blue

[quote name='operative451' timestamp='1441215613' post='2857037'] I don't know about all this 'you don't know man, you weren't there' malarkey. I mean, it sounds a lot like the first time i heard 'Let it Go'... [/quote] Unfortunately, it just means you don't get it. Not the worse thing in the world, it's just the way it is. Blue

[quote name='Grassie' timestamp='1441180506' post='2856614'] Well, I'm not a working musician (unfortunately), it has always been a hobby for me, but one that brings in a little extra cash that comes in handy for holidays and things like that. If it was a full time job, well, I'd be taking whatever came my way and enjoying a lot more because doing something you love for a living is the ultimate aim isn't it? My attitude to my current situation is one of not having to put up with certain elements that go hand in hand with playing in a weekend pub band (I won't go into the gory details, but I'm sure you can use your imagination). I certainly wouldn't be so churlish to bite the hand that feeds, especially in the company of professional musicians on a public internet forum if I was a professional musician myself. As it's my free time I'm giving up every weekend I feel I have a right to make that free time as enjoyable as possible, as I'm sure you'd agree. [/quote] I agree, when it's a hobby it should be fun, however in order to have fun you have to find the right people with the right mind set. and that's not easy to do. For me it's a job, which is what I have always wanted. Bookings and working with experienced fair people that know how to be in a band the work well with others are of the utmost importance. Blue

[quote name='skankdelvar' timestamp='1441042604' post='2855604'] I think we have to put this all in context. You are ten years old. It is February 1964 but - frankly - it could be 1954. You are in Milwaukee, Wisconsin. Barely three months earlier President Kennedy was assassinated and a pall still hangs over the nation. It is the depths of winter and your fellow citizens of Milwaukee have little to cheer them. The only recent local event of note has been the production of the world's largest cheese (15,723kg) for the New York World's Fair. Last week there was a military coup in some place called Vietnam but American troops are already there in small numbers so no cause for alarm. As January turned to February the somewhat 'tired' Mr Bobby Vee sat atop the singles charts but this week it's the Beatles. The mania has already begun to build. One month earlier 'Meet The Beatles' went gold and manufacturer Baskin Robbins released 'Beatle Nut Ice Cream'. It is a cold Sunday night and the nation's most popular TV show comes on air. Most people have just heard the rumours so they tune in out of habit or curiosity.Ed turns to the camera, delivers a brief intro and there they are. Sixty per cent of the nation's TV audience is watching as the Beatles open and close the show. Next day, the talk in school is of nothing but the Beatles. And they'll be back on Ed Sullivan next week and the week after. They will eventually play ten or so different songs and get the biggest exposure since Elvis in 1956 With these performances the Beatles will assist at the birth of the sixties as a 'decade' and - in so doing help to detonate counter-cultural attitudes which will survive into the 21st century. For four years the Beatles will be the most important pop group in the world. They will lead their worldwide audience of tens of millions into considerations about politics, fashion, protest, drugs, war and peace. By the mid-late sixties the Beatles will be the reclusive elder statesmen of the gentle, hopeful flower-power generation. They have helped to give birth to a way of life and are - in some ways - its public face. But as the decade ends amidst the bleakness of Altamont and Nixon's first term the Beatles will sign out and leave the building, taking their optimism with them. The Sixties are over and for many the world will seem a greyer place. Doubtless we have each had our musical epiphanies and valid they will have been, dear reader. But we have not shared an epiphany with so many other people and in such a profoundly all-encompassing way as did the American Beatles generation. We cannot possibly comprehend what it was like to live in America from 1963 to 1970 and to have been experiencing the music, the films, the books, the colours, the ideas, the Vietnam war and the politics as they happened. It is of this [i]totality[/i] which Blue speaks when he expresses the importance of the Beatles in kindling young peoples' response to the challenges of the Sixties. Frankly, I am envious. I was there in the sixties but I wasn't [i]there[/i]. Everything else is white noise. [/quote] Skankdelvar, you are the master wordsmith. You have carefully articulated what was happening and why it could not have happened with other bands after The Beatles. I think it was such a phenomenon, the younger folks here can't grasp what were talking about. In most of their post they are completely missing the point. But I want to stress again, it's not their fault. They weren't there, hence there is no way of getting them to understand. We can't explain the explainable. Much Respect To All Blue

