blue

Interesting stuff. You know, I can think of 2-3 times when I walked away from a gig with $600.00 in my wallet for playing a little over an hour. That's really where I would like to be all the time. Blue

[quote name='peteb' timestamp='1476739840' post='3156915'] I don't think there is anything wrong with asking people here for advice. A lot of the same factors apply and although the music scene in Milwaukee may be a bit different to the UK, but I know guys who play the Texas circuit and that's completely different again! Giving up a solid working band to play in a different arena to the bar circuit is a bit step, especially if you rely on the money you earn from that band. I can understand Blue wanting to run it past his peers to see what they think, even if they are from another country...! [/quote] I rely on you folks in the UK for anything that has to do with rock or rock & roll issues. My first experiences with rock & roll was not with or from American artists. Blue

[quote name='martthebass' timestamp='1476736277' post='3156875'] That's my point Blue, you're ignoring comments from members you believe are in a different place to you. If you only recognise/take notice of comments that agree with your own then the request for comments is pointless. [/quote] I must be missing something, I was hoping to hear more comments about how other members value their playing. I don't know how it turned into the Blue Story. That was not my intention. Blue

MIJ Fenders gave always been awesome. Blue

[quote name='RockfordStone' timestamp='1476735370' post='3156859'] you have the situation where you are business minded and fairly free. you are questioning the need to play 4 hour shows and lugging gear, something which until today you have been totally happy to do so if your other posts have been anything to go by. imo, you've made your mind up and you should be out there looking for a touring band not sitting here trying to justify it to yourself or us [/quote] Point well taken and one of the few I can't argue. Blue

[quote name='martthebass' timestamp='1476734242' post='3156840'] Blue, I think your mind is made up, but you're still requesting comments/thoughts? If you are dissatisfied with your current gig and truly believe you're worth more then go with it. [/quote] I love the band I'm with, but my situation , musical wants and needs are different than the other members. If I find something great if not I'm stuck in the 4 hour $125.00 a man world. Blue

[quote name='peteb' timestamp='1476734329' post='3156845'] That puts you in a good position if the right opportunity presents itself. Obviously you would need to put together a pickup band that is happy to play when you're available, possibly because they are in a similar position or have got other things going on. Teaching is always a good sideline, as is teching for other bands if you really like being on the road. [/quote] Pete, I feel I have to do something or quit complaining. It's really frustrating or like some of you guys say, "frustra-in" 😁 Blue

We opened for Morland & Arbuckle Saturday night.while I wouldn't call them huge, they are a signed act and no longer have to play 4 hour shows. They're playing that festival in Skeggnes near Lincolnshire in January. What they're doing is really appealing to me.The bass/guitarists player was explaining to me hard hard it is and that you have to be business person to do it. He was very humble and doesn't take for granted he makes a living from music. Blue

[quote name='leschirons' timestamp='1476734022' post='3156837'] I can't actually think of any gigs I've been to where a covers band was opening for a big name act. I suppose you'd maybe have more chance of achieving your goal if you were playing original music but then we all know how easy that is to get work if you're not signed You're in a band that works regularly and there's no guarantee that another band who has some good gigs lined up are always going to have them whereas with your current band, you never seem to be out of work. I'm not saying you shouldn't go for it Blue but the first thing you need to do is decide whether you think your current band is undervalued or whether you think your personal ability as a musician warrants more money. If it's the former, and it all works well personality wise in your bar band, wouldn't it be better to see if you all can find better paid work with the people you're comfortable with? If it's the latter, then keep your eye out for an opportunity and grab it if it comes around. [/quote] While we have 2 released cds of originals which we perform, I'd still say it's the latter. Everyone else in the band is married with way more life responsibilities than me. Blue

[quote name='peteb' timestamp='1476733717' post='3156834'] I think what he is trying to say is that these bands don't work anything like 52 weeks a year and you still need to pay the rent in the down periods. Everyone I know that does that kind of gig has a sideline they can fall back on when they're not on the road. [/quote] I get what your saying Pete. I'm wondering if my life circumstance is unusual. Not many bills and nothing tieing me down? Guess it depends on your personal situation. My Milwaukee condo is not mortgaged. I own it free and clear. My point, my expenses are very low. Ideally I would do bar gigs during down times. Blue

