar effect on me. See you under the table. [/quote] That's been my problem! Used to love a beer or several but as I hardly go out now I've grown out of liking the effect it has. Not to say I won't be under the table though come Saturday.

[quote name='retroman' post='639311' date='Oct 28 2009, 06:09 PM']Hi Chaps, bit of a head scratcher this one? Just been watching an old Motorhead video, and Lemmy is playing a Ric 4001, Maple Glo, bound body, but a maple fret board with dot markers. I love old Ric's, and I have never seen that combo before! I thought that if you had dot markers, it meant you had a 4001S with unbound body, but still had a rosewood board, and it was the 4001 deluxe models that came bound, but with the sail fin inlays and a rosewood board? Just wondered if anyone can shed some light on said beasty [/quote] The one with the maple board was his second Rick and he bought it for £80. It arrived (from a possibly dodgy source - i.e. half-inched) with no frets and loads of holes in the head, according to the man himself. He reckons it's a real one though. I suspect it maybe had the board changed; it's something I've nearly done myself several times over the years (I like maple boards).

Different makes of string can make a huge difference, even in the same gauges. Of course some of this will depend on your ear.

I can see my current inability to drink more than 3 pints without falling over is going to be a real hindrance come Saturday. I'm up for the lama riding though, as long as its not in the Biblical sense.

John is one of my all-time favourites; he has a lovely way with a melodic & deceptively mobile line. Mick is also one of my favourite drummers, and Lindsey one of my favourite guitarists. Combined with some of my favourite songs ever and Stevie Nicks - who in the late seventies was probably near to my perfect woman - what's not to like? My favourite gig ever was the Mac gig at Maine Road in (probably) '88. I know what you mean about Lindsey though. First time I saw the video of the Mirage tour he annoyed the crap out of me!

[quote name='Ray' post='638513' date='Oct 27 2009, 09:37 PM']I can see the logic in what you're saying but... I always strung my Jazz through the body then one day I thought I'd string it through the bridge to see what difference it would make to the tone and sustain. The first thing I noticed was the string tension. The strings had much less tension in them when tuned to pitch (using the same set of strings too). So much so I had to make a truss rod adjustment! So, in my experience, through body stringing [b]does[/b] increase string tension.[/quote] I once did the same thing before I knew there even was an argument about this and had very similar results; I didn't have to make an adjustment but I could feel the difference quite noticeably.

I tend to stare at the neck and I hate the fact I'm doing it. I've been trying to break the habit for years and never managed it.

Most of the stuff he did was played with a pick so far as I'm aware. I have a few Beatles/Wings books with lots of live pics and he's always using one.

Another Sei, followed by a W&T, followed by possibly a Rim...or something like that. Oh, and another Alembic obviously, but preferably rather lighter than usual.

[quote name='david_l_perry' post='634966' date='Oct 23 2009, 10:33 PM']Looking forward to playing that 9 string again....didnt get much on it last time as I was way to hung over.....but it was awesome, suprisingly easy to play Arm is well and trully sorted now Shaun...good job as I am your taxi for the weekend Sir.... [/quote] Glad to hear it about the arm Dave. I believe you're now back to assaulting the earlugs of all and sundry. Good man. Yeah, I believe Stu has double-booked (gigging) and will be arriving later/poss next day. PM me if there's any problem. Hope I'm not too out of the way.

I won't be taking the Epi UL502 anymore as I sold it..... How's the arm Dave? All recovered?

I'd been thinking the same thing. We should all have t-shirts with our Basschat IDs on! Ok, I know, prohibitively expensive...and we'd all look like a right bunch!

[quote name='warwickhunt' post='484768' date='May 11 2009, 07:25 AM']I'm glad you picked that up Silddx, as I was going to let it slip so that I didn't sound like a broken record! Even the heaviest Warwick I have ever owned (solid birds eye maple body) was under 10lb and most have been between 9lb - 9.5lb (and I've owned a few by the way). The dreaded black hole bass commonly referred to as the Thumb bass is still unlikely to tip much over 9.5lb, heavy for its size but no worse than a lot of Fenders and Fender wannabes. In my quest to reacquaint myself with my love for the Jazz tone, I've purchased 4 Jazz or Jazz style basses and 'every' single one is heavier than my 3 main Warwicks! Believe me, Warwicks are no better or worse than 99% of other manufacturers of standard sized/scale basses. There are exceptions to every rule and yes a Bubinga Corvette may be a bit heavier than an Ibanez SR bass or whatever but you can draw that comparison between virtually any two basses. Phew... however I don't think this is the last we shall hear of the dreaded 'Heavy' Warwick theory! [/quote] I once tried to SIIs in the Bass Centre (early 90s?) and one was really light and one was really heavy. The only apparent difference was one had a PJ configuration and the other 2 Js! People should get used to the fact that no 2 basses necessarily weigh alike. My Ricks have varied hugely, as have all the Wals, MMs, Fenders, Statii etc etc etc I've tried.