[quote name='Rich' timestamp='1441011282' post='2855221'] + about a million. My musical epiphany was the 2-Tone/ska revival of the late70s/early 80s. Horace Panter made me want to play bass, Suggs made me want to be silly, Dave Wakeling made me want to protest about stuff, they all made me want to get up and dance. It grabbed me in a way I cannot possibly explain and changed music, changed life, for me forever. That was my magic. Didn't hear much Yellow Submarine influence in there either [/quote] And at some point Horace's influence go back to The Beatles. Protest, yeah The Beatles had a big foot print there too, especially John. Guys, were not talking about a record or a show. It was like a religion as I have said many times before, a way of life. Blue

[quote name='Woodinblack' timestamp='1440976371' post='2855114'] No, you can't. But then I can't imagine your magic being at the same level as mine. Thats the way with magic, and experience, it is personal and non transferable. [/quote] True, except when it come to The Beatles. No other generation had the chance to experience that we did. it's just one of those things you can't explain. In closing, we were there, you weren't. Respectably Blue

[quote name='Cosmo Valdemar' timestamp='1440967868' post='2855044'] Have a look at their live history up to that point. More than most manage in a lifetime. [/quote] Yeah to that, dig it. Blue

[quote name='Billy Apple' timestamp='1440955499' post='2854956'] I dunno. Seeing Motorhead at Newcastle City Hall in 1980 was pretty bloody good. Awesome, as you might say. [/quote] I'm sure it was. But as good as Motorhead is, they like other bands will never create the magic we experienced in 1964. Again The Beatles were so much more than music or a concert event. They were a way of life. In closing, You had to be there. Blue

[quote name='Grassie' timestamp='1441046335' post='2855646'] Evening all, thought I'd share my thoughts with you on this, it's not the usual "arrgghh! I want to kill the guitarist so I've quit!" kind of rant, more of a realization. I've been with this band (pubs/clubs, classic rock/pop covers) for just over two and a half years and it dawned on me toward the end of last year that I really didn't want to play that kind of music any more. Nothing wrong with it as such, but the stuff we have been playing is (for want of a better phrase) "old hat". Now, I'm no spring chicken (turned 40 this year), but songs like "Summer Of '69", "Are You Gonna Go My Way?", "Day Tripper", [i]plus many more classic hits from a bygone era[/i]... are stuff that, from my point of view, does not get my blood pumping, nor does it give me anything more to do (for the most part) than plodding eighth notes. So why did I join in the first place I hear you shout.... I've always loved playing - that's the simple answer, but my taste in music is quite varied. I love stuff by RHCP, Stone Temple Pilots, Faith No More, INXS, Level 42, Jamiroquai, Bernhoft, Depeche Mode, Chemical Brothers, Prodigy, Boards Of Canada, Goldfrapp, Mr Scruff, Stone Roses - I could go on, and sometimes do... but my tastes have resulted in me not being able to make my mind up about what it is I really want to do (and could do [i]well)[/i] in terms of playing the bass guitar in a live situation. Finding like-minded souls here on the Isle of Wight to work with is not happening (unless I suddenly find myself enraptured with the acoustic sounds of Donovan, Fairport Convention etc. cos everyone here seems to be on some flowered up folky love trip). I recently bought myself a stratocaster to try to widen my musical palette a little more in terms of playing instruments, but I'm now considering selling it and my recently modified VM Squier P/J bass to buy a 5 string bass of some quality so that I can concentrate on the instrument I fell in love with more than 20 years ago, and make some noise that is fulfilling both artistically and for the listener. At least that's what I [i]think [/i]I want to do. Or maybe I'll carry on making instrumental electronica, putting out on Bandcamp to have it routinely ignored by the global internet community (www.bonnevillemusic.bandcamp.com if any of you are slightly curious) as I have been doing for some time now. Who knows? I don't, that's for sure... Does anyone else have these issues? Surely I can't be the only one? Am I mad? What bass should I buy next? Should I go fretless? Should I flog the lot and take up painting instead? Nurse! The screens! [/quote] No, I have none of the issues you have described. I am a working bass player , I do this for a living. The things your describing sound like things that use to happen in High School bands. I advise all those that only want to play music they like to forget about bands, at least working bands. I don't play music I like, but I'm gigging constantly. I play in a band with good musicians that are smart knowledgeable trustworthy people and have a solid book of good paying business. To be honest, it's sounds like you would be happier doing the bedroom home recording thing. Blue

