skankdelvar

While it is natural for us as producers of music to delve into issues of composition, recording and performance we might also consider the issue of covers as perceived by the audience (whether in a live or a recorded context). The whole point of cover bands is to supply their consumers with musical 'familiarity'. It therefore follows that an audience's recognition of a song stems from an earlier exposure to that which they [i]perceive[/i] as the original performance. Example: 99% of casual listeners would say that 'Hanging On The Telephone' is a Blondie song. When we play it, they will almost certainly superimpose a recollection of the pulchritudinous Ms Debbie Harry. Were one's front-man correctly to introduce Hanging On The Telephone as 'A song by The Nerves' some beetle-browed inebriate would doubtless later accost him to 'put him right', possibly involving a punch up the bracket. The vast majority of audiences (or 'civilians' as we might dub them) will unhesitatingly (if sometimes erroneously) confer original performance status on that specific version of a song which is the first to achieve mass popular dissemination and through which outcome the song will arrived at the audience's ears. Perhaps they've got it right. They're the customers.

Anyway, why is a cover song called a 'cover'? When one covers* something one is physically placing something over something else e.g: 'Cover that jam sandwich (up) or the wasps'll be at it' or 'The sofa's looking a bit shonky. Let's get some loose covers.' We should call cover bands something else. Copy combos? [size=2]* In the non-procreative sense[/size]

I once stood behind Billy Bremner in a bank in Acton. He was paying in a cheque for £27.50 from Demon Records. It may have been a royalty cheque but I didn't like to ask. That would have been impertinent.

[quote name='LewisK1975' timestamp='1469452915' post='3098378']I was only trying to contribute to what I think is an interesting thread... [/quote] ... and you are - see below [quote name='LewisK1975' timestamp='1469445037' post='3098288'] But then, what about a band who perform 30 songs and 15 of them are covers, and 15 are originals? What do we call them? Quite easy really, they're a band! [/quote] When I first started out all bands were called bands. No one (afaik) below the rank of Harvey Goldsmith articulated a distinction between bands that played originals, bands that played covers and bands that played a mix of both. As I recall, the key delineation was whether a band was amateur, semi-pro or pro. Amateur bands tended to comprise wild-eyed youth unleashing a tinny mix of covers and originals in the vain hope of getting their cherry popped. Semi-pros were glum, middle-aged alcoholics playing 'Tie A Yellow Ribbon' to chicken-in-a-basket punters. Pro bands drove round in Rolls Royces and smoked industrial quantities of privet. It's all different now. [i]O tempora, O mores.[/i] [color=#faebd7][i].[/i][/color]

Covers bands often play crowd pleasers. It's just that they don't necessarily please the crowd they're playing to.

[quote name='TimR' timestamp='1469315585' post='3097408'] Chirac [/quote] [size=3][b]Chirac[/b]: Verre bouteille, bouteille verre.[/size] [color=#ffffe0][size=3].[/size][/color]

[quote name='hiram.k.hackenbacker' timestamp='1469315151' post='3097406'] I'm not sure the Mods have [b]that[/b] much time Skank! [/quote] My sesquipedialian tendencies are temporarily in abeyance. Brevity is my lodestone. [i]Ends.[/i]

[quote name='Kev' timestamp='1469312762' post='3097387'] Why? To prevent unnecessary clutter in the Forum. The same member wishes to post two threads that could very easily and sensibly be condensed into one. Please pm me directly if you have any other comments regarding moderator guidance [/quote] PM'd

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1469199331' post='3096597'] I actually posed this question to set up and gather data for a future thread. [/quote] [size=3][b]Criminal genius[/b]: Ernst Stavro Bluefeld[/size] [color=#f0fff0][size=3].[/size][/color]

[quote name='Bilbo' timestamp='1469210713' post='3096746'] Jazz [/quote] Serious question: When using the term 'a standard' in a jazz context, is that basically the same thing as 'a cover' in other genres?

[quote name='SpondonBassed' timestamp='1469206019' post='3096690'] Wake me when they're passing the After Eights 'round please? [/quote] The After Eights. Great name for a cover band. They could all wear brown and white uniforms and start every song with '5-6-7-8' Apart from Mr Wilson Pickett's 634-5789. That would be confusing.

