Rimskidog

[quote name='EdwardHimself' post='948508' date='Sep 7 2010, 05:07 PM']I should imagine it's not too different from the variable diffusors on the walls, except in bass trap form possibly?[/quote] No. Tuned bass traps/helmoholz etc.

While I try and obtain some higher resolution pics here's a bit more detail from Northward about the room: "This Control Room is of the FTB type with a quasi isotropic response. The mains are ATC 300 in fully decoupled housings (natural frequency of ~4Hz). The CR is fully floated with a natural frequency of 6,8Hz. A large "H" window was integrated in the design, to allow excellent visibility into the LR and vice-versa. 2D Diffusors type 870, adapted to the room's needs, serve as a basis for all diffusion in the CR. There is an extensive use of membranes and Variable Impedance Bass Traps." More pics to follow!

We hosted a visiting engineer this week. One or two of you might know him:

[quote name='cheddatom' post='944364' date='Sep 3 2010, 11:16 AM']Cool, do you have any bigger pictures? You can upload them to BC as an attachment.[/quote] Sorry. It's my scanner that is the problem, not the upload! When I expand them they go completely out of focus.

So, here's where it gets really interesting! The control room design is now finished and we are tendering for contractors. Here's a sneak preview of the final control room design. Sorry about the resolution. I can't seem to make it any clearer. The first is a plan view: And this one provides views from side to side and front to back:

[quote name='ironside1966' post='923946' date='Aug 13 2010, 02:45 PM']My guess would be because of spillage in to the other Mics. To get a good live recording you need a good sympathetic room and the instruments, cabs and mics placed so that the spillage compliments the recording, done well this sounds great but because of the fact you a limited to what you can do afterwards it takes a good band and a great engineer with experience or a lot of experimentations to get the microphones in the right place. So I would say that without the acoustics, time or experience using amp modeled should give better results but it is still down to the competence of the engineer Having the gear doesn’t guarantee the skill to use it Some people learn how to do something one way and that’s how it stays. To play the devil’s advocate though A lot of musicians are focused on their sound not in the context of a band they just want a big sound but a band with every one having a big sound doesn’t sound huge it sound a bloody mess with most arrangements but I don’t get the impression this is you.[/quote] Spot on. It's not easy to either record or mix a decent sounding bass. You need a good room, amp and speakers, bass and player to start with. Then you need to use the right mics and place them carefully. If any one of these parts of the chain is weak it'll be heard in the ultimate product. That's before you even get to the mix. One of the basic problems with many home recordists is that they think they can 'fix it in the mix'. They can't (or at the least it makes it harder not easier).

[quote name='Lozz196' post='912820' date='Aug 2 2010, 02:18 PM']Cheers for that - kinda what I was afraid of. Was just hoping that, what with recording technology being so much better than what it used to be, there may have been a few tips I could use. Thanks though, looks like I will just have to stand my ground when I`m moaned at for being too bassy (I`m actually not, I`m just not turbo-trebled either).[/quote] Definately. Let them cut on the desk if they want to. Get the best sound you can going in (and make sure they are capturing that)

[quote name='witterth' post='912996' date='Aug 2 2010, 05:11 PM']see if you can borrow a status. looks aren't to eveyones taste but they really "do" recording those Basses. just eq the desk channel flat and turn all on the guitar to "full" for best results. (sounds a bit Nigel Tuffnall that but...) the engineer will probably comment on its massive output but he'll sort that out for you! all the best with the project by the way.[/quote] Personally, on 7 out of 10 occasions I'd go with a P bass. To my ears there are few basses that record better.

Er... that's really not the way it works if you actually want to get a decent sound. The trick is to capture the sound you want going in rather than trying to fix it in the mix. Anything other than this approach is pretty much doomed to failure. Let them cut any sludge that obscures the mix afterwards (that's what eq is actually for). It ain't rocket surgery. Quality in = quality out. [quote name='Lozz196' post='912670' date='Aug 2 2010, 12:06 PM']Hoping someone can help here. My band are going into the studio to do a live recording, which our guitarist is overseeing. This is the problem. He`s one of those people that likes the word "definition", and, when we`ve each tried the others gear, and tinkered around on sounds, "definition" in his mind is "gutless" in my mind, akin to very trebly elastic bands. Whilst I don`t want a load of booming sludge on the tracks, I also don`t want to sound like I`m playing a detuned guitar. At present, I don`t know if I will be miked/di`d etc. What I`m looking for is, once the recording has taken place, in the mixing process, does anyone have any tips on frequencies to boost/or compression settings etc, to get the guts back? I know we can tinker around with the eqs/levels ourselves, but some guidance as to what would be most effective would be appreciated.[/quote]

Sorry for the lack of updates (if anyone is still watching). Been crazy busy. Here's a quick update. Thomas is busy working away on the new control room design. The current encarnation looks very slick with a glass RFZ and my ATC SCM300s apparently floating in space. I just can't wait to get in it! I've been holding back on publishing a picture of my old control room so you can see quite how much a contrast it will be but sod it, I finished work today on an album I've been working on for quite some time so here's a snippet of the conditions I've been working in for so long (ps. it's not always this dark ):

