Rimskidog

Thanks man!

Just realised I never put up photos of the finished superchunks in the booth (before material is applied). Here's two shots, one effectively sits on top of the other:

[quote name='AL3X.R.M' post='816544' date='Apr 23 2010, 06:45 PM']I would say that all of us could probabley put towards it about 50-60 quid each, so around 200-240 pound at a push.[/quote]

Unless you can get a bit more money together there isnt a huge amount between lower end interfaces. If you want something new then something like this: [url="http://www.dv247.com/mixers/phonic-helix-board-12-firewire-mkii-mixer--33713"]http://www.dv247.com/mixers/phonic-helix-b...ii-mixer--33713[/url] would be useable for rehearsal/live, provide a user friendly interface and has a daw bundled with it. It also gives you some money over for microphones, headphones etc.

There are a zillion options though. Here's about 5 pages of them: [url="http://www.dv247.com/search/0/0/ProductQuantity/Descending/firewire/1/"]http://www.dv247.com/search/0/0/ProductQua...ing/firewire/1/[/url]

[quote name='AL3X.R.M' post='815436' date='Apr 22 2010, 08:41 PM']Thanks for your reply's, i guess we're all going to have to save up for some quality stuff that will last. Do you have any recomendations on an audio interface we could use until we start earning a bit more money.[/quote]

At the moment we don't have a clue if you've got 50p or a hundred quid. Give us a clue and we might be able to help!

There are a dozen ways to do this. Ultimately it comes down to how much you can afford?

[quote name='Stu-khag' post='802019' date='Apr 10 2010, 06:56 PM']Ive just spent an enjoyable half hour reading this thread. Fascinating stuff! I can't believe I've missed it all this time. I wish you all the best with this project and like everyone else I'm really looking forward to the updates.[/quote]

Glad somebody is getting something out of it!

I spent a couple of days working away this week so had the carpenter in the studio doing some odds and sods for me. One of the key things was that we finally came up with a system to get the reversible diffsorbers mounted on the wall. Now my original plan was to have some kind of railing system so that they could be moved around the room as well as flipped. In the end I settled for a somewhat more simple system... First take an lcd tv mount and fit it on the wall:



Voila:



Then add another at the top and fit a panel. Result: one 6ft x 2ft absorber



Then flip it 180 degrees and it's a 6ft x 2ft BAD diffusor

[quote name='cheddatom' post='803548' date='Apr 12 2010, 11:37 AM']I can't figure out how they work?[/quote]

in short rather than just a phase reversal button which simply flips it 180, you can sweep through 360 degrees. This means that, for examply when you are double mic-ing something rather than look for the best position vis a vis the phase of the other mic you can simply put it where it gets the tone you want and then sync the phase up.

[quote name='GM10' post='808405' date='Apr 16 2010, 01:56 PM']I've got two jack/XLR inserts on the interface so could still experiment with both DI and mic'd bass amp on seperate channels. Pre amps in the mixer are better for mic'd acoustic guitar/vocal than the interface so it'll remain part of my set up for now. So many options, so little time!

Ta[/quote]

The pres in your mixer may be a tiny bit better than your edirol but unless you go digitally into the edirol you are still going through them (I'll bet a pound to a pinch of sh** that the line in is just the pre with an inline pad so you end up with all the downside of your edirol pre anyway. Trust me. Just try it without. You may well be surprised (experimentation is the key to great engineering in any case). If it doesnt give you a nicer signal at mix time you can always re do it.

Good luck

[quote name='51m0n' post='806967' date='Apr 15 2010, 11:26 AM']If I could only have one thing for tracking bass it would be this:-





There is something utterly magical about that compressor, I've got a tonne of different bass tones from the stereo TwinQ version (this is effectively oine channel of the same unit). The eq is also superb, sublime in fact..

Honestly if you wanted a 'golden bullet' preamp for bass (or mic'ed guitars or even some vox) I cannot recommend this enough.[/quote]

Not sure I'm with you on that. I bought a oneQ because it was as cheap as chips and I had heard good things about it. I think I used it twice before it went. If I had to buy one tool for recording bass it would be an A Designs reddi if I was going for pure tone or if I was going for flexibility I'd buy a Creation Audio Labs MW1. It has a beautiful clean DI and, has great re-amping possibilities. (I have both and woulndt part with either of them)

[quote name='GM10' post='806418' date='Apr 14 2010, 07:38 PM']Fair point about the compressor. I was meaning from the range of stomp really.

So far my best sounding set up is just DIing. My Sandberg to - AR-133 to Mackie 1202VLZ pro mixer (EQ all at 12:00) to Edirol FA66 interface to Cubase Essentail 5. Tweaking compression and EQ in Essential 5 . My levels are set OK with no clipping. I did try my compulater before the AR133 in the chain but it sounded crap.