There are originals bands who have shed all (or all but one) of their founding members along the way. There are also bands which explicitly or otherwise lay claim to being the original band yet there is more than one working band with original members playing the original material, e.g. Saxon (as fronted by Mr Biff Byford) and Dawson / Oliver Saxon. Or the [i]two[/i] Wishbone Ashes. Who is covering (or tributing) whom? Then there is Dr Feelgood who comprise [i]none[/i] of the original members but are - instead - a sort of Trigger's broom. They perform covers of original songs written by other people (dead and living) who [i]were[/i] in the band and covers of songs popularised by the band in its previous incarnations but written by people who were [i]not [/i]in the band and are mostly dead. The current Dr Feelgood therefore not only play covers of the original Dr Feelgood's originals but also play covers of cover songs popularised by the - er - original Dr Feelgood. Are Dr Feelgood a tribute act to [i]themselves[/i] when they're playing 'Back In The Night' but a covers band when they're playing 'Riot in Cell Block #9'? What might happen were Dr Feelgood to cover the song 'Dr Feelgood' in the style of blues pianist Mr Willie Lee 'Dr Feelgood' Perryman (1911-1985) does not bear contemplation. It's probably like 'crossing the streams'. Total protonic reversal might ensue. [size=3]NB: Mr Perryman originally went out as 'Piano Red', changing his performing name to Dr Feelgood in later life, thus opening the possibility that the band Dr Feelgood could cover the other Dr Feelgood's original song but which was written by him when he was Piano Red and also performed by him when he became the 'other' Dr Feelgood except that Mr Perryman was the [i]first [/i]Dr Feelgood which means the band originally known as Dr Feelgood should be designated the 'other' Dr Feelgood, therefore making the current Dr Feelgood the 'other other' Dr Feelgood. You're welcome.[/size] [color=#ffffe0].[/color]

[quote name='Coilte' timestamp='1469188268' post='3096439'] I'm inclined to agree with this. Why the need to define a cover band in the first place is beyond me. [/quote] Because - like many [i]apparently[/i] anodyne topics here on BC it's a starting point for an exploratory discussion. For example, one could trundle off down the classical route; or delve into the role of 'familiar' traditional music as a vehicle for community cohesion in agrarian society and the part played by village bands of amateur musicians who performed at festivals, weddings and in the church; or prod idly at the 1930's semi-professional British dance bands which copied their American influences and among whose number toiled the late Mr Spike Milligna. One might ask why musical familiarity is allegedly more important to older consumers and conclude that the music one encounters in one's formative years becomes part of one's identity to the extent that hearing such songs in later life may (or may not) trigger pleasure endorphins; thus providing a platform of income - however attenuated - for many musicians of our ilk. We might even explore the tipping point for a song where it hovers between 'Not again!' and 'Wow, I haven't heard that for ages!' If one is prepared to exploit the possibilities inherent in the initial contention there is no saying [i]where[/i] we might end up.

[quote name='4stringslow' timestamp='1469045715' post='3095408'] Thus original or non-original - surely that's a non-contentious starting point? [/quote] Some originals bands are alarmingly unoriginal. As is traditional round here let us instead of '[i]originals[/i]' substitute the phrase '[i]self-penned material[/i]'.

Or was that Inti? ([i]Thinks[/i]) No, Inti went into the car crusher.

[quote name='rogerstodge' timestamp='1469043929' post='3095380'] whatever happened to him, is he still on here? [/quote] Not in any meaningful sense, no. The mods took him for a walk in the woods and shot him, IIRC.

A covers band is a musical ensemble that plays popular tunes written by other people. After that it all gets a bit complicated; a world-class symphony orchestra playing Mozart [i]might[/i] by this narrow definition be considered a covers band. So might three blokes with ukeleles playing 1920's dance-band songs very badly. Like I said: complicated. [color=#ffffff].[/color]

[quote name='Number6' timestamp='1468919998' post='3094255'] The band starts off being the Jam then rapidly turns into the Style Council. [/quote] Funny you should mention the Jam. I was approached by this guy to join his Jam tribute. 'The bass player's leaving. Come down and see us at (x)'. So I did. After the gig this guy introduced me to the band. After some idle chat I asked the bass player why he was leaving. 'Who says I'm leaving the band? What the f**k's going on here?' he said in a sort of choked voice. It was clear that a nasty internecine row was about to ensue so I made my excuses and left.

