mikel

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1499939954' post='3334634'] Another good topic for another thread. Blue [/quote] Its not for another thread. Punters DO notice the difference, thats why I always want my band "On". A Pub band can and should be just as professional in attitude to practice and rehearsal as a pro band. That was my point, punters do notice if a band is having a great time rather than simply playing the right notes in the right places. Its about a professional performance/show, rather than just being a good musician.

I have never felt that way. I know when the band I am in is "On" or not, and that is what gives me satisfaction playing music for others. And that has nothing to do with bum notes or missed cue's, thats another ball game that should be sorted at rehearsals. Giving your best at every gig should be a given, or why are you bothering to practice and rehearse? I have been to many big gigs in the last few years where I have left with a sense of mild disappointment. Yes the musicianship, sound and production have been very professional and slick, but there were vital ingredients missing....excitement and passion. I would rather see a semi pro band in a pub giving it large, and looking like they mean it, than a big name act being very polished and professional, but clinical and lacking passion. Its rock and roll, its supposed to move me, excite me, surprise me.

[quote name='PaulWarning' timestamp='1499853733' post='3334034'] Playing devils advocate, if all the small time tax dodgers were added up it would probably be far bigger tax loss than what the likes of Starbucks and Amazon cost the exchequer, you're talking billions of pounds, that's why the Government hates cash, but it'll be a long time before people start paying the window cleaner in anything other than cash. Slightly different point, some pubs want to pay in cash because it costs them to bank money (not as much as paying by card costs them though), they like to get rid of it, hence cashback [/quote] My point was aimed more at the fact the loopholes that the lawyers can exploit have been left in place, mostly, so they are or were there to exploit. And they were left in place by, mostly, well off MPs so there well off mates can save on taxes and be even richer. So they know the big companies are doing it but largely chose to ignore it because its the old boys network. Not the same as Joe Bloggs earning £20 cash on a weekend, how would you police that? I believe the measures are being brought in to stop companies exploiting workers and avoiding paying NI etc. Hence the term proper jobs, with real prospects, rather than zero hours or cash in hand. Difficult getting a mortgage or a rental agreement if you are paid cash in hand as your only income source.

I can't really see a problem for the run of the mill semi pro musician, as has been pointed out we probably lose out financially when equipment and travel are factored in. I believe this is aimed more at companies using the current legislation to avoid employee rights, such as a decent contract with NI payments, holiday pay, sick pay, guaranteed hours for those who want it. etc. It would make a nice change if the tax loopholes were closed to stop the companies and people who can more than afford to pay there tax bill, rather than chasing a part time window cleaner or a semi pro musician who is probably losing money when all expenses are taken into account. It simply makes it look like the administration are doing something if they chase the little guy. What is being suggested looks like a step in the right direction to me.

[quote name='LITTLEWING' timestamp='1499711394' post='3333091'] I've always said that people who have to read music to play have no musical soul. A bass guy, keyboard or guitard who've learnt 300 or more toons in their lifetime and can rattle them off with the odd little inaudible mistake, then play an improv solo from somewhere inside their heart - THAT'S a musician. I've seen guys on cruise ships backing mini stars that have to read to play and actually sound great and spot on, but I often wonder if they could really hold their own in a jam situation. [/quote] It could simply be that they have spent the required 10000 hours + going through the hoops and formal learning process that ties them to a structure that they are now perfectly comfortable with. To step outside that ingrained structure might take a change of mindset and practice format.

They dont need to improvise, just ask them to learn the parts they have to play. If they are that great surely its not a big leap to remember a few pieces of music by rote. For me nothing looks more meh than a semi pro band having music stands on stage, and if the singer has to read lyrics from a sheet it just looks so un prepared. If Rick Wakeman could/can play the entire Yes set without resorting to sheet music I feel sure these guys can memorise a few songs.

"Where did it all go wrong?" I don't think it did, I feel he has found his natural level. He was lucky enough to be in a band with his talented brother, had they not been siblings we would never have heard of him.

[quote name='rubis' timestamp='1499548514' post='3332177'] Dancing in the moonlight [/quote] Good call, forgot about the superb Lizzy guitar parts.

Loved Pablo Honey and OK Computer, but they are never a Glastonbury headline act. The material would bore the pants off me at a festival. Its late night shoe gazing music, and I love a bit of that....but late at night, and in the privacy of my own living room.

Guitar solo? Gilmour on "Another Brick in the Wall." Sax? The solo on "Will You" by Wesley Magoogan. Can still bring a tear to my eye.

Nah. Like Clapton I started playing Blues in the 60s. Moved on to Rock and post Punk originals. Prog and Folk Rock. Now I love to play Funk as its a dream for a bassist or drummer, and I do both. I have dabbled with Fusion but have no real interest in playing Jazz. I have many Jazz albums and listen when in the mood, see what I did there?, but have no interest in playing it. If the suggestion is that Jazz started before Blues, therefore its the roots of what we play now, I believe Blues pre dates Jazz. Or is it the old chestnut that If you play Jazz you are a "Serious" musician? For me music is music, there are songs I like and songs I don't, genre has nowt to do with it. I am a "Serious" musician in that although a semi pro I take my music and playing seriously. As genres go Jazz is no more or less laudable than any other.

