blue

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1418590404' post='2631545'] I am all for this...but the band better be as good as its boast. It's a bet.... and you'll only take it on if you think you'll win. But... it is easier money doing a party for 3 times the pub fee... all you have to do is seal the deal in the first place as the party will supply the audience. Ticketed gigs are fine..but there is a lot of pressure on selling 350 tickets for acts that can play in a local-ish pub a few months later.[/quote] Parties are great, however it's not the kind of repeat business bands nned to survive. Selling tickets, over hear that's strictly for the Originals, [i]"were trying to make it"[/i] bands. Blue

Over here in the States, some bars/clubs won't talk to bands. They only deal with agencies and will book whoever the agency refers. Blue

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1418549671' post='2631007'] As regards LL not keen on booking you..firstly it is a two way street, secondly, we'd say 'their loss'.. We do more than enough pubs for our liking so not interested in playing places that aren't keen...etc etc . And even the most stupid LL is going to call the more successful draws as they will be in trouble soon enough without good nights. But there are plenty of pubs we wont touch. I am not playing tiny pokey pubs, sh*t-holes or rough pubs. Basically, anywhere we wouldn't take our partners is out... and we have a two pub per town rule so we target the two best that we can get in. I'll be in a band, but I wont be in a pub band exclusively as they just are too much work for the money..so there needs to be something else about them... [/quote] Interesting comment, I feel the same way about sh*t-holes ( you guys have those in the UK too? ). However, I also don't like nice places with unresponsive, unappreciative crowds. Blue

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1418549032' post='2630998'] Every decent venue will have bands banging on the door.. One LL told me he 944 bands trying to get at his 150 odd slots a year. But there aren't anywhere near 20 top bands ( depends on your defintion of 'top' ) so there is a lot of dead wood in the numbers. If you are a band that can generate £3k's worth of sales during your stint or the evening, then getting over £300 should be easy. LL's don't mind spending to accumulate but it has to work like that. Maybe it would be better if bands said min fee is £250.. or whatever and accepted a bonus rather than saying £350..?? Both parties have to be confident that arrangement will work tho and you need to trust the LL. The other thing bands don't get is that their evening isn't the whole deal...and a LL will look at his music night costs over a period, and good nights subsidise bad nights and so you are all in it together in providing a good rosta.. Both it is natural that bands would only want to deal on things they can control..ie, their gig, as the content of the rosta is not their remit. [/quote] I agree, but how about this. The band that can go to the landlord and tell him with no exception the band will pack his place and his sales will increase from the previous Friday or Saturday night by 25%. Most bands can't make this claim, we can't. And then say if it doesn't happen, you don't pay. I guess you would really have to trust the landlord, I would not use this approach with a sleeze. Blue

[quote name='ezbass' timestamp='1418578747' post='2631360'] Fender Twins are great, classic amps but they are earth shattering loud. When I used to play guitar live I had a '59 Bassman reissue which was 40 watts and stupid loud, so I modded it to allow it to produce the tones I wanted at a lower output. Fender Hot Rods have the same, audience deafening quality/problem, especially the 4x10. The only answers are a smaller amp, max 30 watts, or, as has already been suggested, an attenuator like the THD. From a practical POV I'd go for a smaller amp, as the Twin, as well as being stupidly loud, is no lightweight either. [/quote] Yeah, even back in my day,(the 60s) twins were [i]"the amp"[/i], they were loud as hell. When we were teenagers we didn't have nor could we afford, and as a matter of fact their was not a lot PA technology options at the time. Especially for bar bands. I remember an innovative drummer miced his drums though a twin. Blue