[quote name='Pete Academy' post='631768' date='Oct 20 2009, 08:31 PM']We were having a quiet day at work and, spying my chance on Spotify, put on the 'Level 42' album. Great bit of nostalgia. But it also brought it back to me how great Mark King was and still is. Their appearance on The Tube, where King did the unaccompanied slap solo, still holds a place in the annals of jaw-dropping bass history. Until then, I'd heard Stanley, Louis Johnson, and Pops Popwell of the Crusaders playing slap bass. King took it to a totally new level (excuse the pun). The question is: how did he achieve such a great technique in such short a time from picking up the bass? I know he was a great drummer. Answers on a postcard, please.[/quote] Imagine how I felt; he was the first slap player I ever saw! I thought he had landed from Mars or somewhere. My confidence never recovered from my hilarious and feeble attempts to slap the next day (on a P Bass with medium action and 45s...). From what I gather he's just a great musician, period. He's also supposed to be a very accomplished guitarist. I guess it's just pure natural talent with a dollop of hard work. I have to say I prefer earlier Level 42 for the most part; I have a few dvds of earlier gigs and I love them, far more than the albums in fact. He's very aggressive and upfront on those, almost reminding me of a jazz funk JJ Burnel! In contrast to some, I also find him a very musical player, and I prefer his slap to pretty much anyone else's; he really drives the band, and that's the kind of bassist I prefer, slap or no.

No. Still the same so far as I'm aware.

[quote name='bilbo230763' post='630086' date='Oct 19 2009, 09:38 AM']I never thought for an instant that I was right, I just had a position and put it forward. In case people hadn't noticed, I enjoy the debates not because they are resolved but because they are engaging. What I struggle with is the apparent dichotomy between the idea that Alembics (or whatever) have a distinct sound but that, if you play one, you won't sound like whoever. There is a subtle contradiction in there. We will, as always, have to agree to disagree and just enjoy the ride [/quote] Absolutely. As you may have noticed I love a good debate too, especially one where I get to waffle on endlessly. As an aside, I didn't buy either of my Alembics to sound like anybody, but my second Alembic did sound remarkably close to that of Jimmy Johnson with minimal tweaking. I have no idea what that proves.

[quote name='bilbo230763' post='628833' date='Oct 17 2009, 04:29 PM']But if you have had 50 basses in 30 years, you have averaged seven months with each bass - I suspect its even less in many cases. That's the same as having a sofa with the plastic covers still on - you'll never get used to it. And I would assume that you have tried a zillion amps in combination with each bass so the number of variables is sky high. I have no problem believing that there are differences between basses and woods, different pick up combinations etc but it seems to me that some of us have out heads turned when a bass sounds different and lack any sense of which bass sounds great and which sounds just ok. Going down the custom route just seems like expensive hair-splitting. My point is this: my Wal has served me well in rock, funk, shows, jazz, small groups, big bands, function bands etc. I can accept that a different bass in each case would be different but I see it as hair splitting as well and I know that noone but me would notice. I think its like the LPs vs cds vs MP3s discussion. Everyone says that LPs sound better but, if you are listening to music in the car, who will be able to tell? I believe producers are capable of asking for a specific sound but if someone wants me to sound like Stanley Clarke, they have booked the wrong bloke! Put an Alembic in my hands and I won't sound like SC, I guarantee it. I just struggle with the idea that, with 50 basses to choose from, you can't find one that works [/quote] Not true actually. I usually have several basses at any given time; a few "keepers" and then others which I chop and change. I had my first Rick 6 years before it was stolen. I had my Pedulla 3 or 4 years and loved it for most of that time. My head was indeed turned by a Wal ironically enough; that came and went quickly because I didn't get on with it; sonically it didn't do the job I needed it to. My 72 Rick I've had since '93, which is plenty of time to "get used to it". I've also been playing Ricks since the day I've started playing so that has remained a constant; however as much as I love them there are some jobs they just do not do very well, at least in my hands (and despite years of practice). Many of the instruments I've owned haven't moved on because I didn't get on with them (I can always find some use to put an instrument to) but because there have been other instruments I've been interested in and unfortunately I don't earn enough money to keep them all (if I'd had the money I would still have many of the basses I've owned; certainly 20 or 30). I'm intrigued by new experience and new possibilities (oo-er missus!) and there are simply other things I want to try. One other thing; at what point did I say that I couldn't get any of them to work? Regarding amps, in the past 20 years or so I've probably owned four or five and I only got rid of my favourite rig because it became too heavy once my back problems started; this is also the only reason I've got rid of my Alembic and my 2nd Jaydee which I would otherwise still have to this day. However, in addition to the points I've already made, part of the fun is [i]trying[/i] all these instruments, in the same way that I like to go to different restaurants and try different meals to see if I like them. Using your own criteria, this can't necessarily be done in five minutes in a shop without a band playing around you. Still, it's not really about "getting used to it". I could possibly get used to a really annoying partner or an uncomfortable pair of shoes, but why would I want to do that? I'm not sure you've really read (or at least understood) my post. Each instrument brings something new to the table. I can use a single bass in every instance you've quoted in the same way that I can use a single brush to paint with, but I choose not to because it may not be the best bass/brush for the job. You say you have a background in art. Do you paint? If so, do you only have one brush to paint with? Only one pot of colour? Give me a HB pencil and I can draw you a picture, but a single HB pencil is often not what I would choose to use. I've already explained my reasons for going custom which may differ from those of others, and they aren't really connected with the post you've quoted or indeed many of the points in this post; mainly they're connected with the creative side of it which fascinates me (I'm a creative bloke and gravitate towards other creative types and their product). In reality my main bass is a stock bass anyway. However I think 2 points you're missing are that (1) maybe you just got lucky with your bass and it happens to fit well and do what you want it to and (2) maybe some people are far more interested in the process of choosing a bass than you are, in the same way that some blokes hate shopping and others love it (I happen to be one of the ones that love it). Do you settle for the first pair of socks you come across, or do you shop around? The Alembic comment is a weird one; not everyone buys an Alembic to try and sound like "insert player". I certainly didn't. Oh, and once again I note you say that "only you" would notice the difference if you used a different bass. Well, that's a good enough reason for me to use a different bass! If you make choices based on other people's criteria or judgement - unless of course they're employing you and that's what you're there for - you are truly lost. With all due respect, it seems to me that you've decided you're right based on your own particular needs and choices, and then have (as many people do) tried to judge the choices of others using this criteria. There's nothing wrong with making people think, but when you try to convince them that what they're thinking is wrong simply because it doesn't agree with what you think that's another thing entirely. There was a pyschologist at my art college who was convinced that one of the pictures I'd painted was inspired by childhood viewing of footage of the Vietnam war and who kept trying to get me to admit it. He was wrong. It was actually inspired by childhood viewing of Scooby Doo .