I have been playing in working bands since 1966. The only guys that forget how to play are those that couldn't play in the first place. Blue

I think this band thing is so different to different guys. For most it's not your whole life, for me it is. Standing up and performing for 4 hours with two 15 minute breaks is work anyway you look at it. For guys that want to give that away fine. Me, no way. I won't turn the key in my car for less than$100.00. Blue

[quote name='bassman7755' timestamp='1441005222' post='2855165'] I dont think there any sort of principal involved, its purely your personal choice and I wouldnt feel any obligation to take it. Leave it and let someone do it who is happy to do a an unpaid gig take it and everyone involved is a winner. I would say though that not-for-profit usually means that excess profit (i.e. profit remaining after paying some of the people) goes to charity - not the entire gross receipt, that is after all how many charities operate so some of the people involved will be getting paid something most likely (just possibly not some of the bands). [/quote] Exactly, for some reason these people know that younger musicians are not business savy and can be conned to play for free because of the " exposure" you get. My opinion, your exposed to more people that expect you to play for free. Rubbish Blue

I haven't read all the posts. At 61 years of age I have been gigging since 1966. My band currently plays around 75 paid gigs annually. I do not provide service free of charge. I play bass guitar and sing back ground vocals for people that pay me. I'm not 16 and I'm not 23 or in that [i]"I just Want To Play"[/i] phase of my life. This is how I make my living not a flippant [i]" we play when a gig comes along",[/i] " basement social session " or [i]"I have a regular job and would never do this for a living"[/i] proposition for me. If your a younger , [i]"I just wanna play"[/i] kind of guy and your willing to play for free and take a loss, cool. Personally, I would say [i]"thanks but no thanks"[/i] Blue

[quote name='TimR' timestamp='1440882228' post='2854583'] We were listening to the car radio the other day. On one of those radio stations for old people - Radio 2. My 15yo daughter remarked that she knew the tune being played, it was really old, but she liked it. The tune? George Michael - Careless Wisper. I believe one of his influences was Freddie Mercury. Anyway. My point? I can't remember now. Oh yes. My kids have been trained never to say "It's not fair." So your observation is a fairly general one. [/quote] I'm sure Freddie was influenced by The Beatles. Blue

[quote name='Woodinblack' timestamp='1440809511' post='2854107'] No, I get it, I wasn't there and I am good with that, The time I grew up, the decade after that was great for music, and the life that went with it and magical to me, and the life that went with it. I suspect it was to all of us when we get to that age. And like most of us I guess, we wouldn't have rather been born at a different time, and that is pretty good. [/quote] I can't imagine that the magic was at the same level as my generation experienced with The Beatles. Blue

[quote name='the boy' timestamp='1440803152' post='2854080'] Everybody knows it's impossible to insult an American. I'm obviously kidding. Blue is s gent. [/quote] YAY! Blue

[quote name='Woodinblack' timestamp='1440782546' post='2853885'] I was one year into Generation X, they were still going when I was born, to me they were old people music, but not my parents, as my parents were the generation past that, they were the decade back of that. They were uncle music. Like the war, very important but you get tired of it being mentioned any time someone says something about germany [/quote] I think that's the point many younger generations are missing. You keep mentioning music. It was so much more than music. It's hard to explain. You had to be there. LOL Blue