[quote name='Les' timestamp='1418561487' post='2631141'] Age old problem. I do accept that there is a certain amount of volume required to get your sound so get a power soaker or a smaller amp. This is what will happen, he'll be far too loud, so the drummer will start hitting things as hard as he can, you'll turn up cos' you can't hear yourself, your whole show will be ruined by howling feedback as whoever sings will be ragging the monitor system in a desperate attempt to hear themselves. have a friendly word and explain the situation, if he doesn't get the problem sack him immediately. He will ruin the whole playing experience for everyone but himself. By the way we are looking for a guitarist at the minute, tell him not to apply please. Les [/quote] I agree with Les, it's a tough call. We bring a full PA into most bars and I'm sure were to loud at times. However if done right, the PA actually can give you more control over volume than playing without one. Our guitarists can get loud. But their better than most in terms of controlling volume. I really think some guitarist don't get it, you can have nice low stage volume and the sound guy can send the volume and mojo into the house. In the OP case the guitarist might not have a lot of pub experience? I use a 750 GK 100rb with a GK RBX 2 10 cab on top of an RBX 15. Way too much for a club , but I know how to use the volume knob. volume can be dangerous, I have a friend who plaed a bar recently and they don't use a PA. They were loud according to the landlord and he told them they would never be asked back. Blue Pic, cool bar, Friday night

[quote name='MiltyG565' timestamp='1418486727' post='2630618'] The thought that springs to my mind is "Why wouldn't a landlord follow up a good band?". I then think whether it's to put the ball into the band's court. If they chased the band, they'd lose their leverage. They'd be saying "I want you to play at my pub". What they more than likely want is for a band to say "We want to play at your pub", and the landlord can bargain down the price on the basis of "How much do you want to play here? How desperate are you?". And the landlord probably has a ton of bands knocking down his door looking for work. [/quote] Very astute thought, when the landlord ( as you guys call them ) come to us as bands, they're giving up leverage. It makes it a lot easier for us to quote our fee without getting into discounts. Personally, we do it in a pinch, however i do not like discounting our services. Thanks Time Stamp Blue Off topic, pic is what i'm toting to most gigs these days. My Gibson Gold Top and my Limited Edition German Made Hofner 502 Club.

[quote name='cameltoe' timestamp='1418502261' post='2630797'] On another, similar note, has anyone had experience with a landlord/bar manager that didn't seem keen on booking you, even though you went down really well in their venue? We have several really well established venues, and have built up a good following. A couple of years ago we got a gig at a pub in St Ives, and we rocked the place. Everyone dancing, all the feedback from the bar staff was great, the bar manager was super enthusiastic on the night, but never gave us another date, despite loads of chasing. One of his reasons was that the punters just want classic rock (we play pogues-esque folk rock). That same bar manager is now in charge of one of our established venues, and it just so happened we were already booked in for a gig there last month. The place went ballistic, as usual (we've had people crowd surfing in there before-yes in a pub with no stage) and the place must have made a fortune. We usually gig here 3 times a year, one of the venues favourite bands, and wouldn't you know, the new bar manager now isn't giving us any gigs. [/quote] It happens, especially with management changes. Guys, I honestly think some managers are blind and don't attribute a successful big money night to the band. We packed a new place last night, for us the place went nuts, even the balcony was filled.This would be new business for us. I think what we did last night is worth four 2015 dates. Thing is the owners are usually not on site. Blue

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1418423129' post='2630239'] Don't get that at all..... a packed venue and alcohol sales thru the roof is the whole point of it.. If a venue didn't take advantage of a band that could do that, another one would and probably hurt the other venues attendences... On certain saturdays, there could be 8-9 venues/pubs putting on live music in town and another town 15-20 miles up the road doing the same. The better draws hurt attendences/sales in other venues/pubs. If a band is getting those sort of turn-outs, if isn't long before they sell tickets at the event and take a bigger fee.. A good band can get a bar to turn over £3k relatively easily and they then want a bigger slice of the pie.. And LL of pubs and venues will chase the bands that can do this... [/quote] Your using business logic 101.Managers/Owners of clubs and bars have their own logic that does not always follow common sense. Blue

[quote name='Dad3353' timestamp='1418413423' post='2630101'] You have two different Club basses, or have you swapped one for another..? Confused, of Norwich [/quote] Swapped the Contemporary for the real thing and worth every penny. The German made is the Limited Edition 502 Club with the closer Cavern Club PU spacing. Check the similar spacing on Paul's bass. Don't get me wrong, The Contemporary Club is a nice bass, however it doesn't have the [i]"thump"[/i] you get with the real thing. I have wanted a real German made Hofner since 1966. It took 48 years till I could afford one. Sorry for hi-jacking the thread. Blue