It looks to be pretty clear that you can track seperately

[quote name='51m0n' post='883888' date='Jul 2 2010, 12:46 PM']I'd also recommend a proper bit of mastering mate, thats whats missing to my ears if I'm honest. Costs dosh, but done right it really does make a hell of a difference.[/quote] If the mix is good mastering should be pretty transparent. I havent listened (hate listening if I'm not on monitors) but if you are saying it needs to sound different then it's either the initial recording or the mix that is at fault. The earlier in the process you can fix stuff the less you have to compromise (so always be thinking about your mix right from the point you start tracking). Doing that will lift you above 95% of homestudio engineers (and a big percentage of crappy studio engineers too)

The sound you get will depend on the interaction between that player, that bass, that room, the temperature, the mics, the preamps and the AD conversion. Best advice I can give is walk around the room listening for where you can here the sound closest to the one you want to capture. Once you've found it stick the condenser where your ears are. The get up close and personal. With headphones on move the other mic around close to the instrument. Wherever you get the best overall sound, that's where to leave that mic. Be slightly wary of f-holes as you tend to get boomy.

And here's a little taster of a shot of the old control room for the gearheads amongst you: The green goodness on top is a pair of EQP1a3s from Cartec in the UK. Have had them in for review over the last couple of weeks. Sadly I don't have a real Pultec to try them alongside so can't compare. All I can say is that they have [i]something[/i]. I like them. A lot.

Here's one of the windowless gobos. (No glass yet for the others) It's essentially made of an 8' x 4' inch thick mdf board with a maple veneer to match the rest of the woodwork. It then has a 6 inch deep frame built around it. This will be filled with rockwool slabs and covered with fabric so that I have a reflective side and an absorbent side. Pretty simple to make and effective to boot:

Well, as yet I haven't managed to get a photographer in to do the 'money shots' but they'll be coming soon. Loads of things still going on here in any case. Having put the RPG panels on the wall I was missing having easily portable gobos to move around the place so I've had three 8 feet by 4 feet ones built. Pics to follow. In other news Northward Acoustics have now started on the design of the new control room. We are hoping to start the built around September time. The long stayers may remember the original design looked like this: Well the latest on this is that the control room will no longer look like that. Best advice seems to be that the having the window behind the mix position will cause more problems than it can possibly justify. In the circumstances we are currently looking at a FTB design with the console facing into the live room in the traditional way. Thomas has a v cool idea for the RFZ so watch this space. The bad news though is that all of this means that the live room door has to move about 4.5 feet to the left grrr I guess these things are just sent to try us...

[quote name='51m0n' post='845420' date='May 22 2010, 11:50 PM']Thats a really low budget for mics.[/quote] +1. that's a really low budget. While dynamic mics tend to be much better for the money they really need a decent preamp to drive them as they tend to need much more gain to bring them to life. If you have an SM58 already I'd probably try and add a decent preamp. The Rane MS1b is the only half decent one at your budget level. If not and you are thinking of the LDC option the NT1a, as mentioned above, is probably the best of the budget bunch of LDCs. The ADK A51 is also a great buy if you can find one. If you dont plan to use if for vocals and SDC may be a better bet though. The little Rode NT5 is a bargain buy and probably better on guitars that the LDCs mentioned. You might be able to pick up a used one about about that level.

[quote name='slaphappygarry' post='840005' date='May 17 2010, 06:40 PM']Ah, and for those looking at the other 'stuff' it looks like the fatheads are out and about again... G[/quote] Good spot. As were the pair of R84's about 12 feet back. For the techie nerds the fatheads went to a pacifica and the r84s went to a TG2.

Recording a couple of string players from Birmingham Conservatoire on a record I'm working on this month: In the background you can see the diffsorbers are flipped to diffuse. The super eagle eyed will spot an Ampeg fliptop, a geddy jazz and a vintage precision (hiding behind the geddy)

Of those I'd try the sansamp DI first.

To be honest, at that price, nothing will really be a step up from your home system. Leave your money in your bank until you have enought to get something decent and just get on with making music with what you've got. Dont lose sight of the fact that it's the music that's the important bit!

Essentially there is something going on with similar frequencies as the vocals (guitar/rhodes??) masking the vocal slightly. The key is to sit the vocal in the mix where you want it (perhaps using a little compression) and then EQ conflicting frequencies out of all the other tracks. That means using a fairly surgical EQ with a narrow Q and sweeping the spectrum with a high level of boost to find the worst offenders. When you find them reverse the boost of those frequencies into cuts. Voila, your vocal will now sit more happily in the mix.

Songs are pretty cool. Musicianship is good. Vocals are too loud, have too much verb, are distorted in places and have some masking issues in places. Am only listening on laptop so can't tell what else is going on. Hope this helps.

[quote name='chris_b' post='819444' date='Apr 26 2010, 02:43 PM']New strings or old, a decent engineer can make any bass sound good.[/quote] That may be right in theory but what 'sounds good' is a very subjective matter. What sounds good to me as an engineer might not sound good to you. I tend to try and live by the old adage of quality in = quality out or in other words 'capture the sound you want going in and you won't be in turd polishing territory with the final product'. But what do I know... and for the OP, depends on the sound you want. My ethic agrees with everyone else above overlaid with the above adage.

[quote name='shinhoman' post='818711' date='Apr 25 2010, 11:53 PM']there is a feature in protools that corrects this... and its name has escaped me... argh! i was using a protools 8 HD system though, it might not be on other versions[/quote] that'll be the cleverly named "phase reversal" button. There's one on pretty much every eq plugin.