[quote name='bilbo230763' post='628044' date='Oct 16 2009, 04:15 PM']I suspect it is a bit of both. I approach different instruments the same but am likely to have to make miniscule adjustments to accommodate stuff like string spacing, neck profile, body shape. WIther way, the adjustment would take minutes for most playing and hours for more sophisticated techniques. IN reality, I play another bass about once a year for 10 minutes. I actually think that the quality of your amp is for more central to the sound than the wood your bass is made of. This applies to all sound reinforcement. Guitars and keyboards through cheap amps are just as bad a basses.[/quote] I've now owned something like 50 basses in near enough 30 years, from cheapies to customs, and have to say that very few of them have really sounded alike. Yes, with eq or a different rig some have been able to approximate others, but there are many that I just haven't been able to duplicate no matter how I eq because it's not just about eq, it's about the way the instrument produces the note; the response across the strings, the attack and decay, the envelope (as Alex says). My Jaydees sounded nothing like my Pedulla, neither did my Wal (I tried approximating the Pedulla sound on the Wal and couldn't get close, regardless of eq on bass or rig); the Statii always sounded like Statii regardless of eq, etc etc. The biggest challenge has been the Ricks. I've owned around nine and haven't ever been able to get one to sound like the other, certainly unless I just roll everything off and go with a mud sound. My 2 CSs couldn't replicate the sound of my '72 at all. Not even close. Nor could they even begin to replicate my 4000; I could eq 'til I was blue in the face and it made no difference. I can't get my Seis to even vaguely approximate my Rics (nor could my Alembic). Of course the average punter would seldom know the difference, but I don't really care what they think. I'm completely with Alex in this, in that the envelope of the note and the way different basses sing out (or don't) is the thing that's most difficult to replicate. My 72 Rick has a relatively weak E but sounds bigger and bigger as you go up the neck. I've never played another type of bass that does that the same way, however I eq it, and trust me I've tried. I recently tried to use my Seis in rehearsal instead of my Rics; there were some songs that no matter what eq I used they just did not work because I could not get the unique response of the Ric out of the Seis (I've tried it before with Status, Wal, Pedulla, Alembic etc etc). Likewise the Ric cannot in any way approximate the Seis or the Alembic or the Statii etc etc. Lines that work on one bass just do not work the same for me on another, regardless of eq. You may be one of those lucky/unlucky (depending on your requirements) people who makes everything sound similar, but not everyone does. Of course you could argue that none of this is important to the music. To me however it is, because the unique response of the instrument affects what lines I may play, thus affecting the music itself (bear in mind I hardly ever play anyone else's music, although the same would probably apply if I did).