[quote name='bonzodog' timestamp='1418383338' post='2629706'] As gig organiser for our band I normally speak to the landlord after we have packed away (providing he does not look too busy). If he doesn't offer a date there and then I usually drop him a facebook message or email (if I have communicated that way before with him/her) just briefly saying how much we enjoyed the gig and would like to play there again. If no reply to that, then a phone call a few days later. There is also the opposite dilemma where you play in a right s**t hole and they ask you back. We have that problem at the moment where the landlord of a local pub is a lovely guy but his pub we played in earlier this year is very rough. He kept ringing asking for more dates before I had to admit to him we didn't want to play there due to feeling very uncomfortable. I don't think I have ever seen the same band play there twice! [/quote] Understood, we have a few clubs/bars that I don't enjoy playing not because they are rough venues. Because they are not established as a live music venue. Usually the clientele does not want or appreciate live music. Hence, your plating to a non responsive uninterested crowd. Why the owners want to book us is a mystery, we take it because we want the $$$$. Blue

[quote name='Happy Jack' timestamp='1418384326' post='2629737'] One reason for NOT approaching the manager at the end of the gig is because, putting it bluntly, so many of them are piss-artists. At a very rough guess, I'd say that half the pubs we played this year the manager was as drunk as his regulars by the end of the evening. [/quote] Is that why I hear so many stories about owners falling down flights of stairs? Blue

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1418381113' post='2629670'] We use text e-mail or Facebook with regulars...and one never does anymore than text. It does annoy me a bit but it has always worked, tbf. If I feel I need to chase a gig, then I'll have to chase it..but the trick is to want them to 'chase' you We've targetted gigs before and they tend to do their homework and check you out, what other people say etc etc That is the beauty of FB as it is easy to get feedback there. Mostly we have 'fans' tell us a certain venue would be good, and they'll put in a word.. [/quote] Over here, owners are really up on social media. FB would not work, you have to call these folks. Blue

[quote name='Adrenochrome' timestamp='1418378014' post='2629641'] 1. wait for the venue to call back (easier for a well established band).[/quote] That might be a cultural or regional thing. Over here, even if you packed the place and the alcohol sales went through the roof the venue is not going to call back. Blue

[quote name='Weststarx' timestamp='1418375047' post='2629608'] It annoys me quite a lot how our band goes about it. We'll get the landlord come up to us after a gig and say something like 'yeah was really good, we'll deffo have you back' and the guitarist who 'books' the gigs just nods and says thank you then will carry on packing up the gear. Surely when the landlord is saying to you 'WE'LL HAVE YOU BACK' you reply with 'Okay great, lets sort some dates...' And they ask why we dont have any gigs booked next year... [/quote] Very frustrating, but not unusual. Most bands have maybe one guy with a good head for business. You might want to take on re-booking your band. Blue

[quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1418401753' post='2629960'] What you don't want between songs is endless tuning up, fiddling with effects pedals settings and discussions happening between the band members on stage. So the last thing I want to be doing is adding to these problems and further breaking the flow of the set whilst I change a string or fix some other problem with my equipment. Sometimes musicians are so wrapped up in their own little creative world that they can't see the bigger picture when it comes to presenting the band to the public.[/quote] I agree, I like a more structured performance not a lot dead air, following the set list ect. It comes off as more professional. Yes, even at the bar/pub band level. I wish my band had this protocol, however we do have a female front who is also our lead guitarist that does an outstanding job interacting and engaging the audience. Blue

[quote name='Les' timestamp='1418333375' post='2629354'] On the night via smartphone. Usually multiples for the next year. [/quote] Cool, we do something similar. We have 2 clubs that we follow up with and can usually book dates for the entire year. That's a real efficient way of doing it. Some clubs, well, that just won't work. blue Playing Pillars this weekend, cool venue, nice stage,good crowd it use to be a Church

For you guys that gig pubs/bars, fairs and festivals. How and when do you re-book your band? Right after the gig, when the place is packed and the register won't quit, follow up call, or wait for the pub to call you ( good luck with that ). Do you re-book single or multiple dates. This is how we make $$$$ and stay busy. Share your thoughts & insights, make a comment or suggestion. Blue Me and Vance Brecia ( Herman's Hermits Staring Peter Noone, Lead guitarist & musical director )