I practice on a cheap Yamaha e-kit, without it my only drumming time would be at band practice, once a week. Get a cheap one and if any noise is a big issue go for mesh heads where possible. I play mine every night through headphones and it has no impact on the missus in our small house. One of the big plusses with an e-kit is the facility to play your music of choice through the unit and play along with the songs, through headphones. Having an e-kit brought my drumming along in leaps and bounds as its useable almost anytime, an acoustic kit is not if you live in an ordinary house with others close by. The transition from e-kit to acoustic is easy if you place the pads in the same positions you place your drums and cymbals on the real kit.

[quote name='casapete' timestamp='1499179046' post='3329739'] I never quite understand people being called a 'rhythm' guitarist - surely they are just a 'guitarist'? And Nile Rodgers is simply a superb guitarist, full stop. Keith Richards nailed it when he once said that you don't go into a music store and ask to try a rhythm guitar. [/quote] Well, yes and no. I don't recall him riffing out or playing a solo at Glastonbury, he was playing rhythm in the truest sense of the word, and driving the band. He is a great guitarist, no doubt, but for me the best part of his guitar playing is his rhythm playing. That's what I was getting at.

[quote name='EliasMooseblaster' timestamp='1499178051' post='3329725'] Oh I don't know, you should see the faces on some of the guitarists at my local jam when a singer asks for a song in Eb or F! [/quote] Aye, guitarists just love Eb. I can understand why as its the most difficult to transpose on guitar. If the vocalist asks for a key change before we all start working the song up it helps, leaving it till the first band rehearsal when we have all learned it off the recording, at home, will not make them any friends.

My only question is....why were Chic not headlining? I love playing Funk/disco live but never been a fan of listening to it at home as entertainment, but that was sheer class. Great musicians clearly enjoying every second, and nailing it. Yea the bass solo was OTT but Nile is the boss and he wanted it, and for the punters it seemed to hit the spot. And Mr Rodgers? what a fantastic rhythm player, a one man groove factory.

[quote name='Monkey Steve' timestamp='1497956909' post='3321573'] Exactly, it makes no sense to me either, but I've been in two different bands with drummers who insist that the bass drum needs to be mic'd at all times (and to be clear, it's been in the studio and at pub gigs where we'd do our own sound, situations where he could have a say, not where an engineer is sorting it out). Not all drummers, but it was definitely a "thing" with the pair of them. And like you, I can't understand it...just thought I'd ask [/quote] I play drums in another band and If I play the BD hard, at a pub gig, the glasses shake on the bar. And thats with a 20" un miced full front head. There is no need to mic a kit at all for small gigs. For rehearsals I always drape my coat over the front head to keep the volume down. Drums can be loud, bloody loud If you play them hard, but If you have control you can play them very softly.

We tend to set the PA vocal volumes at a very comfortable level and the instruments have to sit under that level so the vocals can be heard easily. If you need volume to sound decent then there are more fundamental things wrong.

Started off listening to "The Rag Pickers Dream" album, Mark Knopfler. Have not listened to his solo stuff for a while. How can one guy be so talented? Great songs, great guitarist, and the lyrics.......the guy tells some wonderful and heartfelt stories, even more so If you are a Geordie. Made me dig out all my solo Knopfler stuff, so thats my listening sorted for a couple of days.

You are looking forward to auditioning vocalists? Really?

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1497632208' post='3319698'] Am I the only one on BC that plays for a living? I don't think there is such a thing as "a perfect band" under any circumstances. Blue [/quote] I said most on here are not pro musicians, not all. As I said, there is no such thing as the perfect band, well......the one I am in at the moment is, for me. They are good musicians who are sympathetic to the music.No ego's. We all love the songs we do and we all get along as friends outside the band, so its a win win.

If its not for you then its end of story, we all know you play for a living so its different to a lot of bassists on here. For me the only way to get the perfect band is to start your own and make all the decisions, all the time. I would hate that. Being in any band is, for me, about everyone making compromises. We all have slightly different ideas about music, and gigs per month, even If we love the same genre so being able to compromise a little makes for the perfect band. That, and everyone bringing a little of themselves to the party, thats what makes the magic. A pro touring band with hired hands will be a completely different thing and a different set of requirements.

If the songs are all recorded it helps me if I play an album over and over before I even start to work out the parts. I like to get the music ingrained in my head by listening at every opportunity. In the car, on headphones etc. That way I am only starting from scratch with the bass parts, not the song structure or arrangement.

I can play all my bass parts in isolation, that way no matter how much the band messes up I know where I am. I also learn the vocals for all the songs and can sing them, not good enough for lead vocal but It is also a pointer to where I am in the song. I can play a few songs on guitar, Man of the World by Fleetwood Mac, My old friend the Blues, by Steve Earl. Living in the Past, by Tull, was the first song I learned on Bass and it seems to be melodic enough to please most people if the ask me to play something on the instrument.

[quote name='lowhand_mike' timestamp='1497370472' post='3317630'] we dont rehearse particularly loud but loud enough to be with the drummer, tbh the comments on playing quiter are only valid if your drummer can then play significantly quieter for those passages that require it and ive yet to meet one that can really tone it back and hold the feel. so yeah we play fairly loud but then also our rehr=earsal room is a large hall so volume is required, when i joined the band they had a 90w combo which was no way near enough, now i have plenty and use a third of it stays nice and clean. play to what ever volume suits the band theres no right or wrong, if it works it works [/quote] I also drum in a funk band and we rehearse at very low volume. I dont find it a problem and it brought on my drumming technique a lot. I dont have any problem grooving at low volume, and at gig volume I can nail the dynamics as I am now used to playing quietly. Its just another skill thats worth having.

Not great, but she never had a strong voice. Great song though and a true legend. I remember her with Chicken Shack.