[quote name='itsmedunc' timestamp='1476733098' post='3156816'] Would not ever play for 4 hours! My arms would drop off! Done well paid gigs and poorly paid gigs. Comes with the job I suppose. Would be nice to be paid what I think I'm worth all the time but that's not going to happen in my situation... [/quote] In the States if your a bar band it's 4 hours, take it or leave it. New Year's Eve, we play a 3-7, pack up and go directly to a 9-1. Blue

[quote name='Burns-bass' timestamp='1476691827' post='3156234'] I'm talking about post-gig, not during. Also, we were an originals band playing no more than an hour to an hour and a half per night, it's different because music wasn't treated as a commodity in the same way as it is when you're in a covers band. Playing your own music to a large group of people (sometimes big gigs, often just a few hundred) is a huge adrenaline rush. If I were out doing Mustang Sally on the wedding circuit week in and out (which I know a few people do, they love it and they earn a decent amount - so please don't think I'm. Ring negative of judgemental) perhaps I'd feel differently, but I don't. [/quote] You must not read my threads were a blues rock band with 2 CDs of originals released. We play to crowds from 50 people to 1,500. We're not a "Mustang Sally" cover band. We're a local bar band. Quite different than a cover band. Blue

[quote name='Dad3353' timestamp='1476690317' post='3156215'] Lots of expressions come to mind, such as 'The grass is always greener...' and 'A bird in the hand...'. Although there's always 'Don't hide your light under a bushel' too, I suppose. Why this sudden evangelistic ambition, though..? Has there been a shock to the system, or just a late spell of jealousy..? [/quote] No, we have been opening for a few national headliners and I have chatted with these guys. For me what they are doing is all pro and a lot better than breaking your back doing 4 hour bar shows. Until I find something better I'm stuck. But yes a big change in my philosophy, here it is; IMO I'm worth more than $125.00 a gig. Blue

[quote name='Lozz196' timestamp='1476647171' post='3155988'] For me it`s the audience/industry that determine this (originals bands here I`m talking about). If your audiences keep growing then you should move higher up the bill, which should generate more income, and hopefully more sales of your merch, if you`ve decided to go down that route. At some point you may then be able to get backing from the industry in some form or another. [/quote] Maybe, personally I think it's all about business connections and being in the right place at the right time. Blue

[quote name='Damonjames' timestamp='1476690298' post='3156214'] I know a musician who isaid in 2 bands that gig at large festivals (are signed and have albums released) and has to juggle his diary between these two, a VERY busy function band, does a jam night once a month and picks up dep work when he can. He also teaches lessons The function band comes closest to covering his day to day running costs, my point is, if you are a working group musician you need to take what's on offer regardless of whether you tHinksey it's below your worth as you don't know where the next gig will come.from [/quote] Well, right now my band offers consistent bar, festival and fair gigs.I know where my next gig is well into 2017. It's still below my worth IMO. I have to do it until I find something better. I'm still not sure what your point is and a US functions band is not the sort of thing I'm looking for. I'm talking about bands that are on the road gigging 5 -6 nights a week with international travel. Blue

[quote name='Burns-bass' timestamp='1476731334' post='3156794'] I never saw the fuss until I took up DB. Then when I picked up a pre CBS Precision I was hooked. So much so I bought it (I still haven't told my wife how much it cost). It plays better than my 66 and 73 jazzes and sounds better too. [/quote] I had a 1957 pre CBS P, an ex girlfriend friend stole and sold it back in the mid 70s. Blue

[quote name='Burns-bass' timestamp='1476656868' post='3156135'] I used to love it. Problem is, I 'enjoyed' a drink too, perhaps a little too much. Mix big-gig adrenaline with the reality that when you leave you're just another normal person out there and it's easier to sit talking rubbish to people until the bar closes. [/quote] Drinking or any substance would take the fun out if it for me. I like being in control, if your buzzed up your no longer in control. Easy for me, I haven't had a drink in over 40 years, same with any kind of substance. Again, for me it's a business. Blue

[quote name='TimR' timestamp='1476654413' post='3156107'] Travelling is hard. It's a young mans game. Living out of a suitcase in a different 'clone' hotel every night. The worst thing is waking up in the morning and having no one around you but the people you work with to socialise with. It's not for everyone. [/quote] Sounds like paradise to me. Blue

