blue

If your looking to recruit make sure your ad includes what you have to offer. It will be tough to recruit good musicians with experience for a start up project. At least it is over here. I would never audition for a band that did not have business on the books. Blue

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1415731519' post='2603206'] Doesn't make any sense at all to me... WTF..???? Why is that..?? [/quote] I can respond to that. Because, your average person going to a club has very limited musical tastes. What Greg is doing will go over their heads. However, a marginal performance of a Katy Perry or Lady Ga Ga song will keep them happy. Blue

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1415710118' post='2602866'] This is THE trump card, IMO... and if you are regarded as the best band around, then you should be pretty much the first pick of the better gigs.... [/quote] Doesn't work that way here anymore, almost the exact opposite. All the really good bands with outstanding musicians get the lower end gigs and the agency represented very marginal bands get all the great gigs. Below is an example, Greg still plays the same bars my band plays and he blows any agency band away. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XrVWYFHg6N8 Blue

I would say we work well together, most of the band members are in their 60s, so we all have well established social lives outside of the band. I think if we were friends it would be harder to get along the way we do. It's a business. Now when I was younger, in my teens 20s & 30s I was probably friends with band members back then, I really think the friends thing works better with younger musicians unless your playing with guys you've known for 40 years. By the way, if you watched us at a gig you would think we were all best friends. Blue

[quote name='neepheid' timestamp='1415667797' post='2602621'] Doesn't work like that for me. Being on stage and off it are two completely distinct and separate things for me. [/quote] For me, I'm [i]"on"[/i] as soon as I enter the gig for load in and I stay [i]"on"[/i] until I'm in my car on the way home. When I say [i]"on"[/i] I mean I want to be as likable, sociable, polite and gregarious as possible. Blue

[quote name='peteb' timestamp='1415663839' post='2602601'] Surely if you are going to go on a stage and make a fool of yourself in front of complete strangers you should be able to put aside any shyness! Most people I know who play in gigging bands are not noticeably shy (whatever age they are)... [/quote] Good points, can't say I could argue either. BTW, great pics of Rhythm Zoo on your web-site. I will share them with my band as a [i]"This is what we need"[/i] thing Blue

So far, social media, web-sites, personal contact are all good tools for building a following. Good solid professional performances also important and goes without saying. Blue

[quote name='Cameronj279' timestamp='1415662648' post='2602586'] I see saying thanks is just common courtesy but initiating a conversation is sometimes not so easy for me to do. I was more referring to before gigs or when actually trying to advertise. One day I'll hopefully be less held back...hopefully. [/quote] If you stay with this, not only will you not be held back you will look forward to initiating this type of conversation. Blue

[quote name='peteb' timestamp='1415661968' post='2602579'] I think that still has a part to play but these days you do have social media - facebook is a really efficient way of promoting a band at pub level (basically the only promotional tool we use) and helps you to build a relationship with the people who come to see you and therefore build up a following. It obviously doesn't hurt to chat with the punters, but that is no hardship in the vast majority of cases unless you have real issues with shyness.[/quote] Some of this could be cultural differences as well as generational. And I am talking specifically about approaching fans especially those you know were really engaged in the performance ( they're easy to spot ) and saying; [i]" Hi, my name is Blue, I play bass with the band. Hey, I saw you two move from the back up to be closer to us and you stayed for 2 sets. Just wanted say Hi, how are doing and thanks for coming out to see us."[/i] I love doing that and making that sort of connection,learning more about our fans and people that understand and support live bar level Rock. But as you can guess, I am not *shy. Blue * Just so you know, when I was 18 or even in my early 20s I would have not had the confidence to approach anyone and initiate a conversation. At 61, what do have to lose?

[quote name='Cameronj279' timestamp='1415660773' post='2602570'] I'm in the same camp as Neepheid. I don't feel right trying to advertise my band -which is awful since we have just started gigging and should be doing more-. I'm not a particularly popular guy mainly due to how quiet and subdued I am. I also struggle with things as simple as "my band are playing x venue on x date" without feeling like I'm being quite arrogant. [/quote] Question for everyone. Is saying[i] "thank you"[/i], [i]"thanks for coming out to see us"[/i]. Is that advertising? I get that saying "thank you" for some is difficult. That's another discussion. Blue