I've experimented with the above set up but also used the link out of the AR 133 to my amp. My amp isn't too good, Fender Rumble 100 1X15. There may lie the problem, although I do think it sounds OK. I then mic'd the amp ( done some research on mic positioning)with an SM57 put it into the Mackie mixer, interface, Cubase and recorded onto a seperate channel. I couldn't get a sound I was happy with from thr two channels. Too muddy. I may not have given this enough experimenting time yet but I'm interested to know if anyone thinks I can improve my set up or am i making any glaring mistakes.[/quote]

I'd take the mixer out of the chain and go straight from the AR133 to the edirol. You have too many gain stages in there.

[quote name='deathpanda' post='802697' date='Apr 11 2010, 03:39 PM']I would also like to know how I can get a decent bass recording using the stuff I have. Instead of making my own thread I hope it's okay that I post this in your thread.

Anyway, I have an edriol interface, and a bass. That's literally all my recording hardware, the rest unfortunately is software. Which brings me to my point, I've been using amplitube ever since I got the interface, and whilst it's amazing for guitar, with bass it doesn't sound good at all. The bass heads and cabs are terrible, but they're good for acoustic guitar. I've tried using just cabinet impulses, and no matter how much EQ or compression I use, I can't for the life of me get a good bass tone, and it sounds even worse in the mix. I know it's not my basses, I can get great tones out of them with my amp. I don't have any mics for the amp, and I don't think I'll have the money for one any time soon...

Does anyone have any tips? Perhaps someone has the same kinda set up as me and can share their bass recording method? As always, any help would be appreciated![/quote]

Tone in = tone out. Does the bass sound the way you want it to as you are recording it? If so it may be that you are overcooking it in the way in (I explained this above). If you arent getting the perfect tone before you hit the record button then you'll always be in turd polishing territory. Work hard on that input sound and it will repay you tenfold.

[quote name='HoweDy' post='802433' date='Apr 11 2010, 11:07 AM']that is a big help cheers, by signal chain do you mean what is the chain from my bass going to my computer? If so, at the moment it is - bass (fender jazz) - amp (peavey tnt) - pre out on amp - mixer (does not have a preamp on the mixer) then into computer using realtek plugin - Cool edit pro

I hope that's what you mean, I know it's not the greatest lot of equipment but I'm trying to make do [/quote]

So in terms of your chain you can see that after your bass your chain is less than optimal. If you don't have any cash for upgrades I'd start by removing the Behringer from the chain. It looks like an extra gain stage in the signal chain for no good reason. I'd dump it unless you have a good reason not to. I've searched realtek and it looks like just a normal soundcard rather than an audio recording specific one. That will not be helping. Finally, what level are you hitting your DAW at? You want to be hitting about -18 to -12dbfs maximum. If you are hitting more than that you are essentially burning the audio. Hope this all makes sense?

[quote name='GM10' post='802354' date='Apr 11 2010, 09:19 AM']Where in the chain would the hardware compressor go? I've got pretty much the exact set up you've suggested but even though I've invested in a good compressor, a Demeter Compulator, it still seems to sap the tone from my bass. I've had more success to date using a software plug in for compression. I put the DC first in the chain.

I've also had limited success in combining DI and mic'ing into two seperate channels. Maybe a phasing issue?[/quote]

are you micing or DI'ing? Tell me what your exact chain is. FWIW the compressor you mention is at the lower end of the spectrum rather than the upper end. How much are you compressing with it?

[quote name='HoweDy' post='801983' date='Apr 10 2010, 06:21 PM']Hi guys, for the last year or so I have been doing random little recordings of my bass through a small behringer eurorack mixer then through to cool edit pro on my computer, I really am useless at recording bass, so does anyone have any good ideas in how I can get something that sounds as good and as clear as this:

[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j_Ea_FTBtew&feature=fvw"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j_Ea_FTBtew&feature=fvw[/url]
???

Cheers[/quote]

the key to good recording is capturing good quality going in. That starts at your own fingers. Every bit of the chain is important and every bit either adds or takes away from the final product. So you need: a good player, a good quality instrument, good strings, and then either a good bass amp, speakers and well position appropriate mic in a good room going into a good/appropriate preamp or alternatively a good quality DI going into a good preamp. All of this needs to go through a good quality a/d converter. You are also likely to need a compressor on their somewhere (a decent software plugin will hold down the dynamics but a good hardware one will be more musical).

Now don't get me wrong here. I'm not saying it's not possible to get an adequate bass recording without that. I'm just explaining how every part of your signal chain that is lacking will take a few percent away from the product. Now if I was on a low budget and wanted to get the best quality bass I could I'd probably buy a BSA ar133 or similar DI, unplug the behringer and go directly into my audio interface/converter. (a good rule of thumb is the shorter you can make the signal path the less degraded the signal becomes.