[quote name='peteb' timestamp='1476653427' post='3156094'] The thing is how many of the better paying bigger gigs will you play in a year and how will that stack up against your constant schedule of bar gigs that provide a regular income?? [/quote] Hi Pete, Bar gigs is a $125.00 for 4 hours proposition. It's all I have now. My point is I feel I'm devalued at that level and when the right opportunity presents itself I want out and want to move on. I know a few people that are headlining and I'm sure I would be way a head financially even with half the gigs I do now. Blue

[quote name='mikel' timestamp='1476644782' post='3155959'] Sadly its never up to us if we "Move up" or not. If the people in the industry believe we are good enough then it will happen, and not always to those that deserve it. Gladly it has never been a business for me. From 1967 when I first started playing it was about making music and writing songs. If we had been successful as a band that would have meant being signed to a record label and doing gigs in the big venues. Making music was what it was all about, making money was never on the agenda. If we had made money then that would have been a huge bonus. Now? I play cos I love it, we get paid for pub and club gigs and that is perfect. I am glad it has never become a business or just work for me, that would have taken the magic out of a lifetimes love. [/quote] Gladly it's always been a business for me. It's the work and the love of music, making music,performing for an audience that makes it for me. Many BCers are under the misconception that those of us that treat this as a business do not like music and that it's all work and we don't have fun. There is nothing more fun than playing music even when it's a business. Blue

[quote name='Len_derby' timestamp='1476644565' post='3155954'] Good question Blue, direct and to the point. Would you get enough of the bigger paying gigs to make up for dropping the 'meat and potatoes' bar jobs? Also, I'm guessing here, the bigger gigs would involve more travel and time away from home. There will be costs involved with that, financial and time related. All depends on your personal situation. [/quote] My home would be the road, something I've always wanted. I'm single and my kids are working adults, I could get up and leave tonight if the right opportunity presented itself. Blue

I'm starting to think a little differently about the 4 hour bar gig, festival and fair market. Last night we opened for a national act. All I needed was my bass, and pedal board. Lighting and sound provided. We played for an hour and we're paid twice our 4 hour bar fee. Ok, whether you like it or not this is a business, at least it is for me. I think I'm devaluing myself in the bar band market and should start making plans to move up a bit. It's a hard business and I'm still up for the challenge. Comments, thoughts? Blue

[quote name='NickRiffed' timestamp='1476453039' post='3154469'] It's just a case of putting yourself out there and being a bit flexible. [/quote] For me this is a business. I can be flexible but not when it comes to compensation. Blue

[quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1476452185' post='3154456'] I'm always slightly suspicious of musicians who say they can't find a suitable band or other musicians for them to play with. Unless you live out in the middle of nowhere it should be fairly straight forward? Certainly from my perspective, as a bassist of below average ability, who has very strict rules about what types of music I want to play and who lives in a place that while being a decent size has never really had a serious music scene of the likes of Manchester, Liverpool, Sheffield, Birmingham, Glasgow, Edinburgh etc. I have never had a problem finding bands or other musicians who want to play music that I like to standard worth bothering with and then get out and gig. [/quote] Some of it depends how known or how connected you are. Milwaukee is a decent size and really has a good music scene. However if your only resource is the classified ads or Milwaukee Rocks, you'd be hard pressed to find anything more than new starts ups or skaky originals bands. Blue

[quote name='Conan' timestamp='1476429240' post='3154136'] Depends on how you view "ability"on bass as well. In most music genres (certainly the ones I have ever played) it's not about how many notes or how fast you play. To me, one of the most important measures of a bass player's ability is how well they keep time and lay down solid foundations for the more "glamorous" members of the band. If a song is dull, or has an undemanding bassline - I always try my best to play it as solid as possible. Usually a song is in the set for a reason, and as long as the audience enjoy it (and it broadly fits the style of the band) then it has a value. You might even grow to enjoy it if it goes down well! A good example of this is in one of my old pub R'n'B bands we used to plat Woolly Bully... always went down an absolute storm Back OT - I feel that gigging is PART of being in a band. Not the only part though. Generally, I tend to enjoy a good rehearsal more than a mediocre gig. The feeling of the band coming together and sounding good (even in our own opinions!) is great. A gig with poor sound in an empty room is just a waste of everybody's time IMO. And we do quite a few of them at the moment - the bane of the relatively new original band [/quote] Agreed, if your dealing with a song you don't necessarily connect with, change the bass line to something that's fun for you to play. Always works for me. Blue