[quote name='Passinwind' timestamp='1418330405' post='2629325'] Yep, but arguably so is the pub owner. Around here you can get decent weekend gigs at those venues if they like what they hear at their open mikes though. [/quote] That's cool and I know some pub owners are cool and have the right intentions. However, I also think that some pub owners don't know a good band from a bad band nor do they distinguish the bands they book from one another. They're just bands. I do think they know when they are not selling alcohol. Blue

At the pub/bar level or that $100.00 a man level, cash is always best. But occasionally the pub owner will give us a check. Blue

[quote name='MiltyG565' timestamp='1418313423' post='2629091'] I know musicians who never play until they're paid. [/quote] Ever go to see one of your national headliners, their suppose to start at 9:00 and everyone is still waiting for the band to come out and it's 9:30? That's usually because their waiting for that money. Blue

[quote name='Pinball' timestamp='1418325113' post='2629251'] This is an annoying thread as I had sold my "reserve" bass and after reading about various mishaps in here I'm now buying it back ! [/quote] Depends on how much gigging you do. I think for the guys out there on the front lines and depend on the [i]"bread"[/i] it's just a good idea to always pack a spare. Hell, there are some groovy Squires ( not my cup of tea ) that would be just fine for some cats. Blue

[quote name='gelfin' timestamp='1417907052' post='2625093'] Well if we're talking Rics. I love them, but having said that I have tried some of the later ones and I didn't like them as much as my main 4001. I have three P bass. 2 Fender and an Antoria from the late 70's. I prefer the Antoria. I have two Thunderbirds a Gibson and a Tokai, I prefer the Tokai. I actually have too may basses but in the end I always go for the Ric it just fits me and is the best sounding bass in the world, REALLY [/quote] As you can tell from the basses I use , I'm into the [i]"look"[/i] side of things. I think once I get a Ric, I will have my bases covered. In the end I go for my German made Hofner Club Bass ( with *Cavern Club PU spacing ). You plug it in and no matter how you eq it, it;s always right on the money. Blue * If you look at the very early pics of Paul playing the Cavern Club, you will see the same close PU spacing on his 1962 Hofner. [size=4][color=#0000FF][font=Arial][color=#000000][b]Bass Guitars [/b][/color][/font][/color][/size] [size=4][color=#0000ff][font=Arial][color=#000000]Gibson Les Paul Gold Top Bass[/color][/font][/color][/size] [size=4][color=#0000ff][font=Arial][color=#000000]Gibson ES-335 Custom Shop Bass[/color][/font][/color][/size] [size=4][color=#0000ff][font=Arial][color=#000000]Gibson 1991 Thunderbird Bass[/color][/font][/color][/size] w/ebony fret board [size=4][font=Arial]Fender 1951 Telecaster Bass Re-issue *MIJ (Dressing Room Bass)[/font][/size] [size=4][font=Arial]Fender 1959 Telecaster Bass Re-Issue MIJ[/font] (Rehearsal Bass)[/size] [size=4][color=#0000ff][color=#000000][font=Arial]G & L 1991 ASAT Bass (active pre-amp )[/font][/color][/color][/size] [size=4][color=#0000ff][font=Arial][color=#000000]German Made Hofner 502 Limited Edition Club Bass[/color][/font][/color][/size]

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1418294891' post='2628826'] Open mics here are for the same reason... always on a quite night...and the house band gets paid but the guests don't. This would be an occasion where the hat could go round, but it is probably better it doesn't.. [/quote] Some bar/pub owner don't make the distinction from hiring a band to the open mic host. All he knows is "[i]I can pay these guys $100.00 for the night why would I pay you guys $500.00"[/i] Am I right ? Blue

[quote name='TimR' timestamp='1418307958' post='2629005'] Pub bands usually get the money at the end of the gig from the landlord/manager. The money is shared out during the pack down.[/quote] I think this method is best at the pub band level. Tip, beware of the band fund unless your young and on the [i]"Were going to make it to the big time path"[/i] [i]Blue[/i]