If it's a paying gig take it. If not, don't and don't get in the habit of giving your efforts away free of charge. Blue

[quote name='TimR' timestamp='1440765240' post='2853643'] Well I'm confused. Is it no wonder that people who weren't there don't get it. I certainly don't think it's even possible to explain it. And I still have no idea why it's a curse. [/quote] The curse is, you will never get or understand one of the most important part of Pop Rock history. To me that's a curse. Blue

[quote name='TimR' timestamp='1440758848' post='2853543'] Because I still find it very hard to believe that just one group can be singlehandedly responsible for the '60s. [/quote] Hard to believe, yes. But if you study their history in detail they had a huge hand in the effort. Blue

[quote name='skankdelvar' timestamp='1440708961' post='2853261'] In re: Bolan, Bowie, Slade and the Sweet being influenced by the Beatles: * Mr Bowie collaborated with John Lennon on 'Fame', sampled 'A Day in The Life' and covered 'Across the Universe'. * Marc Bolan worked with Ringo Starr in the movie Born To Boogie while - in return - inspired Mr Starr's single 'Back Off Boogaloo'. They also went on holiday together and had a lovely time. * Mr Noddy Holder's most recent stage appearance on March 27th (his first in many years, afaik) was a performance at Walsall town hall with Beatles tribute band 'The Born Again Beatles'. * I cannot report on the Beatles influence on The Sweet, but Mr Andy Scott of that band lives in the next village over from me. If and when I see him I shall ask him to vouchsafe the facts in the matter. [i].[/i] Such intelligence as I have garnered may not be conclusive proof of any influence but is certainly[i] suggestive.[/i] [/quote] Man, I love The Sweet! Blue

[quote name='Marvin' timestamp='1440672208' post='2852815'] There were very few bands that I listened to, when first getting serious about music, that took much, if anything, from the Beatles. In my formative years I started by listening to 50's rock'n'roll and stuff Teddy boys would have listened to. From that I went to blues and r&b and from there to punk. For my musical development they're a bit player. And for the younger folk of today the Beatles have near no influence at all...not with regards to hip hop and contemporary R&B which seems to be their thing. [/quote] I wouldn't categorize Hip Hop or contemporary R&B as Pop or Rock. So I agree with you there. Obviously early R&B influenced The Beatles. Blue

[quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1440671594' post='2852812'] Yeah, but so what? *channelling my 13 year old self* TBH everyone is influenced by everything they hear in both wanting to be like the bands they like and not wanting to be like the bands they don't like. I'm sure that I have been influenced by The Beatles over the years but to me they are no more or less important as an influence then the 1000s of over bands that I have heard in that time. [/quote] I would say yeah, you have been influenced by The Beatles and so were the other 1000s of bands you mentioned. Blue

[quote name='tauzero' timestamp='1440662632' post='2852706'] Why do you think that? Does your hero worship blind you totally? [/quote] Because,Bolan, Bowie, Slade and The Sweet were influenced by The Beatles. All post 1964 rock pop bands were. It just the way it is. I won't even give you an answer on why I think they were. It's just silly to think they weren't. LOL Blue

[quote name='Annoying Twit' timestamp='1440688962' post='2853011'] Have you seen Allan Pollock's "Notes On..." series analysing the Beatles' songs? [url="http://www.icce.rug.nl/~soundscapes/DATABASES/AWP/awp-beatles_projects.shtml"]http://www.icce.rug...._projects.shtml[/url] It's surprising how much there is going on in even the simple sounding early songs such as "Love Me Do", but in particular by the time of songs such as "Another Girl". Sounds, simple, but there are some tricky key changes in there. [/quote] For me, to this date, John's harmonica intro on "Love Me Do" is brilliant. Blue

[quote name='the boy' timestamp='1440684304' post='2852949'] For the record I wasn't there and I'm not particularly a fan. [/quote] I you weren't there it would be very difficult to be a fan. Blue