For me, the gigging and the associated hanging around in boozers talking complete bollocks are the best bits of all. Oh - and that golden moment when the landlord peels off some readies and tucks them in one's hot, sweaty mitt. The worst bits are the tedious, micro-managed rehearsals, the agonising over band names, the dicking around with running orders and the inevitable hat tantrums. That's what gives me the yips.

So much going on here, where to begin? Do they know you're unhappy? And why you're unhappy? You say that you've not turned up for jams / gigs for a while so might they think you've left the band? First step is to have a sit down with them and explain what's bothering you. It may be fixable. It seems that the disorganisation and lack of communication is getting to you. Try inserting yourself higher up the comms chain. Maybe liaise with the Mum that's booking the gigs. That way, you and she know what's going on. You say that '[i]l[/i][color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif][i]ocals on the music scene don’t like us in some way or another[/i]' and that [/font][/color][color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]'[i]There is a feeling of awkwardness when interacting with the people in charge of the show[/i]'. The former is beyond the forum's scope to address. As for the latter well, IME, some promoters / landlords are a bit weird and lack interpersonal skills when dealing with bands. If you think that this awkwardness is solely down to the band's poor comms and possibly perceived lack of 'professionalism' then that's something that's beyond your ability to address, given you're not the one handling the bookings. [/font][/color] [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Just because you've got scads of gear laying around the house doesn't signify anything. We've most of us got a pile of stuff disproportionate to our gigging needs. Ignore this aspect.[/font][/color] [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Taking lessons won't solve your immediate band problem but are a good idea anyway. That said, lessons aren't a substitute for the fun of playing out and y[/font][/color][color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]our technical abilities don't seem to be a problem for the talented guys you're currently working with.[/font][/color] [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]And maybe you [i]have[/i] got a lot going on in your life. New home, demanding job, etc. It would be reasonable to review your commitments and dump anything that's adding to the pressure rather than relieving it. No shame in that.[/font][/color] [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Frankly, I think you need to:[/font][/color] [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]i) Confirm with them whether you're still in the band. You may already have been replaced in which case we've all wasted ten minutes of our lives we'll never have again.[/font][/color] [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]ii) If you're still in, talk things through with the other guys. [/font][/color][color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Try to persuade them to be more organised about gig bookings; liaise with the Mum. If you can, remove the pressures that are the cause of your stage-fright. [/font][/color] [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]iii) If you remain unsatisfied with arrangements just join another band and overlap the two. Then pull out of the first band if you feel like it. iv) Don't beat yourself up about this. It's not your fault. The combined stresses of home, job and a disorganised band is enough to give anyone the wobbly hump. v) It's not - as you say - the end. Don't sell all your gear. But if you do, I'll take it off your hands for £50, OK?[/font][/color]

Some years ago, cab stacking was the topic that most energised the forum. Proponents of competing philosophies engaged in tit-for-tat violence; drive-by shootings were not uncommon. The ensuing carnage claimed many victims. Those of us who survived those times learnt very quickly to duck behind a solid object whenever we heard the words 'driver size incompatibility' 'vertical stacking' or 'comb filtering'. It is all far too painful to recollect. [color=#f0fff0].[/color]

In an excess of enthusiasm I once stage-dove at an awards dinner at the Grosvenor House hotel. Took out a whole 12-setting table and damaged my knee so badly as to need a stick for three months. Sigh

[quote name='Maude' timestamp='1468070931' post='3088421']. Sometimes it seems silly but I learnt it all on Basschat so it must be the way to go. [/quote] Words to live by.

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Spit. As recommended by repair guru [url="http://www.guitarplayer.com/miscellaneous/1139/dan-erlewine39s-mod-squad/19896"]Dan Erlewine[/url].