Al Krow

Thanks @Phil Starr. Excellent, as usual!

I think he's finally succumbed to his own bug. It's really not pleasant.

@EBS_freak thanks for that. Totally agree about the top-end f-response being important, the lack of which is a key reason for me looking to replace my BF SC. Do you know if the BF FR800 power module has a DSP? My understanding was that the BB2 was already pretty flat response and not adding much in the way of tonal 'colour'?

So we maybe need to formulate a general principle here, along the lines of a D class watt = a tube watt = a watt. On the same lines an FRFR lb = a bass cab lb 😁 But, more seriously, I take your point that shape and handle location can make something heavier easier to carry.

Thanks John. That makes sense about upright, given that the SC has a top end f-response of just 4k, and 'piezzo' / upright is going to want to go higher than that to get that top-end 'zing'. It seems to me that a 'DIY FRFR' may be the solution here: I'm thinking along the lines of a BF BB2 as the transparent cab (which is, anyway, the basis of the expensive 600W BF FR800) and then adding pre / post as I like. I'll probably initially be sticking with my DG M900, which allows me to bypass the amps pre if I want to. The BB2 is just 26lbs. Seems to me this could potentially give me a best of both worlds compromise?

Congrats Lee - I think you've picked up a bargain there! So you've clearly got the BB bug real bad - that's now two BBs in not many more months! I hope it doesn't turn into the virulent Andyonis Travastis version which I've heard can be pretty lethal... 😂

I've just seen the parallel thread that is looking at wireless PA options - and seen @EBS_freak 's really helpful post on that. However, I think Steve's post is where we are at i.e. we don't have a sound man and in the bands I'm in it's just one of the band members who sets the level (drummer in one, guitarist in the other), so keeping it simple is going to be the way to go. One of the bands gigs relatively infrequently so investing the time to get up to speed on something like the XR18 is maybe going to be a big ask. And maybe the XR18 is going to be overkill for our needs (8 mono inputs should more than suffice): Having said all that - I did find the QSC Touchmix 16 that EBS recommended to be strangely alluring with it's compact size and built in interface (and with a budget to fit). The Mackie DL1608 ,which Paul recommended, could be an option but would require us to also get a dedicated iPad. At the moment the simplicity of the Allen & Heath ZED60-14FX is still looking appealing, not least given our familiarity and being up to speed with its baby brother.

Gents - I think you've missed misunderstood my point. I AGREE that the RCF 745A looks very capable and should be able to do the job! See my post to BRX earlier: My Q is in the second sentence above. I currently have a BF SC (21 lbs) and a D class head (3 to 4 lbs) = 25 lbs all in. It handles a 5 string just fine. I know the 745A can do the trick. But it's a 44 lb lug around. Is there anything else in the FRFR world that can compete or even come close to my current rig in terms of (i) handling a low B string (please note I'll be using it as back line and not just as a monitor) and (ii) that is also relatively compact / portable?

Excellent, thanks Frank. I suspect there may be a couple of other London & surrounding area bassists who would also be interested in this (and if not, I certainly am!) - let's see if we can set something up offline. And Brick Lane is a stone's throw away from me for the après A/B Right, gents, time for me throw the towel in for today... 🧐zzzzzzz

Why did you think this strange? That's completely normal in my books - we have a peak frequency above which we simply don't register, which generally reduces with age. It's a bit like blowing a dog whistle: inaudible to humans, but not to dogs...

Yes, completely and that's very kind - where are you based? If you're closer to me than PMT Romford (which has a good selection of FRFR), I'll happily take you up on it

Me too (see the 'Can you hear it?!' thread in gen discussion for proof! 😀)

@BigRedX - I see you're using the highly regarded RCF 745A which is 15" woofer; - 3db 45 Hz to 20 KHz and 44 lbs; and you're also 5 string player. Would anything smaller / lighter be realistically capable of dealing with the low B string with authority?

@paulbuzz - some really good points, thanks. Picking up on one: I think you've hit a particular nail well on the head above. If I'm looking for something < 40lbs (which is my personal 'comfortable' weight limit) and wanting to avoid anything larger than a 12" speaker, then I'm looking at something like a QSC K12.2. But at - 6dB this has a frequency range of 50Hz to 20kHz. As a bass player, that very top end (> 15 kHz) is superflous to me, but my low B is at 31 Hz; so it's clearly not a speaker that has been designed with a focus on the bass player. I'm not sure there is anything on the market that hits the spot, in the way that a dedicated bass cab does, in terms of handling the low B string notes with authority without being a large / relatively heavy item. (Bear in mind my starting point here is separates: D class head and BF Super Compact cab).

That's actually really helpful point. One of the 'myths' around FRFR is that you need amp and cab sims to make them work well. But from what you're saying Frank, that's a nonsense. You can go bass --> (colourless) FRFR and get to hear what your bass really sounds like!

Such a spoil sport 😛

@steantval may find your tinnitus workaround helpful (as may a bunch of others folk). I think I'll stick to the just the highest frequency for the poll as our low frequency hearing (from my understanding anyway) is much less impacted by the ravages of wear & tear and age than our high frequency hearing (and it also keeps the poll relatively simple!). So I suspect we would find that there would be a significant bunching around the 20 to 30 Hz mark. What, however, might also be interesting is for you to listen to just the very low frequencies (which hopefully won't set off any tinnitus?) through a good pair of headphones and see if you can hear lower than 31 Hz? If you can't, the good news is you at least have the open low B string covered (= 31 Hz) so you're not missing out on any bass notes!

[Aside] Re your previous Q on another thread - if you're going on this particular journey, Luke, then you definitely need the greater capability of the Stomp and its amp and cab modelling. Time to let go of the B3n.

On this particular subject I don't have a problem being regarded as being a bit of a moron. Oxy or otherwise.

Big heavy rigs and paying for roadies would not be my choice for where my money would go... So, nope, I don't think you can necessarily extrapolate this to a majority of BC'ers from your own dark desires to be a rock god 😀 What about the small point of your bass, pups and strings in relation to tone? Surely that's going to play just as big a part? I've not really got into amp modelling yet on my Helix or previously on my B3n, but maybe that day will come. ********************************************** I think what I'm hearing, so far, is that if you want to create your "own pre-amp" either with pre-amp pedals or modelling AND you don't like the delicious tone that certain cabs, which are specifically tuned / geared for bass, provide, then FRFR is the way to go. They're also useful if you want to put other instruments and vocals through and can provide an angled stage monitor. But active FRFR is essentially a flavourless combo, to which you need to add your own salt and spices to taste.

Appreciate it's a bit of a side track - but I like this suggestion a lot! It's maybe something I can do via my Helix Stomp, but maybe more likely a mixture of a KMA Tyler (or similar) plus Boss LS-2. On the plus side, I'm expecting my Stomp to be eliminating a bunch of pedals on my board over the coming six months so there should be ample space to fit these two additional pedals on

What would you recommend sub wise, if one was to be foolish enough to head down that particular rabbit hole?

You can be such a flea bag at times... 😄

On the plus side, Paul, a Motorhead reunion concert should hold no terror for you...