[quote name='DaytonaRik' timestamp='1415630436' post='2602122'] I've always made sure that there is both a physical presence before and at gigs (posters, flyers etc.) and an online presence pushing the band online, be that the web site or social media through FaceBook and Twitter. I'm a believer in the schmooze factor at gigs - keep the landlord/promoter on your side, make sure they're happy and mingle with the crowd at the interval and afterwards as much as possible - the aloof "I'm in the band" look doesn't do you favours imho [/quote] Yeah, that's what it's all about. I come from the generation where just being the [i]"hot band"[/i] or the band with the great guitarist or drummer was enough to keep a following and maintain return business. Unfortunately that's not the way it works anymore, at least not for bands competing for bar and club business. Blue

[quote name='neepheid' timestamp='1415614167' post='2601916'] Bloody ordering people around in their spare time - "check out our Facebook", "give us a like", "come to our gig, because we're awesome and you'll have a brilliant night", "look at this video", etc. etc. I hate doing it, because when it comes down to it I'm a shy, quiet soul. I just wasn't made for these times. [/quote] Actually I'm talking about mere common courtesy , For me it's just a matter of; [i]" Hi, my name is Blue, I've seen you guys at a few of our shows and just wanted to say Hi and thank you for supporting the band." [/i] I wouldn't be into asking anyone to do anything like go to our FaceBook page or ask them to come to our next gig. Saying "Thank You" is a pretty basic message.Right? Blue

[quote name='flyfisher' timestamp='1415541268' post='2601276'] I can see how an *originals band could develop a following but how does a covers band achieve the same thing, especially if they are gigging every week in a smallish geographical area. How many people really want to see the same band time and time and time again - especially if they are playing 'classic rock' covers all the time? Isn't it really just a case of playing to whatever audience happen to turn up on the night for an evening of music rather than playing to a pack of baying fans who will follow the band to every gig? [/quote] Well, it's funny. I have seen a few come out to see us on a Friday night and they also show up at our Saturday night show. These folks we consider a part of our extended musical family. We create a real friendly atmosphere at our shows and during breaks all member are out there introducing ourselves and engaging these people. Now, we are a cover band, but we play blues/rock and no show is the same. Blue * The band has been together for 8 years. They started out as an originals band , but realized shortly after that in order to get paying bar gigs they would have to switch to covers and it worked.

[quote name='Lozz196' timestamp='1415525986' post='2601071'] Well the band I`m in have been playing mainly supports to bigger bands on the scene, as playing a specific genre we figured that the audience is already there. So we keep seeing the same faces at these gigs and have chatted to them about both our band, and the main headliners who we as a band want to see anyway. We`ve also sold CDs to a good many of them so they chat to us about those, their fave tracks etc. But it`s difficult to say how many follow us specifically seeing as the larger band would probably drag the audience anyway. But seeing as promoters/venues keep booking us I think it`s fair to say we must have something. I also think being easy to work with may have something to do with this, we have a very relaxed way of working and I`d recommend others also do this. So if a venue/promoter/named band want a support that`s easy to work with, you get the slot, then you can develop followers from there. [/quote] Lozz, are you talking about typical pub/bar gigs? Blue

[quote name='Bassmonkey' timestamp='1415498147' post='2600989'] Agree Blue. We now have a following and it amazes me that they come see us time after time, week after week. Like you though, it's been created through effort. We have got to know them, often dedicate songs by name, sing happy birthday, accepted their FB friend requests, keep the website updated and thank them at gigs over the mic for coming. This has lead to us playing their parties, weddings etc too. I always also make a point of mentioning how many regulars are there at our gigs so the bar owners recognise we are bringing a crowd which is of course healthy all around. I have even offered regulars lifts home after the show. It's an effort well worth making. Amazes me too how when speaking to these new friends, they know when and where we are playing often more accurately than me ha ha [/quote] Good point BassMonkey, I like that you acknowledge fans publicly. There are a few regulars I should actually spring for a round of drinks for. Blue

After reading all the comments, I would say before thinking about gear you must have good taste in music and know what you want to do. You might want to be in a band and want to perform live, you might want to teach or be a bedroom noodler. Get a handle on those things first. Blue