Now it isn't clear what your exact signal chain is. If you can list it here that would be useful.

Hope this helps.

[quote name='51m0n' post='801382' date='Apr 9 2010, 11:28 PM']Now thats a cool little piece of kit, bet you've got more than, or have wanted to get another at some point!

Can that help fine tune room mics on a kit as well?[/quote]

Yeah they are awesome. Great on drum kits, for double micing guitar cabs, all sorts of uses. I have a pair. :brow:

Your absolutely right that all of the above create a fix for the problem mentioned. It creates a small problem in itself though that you actually lose the benefit of some of the natural room sound created by the space. A better fix which sorts out the phase issue and keeps all the benefits of having a bit of space is the use of a Little Labs IBP (in-between-phase) tool. I use this method on bass all the time: perfect bass sounds every time!

[quote name='PapillonIrl' post='798819' date='Apr 7 2010, 03:36 PM']Great thread.

Is there a definite date for the arrival of the console ? Or are you going to just watch the market for a while and see what comes up ?

Cheers,

Nathan[/quote]

Console isn't coming until new control room is complete. Designers start work next month on that. Build is likely to start late summer so realistically it'll be early next year before console arrives. If there's a decent used Legacy available at the time I might go with that. Otherwise, unless I get a windfall from somewhere, I'll very probably be ordering a new API 1608 plus extension pack in early January.

So, this weekend saw some work on the inside of isobooth 1. First up we put some vertical batons on the wall before splitting 4 inch thick 4' x 2' slabs of RS60 rockwool diagonally and dropping them in place:



Here's a close-up of how the batons hold them in:



Here is a pic of the superchunch standing at about 7 feet tall:



Only about 5 feet to go:

The A7s are midforward which will give the impression they lack bass. If you are aiming for that level of monitor but something less midforward look at the Dynaudio BM5a. And as there's a MKII just come out you may get a discount on the original.

It sounds like you need to work on your gainstaging (google is your friend) but if you are getting what you want out of the shorter route why do anything else

[quote name='escholl' post='789330' date='Mar 29 2010, 01:04 PM']Nice. What are you using for nearfields?[/quote]

Adam s3a.

[quote name='cheddatom' post='783273' date='Mar 23 2010, 12:10 PM']Good on you for helping bands out! I did a couple of albums for free last years (but they were turd polishers) and i'd like to do more, just to get experience, and hopefully to help people. Obviously i'm no where near your standard yet!![/quote]

Thanks man. As it happens the next unsigned band I'm working with comes from your neck of the woods. They are called The Smoking Kills. I did 3 of Clubs for them last year. You can hear it here: [url="http://www.myspace.com/thesmokingkillsuk"]http://www.myspace.com/thesmokingkillsuk[/url]. Have you come across them? I think they have a really cool vibe.

So only a couple of things left to do on the live room in this phase of the construction: iso 1 has to be completed (watch this space) and the rpg reversible diffsorbers need to be wallmounted. In the meantime I've started to get ready for the new control room build. Here's my new mains - a pair of ATC SCM300s:



(sorry for the quality of the pics, my iphone isnt very good in low light)

[quote name='slaphappygarry' post='779638' date='Mar 19 2010, 12:07 PM']Hey Trev,

Any chance in a decent mp3? I could only hack about 10 seconds on Myspace before closing the window.

G[/quote]

Sorry man. Not my material so I couldn't release it through the back door like that. I know they plan to release it digitally so can let you know when they do if that's of interest?

[quote name='Lord Sausage' post='779622' date='Mar 19 2010, 11:54 AM']Er! not to be an arsehole, It's just generic indie that's been done a million times by a million bands. Its sounds like 1996 meets the arctic monkeys. i think that ship has sailed. it's not very tight either. Living in Manchester i hear this kind of band everyday. production is quite good tho. But there is a thing on your topic that says you can't polish a turd![/quote]

I guess as long as a lot of kids are still listening to this then there's still a market somewhere. I know these guys fill their gigs so they must be doing something right. Appreciate your honesty though. (and as an aside as the production's the only bit I'm responsible for I'll take 'quite good' as a complement from a critic such as yourself )

My new year's resolution this year was to give a bit back. As a result I decided that during the course of the year I'd take on 4 unsigned bands that I thought had some great material but not the savvy and try and help them get a deal, first by recording/mixing and producing them myself during downtime and second by shopping them around some of my contacts. The first band I did is called "The Low Orders". We had their debut EP mastered at Abbey Road yesterday. Here's a link to their page: www.myspace.com/theloworders (I did the first three songs listed ie not Mardy Wife). Let me know what you think!
Trev