[size=4][font=Arial]Developing A Following[/font] [font=Arial]I think a lot of guys in working bar bands would benefit from this discussion, especially with how competitive the market is for maintaining existing business and developing new business.[/font] [font=Arial]Ok, keep in mind this discussion will focus on the working bar band.[/font] [font=Arial]Last night I noticed several couples I have seen at previous gigs. One couple in particular because I saw them at our gig last weekend and I saw them when I was out checking out a friends band last Sunday.[/font] [font=Arial]My thought was we must be doing something right for these folks to follow us. When we took a break I alerted the other band members and I personally went out and introduced my self to each couple and thanked them for their support.[/font] [font=Arial][b]How Do People Know Where Your Performing[/b][/font] [font=Arial]For us we have a busy but well maintained web-site. as soon as your click on our web-site the first thing you see is where our next show is. We also do this for our FaceBook page. In addition we send out posters to every venue a week before each show and we have small 2''x4" flyers we leave on all tables outlining all upcoming shows.[/font] [font=Arial][b]Are You Talking to Your Fans[/b][/font] [font=Arial]There was a time when I did not connect with fans because I just didn't understand how important it is and how it keeps them coming back. I can't think of a reason why you wouldn't want to do that.[/font] [font=Arial]Remember the more people at your shows, the more alcohol sales you generate and increased alcohol sales means [/font][/size] [size=4][font=Arial]more booking ( new business and existing )[/font] [font=Arial]What are your thoughts, comments, insights ect...[/font] [font=Arial]Blue[/font][/size]

Local Milwaukee trio cops a decent groove. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XrVWYFHg6N8 Greg Koch doing Tower Of Power's Don't Change Horses. Blue

[quote name='Bassnut62' timestamp='1415117585' post='2596883'] Defo a can of worms here....anyway here's my two penny's worth........ Poet by Sly Stone.....it's such a sexy groove and has some of the best lyrics ever written about being an artist IMO. I love the rising high-on-neck bass line (or maybe it's an octave down guitar) towards the end of the song.[/quote] Bassnut, you nailed it. Incredible example of groove.The whole Riot album is historic funk & groove. I remember when Sly released the Riot album. It's been like a bible for me since 1971 (43 years ago ). At the time they said the album was ahead of it's time. I got new for them, it's still ahead of it's time. There ain't nobody groovin and funkin like that cat at the end of Poet! Tidbits;[list] [*]If you guys think that's Larry Graham on bass your wrong. [*]That is Sly playing bass. [*]Sly recorded some of the tracks in his RV and some in his Beverly Hills mansion. [*]He drove a lot of cats crazy during that time. [*]He called Bobby Womack before it was released and said; [i]Hey man, I',m coming out of left field on everybody with this one"[/i] [*]Sly came out of left field on everyone with this release. [/list] Blue

[i]"Nobody Pays For Music Anymore"[/i] Joe Walsh Blue

I just added T.C. Electronics Chorus to my board (2nd tier 2nd from the left). I am not sure what I am going to use it for. I use my MXR Bass Octave to thicken the bands sound when the guitarist is taking a solo. It's a stronger foundation and makes the band sound bigger. But you have to be careful, you can't go crazy and I get the best results from playing closed, no open strings and I am usually grooving up around the 9th fret and higher. I read from another guy here that he uses his chorus for the same thing so I might try it. Blue

[quote name='FinnDave' timestamp='1415298616' post='2599004'] He wasn't even a good guitarist, I used to tell him I resented giving him the same share as the other guitarist. It's a much happier band without him. [/quote] Cool, I have heard the Wire Birds. You guys have a good thing going. The concept and the genre are right up my alley. You guys looking for a new bass player? Blue

[quote name='seashell' timestamp='1415276885' post='2598652'] I know it's shallow, but I think if I look right I play better. Like a kid with new ballet shoes really. I've never grown out of that need to 'dress up'. [/quote] Same story here. For me cool/trendy relevant threads is part of the fun of performing. I've invested a lot of $$$s in gear and gigging threads. It get's back to whatever your own personal philosophy is. At the bar level, for me it's [i]"never look like the patrons , look like your in a rock band"[/i]. For some guys it doesn't matter. At some of the higher levels of gigging things change and it doesn't matter as much. Does anyone care what Eric Clapton wears to a gig, probably not. However, if I go see the Stones, I want to see some cool threads. Blue

[quote name='FinnDave' timestamp='1415201170' post='2597816'] We used to have a guitarist who like to tell us the money didn't matter because he was rich. He still expected his share, so I threw him out. [/quote] Good call, it's that specific kind of guy I take issue with. I wonder what he would have said if after a gig you paid everyone in the band except him. lol Blue

Why Am I losing volume when I combine Overdrive and Chorus? Any ideas? Thanks Blue