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Everything posted by Bill Fitzmaurice
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It depends on the two 1x12s and the two 1x10s. Like I said, nothing is ever equal. There are some tens that have as much, or even more, displacement as some twelves. The trick lies in finding out the displacement of the drivers you have and of those that you're contemplating. It's of far more consequence than watts, but manufacturers are loath to reveal it.
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A twelve has 1.6 times the cone displacement as a ten. That translates to a difference in maximum SPL of about 5dB. Twice the displacement gives an increase in maximum SPL of 6dB, so a pair of tens could be slightly louder in maximum output than one twelve. But that's all else being equal, which it never is. Twice the volume is 10dB.
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You need to find out what impedance your speaker is. If it's 4 ohms you can't add another to it. If it's 8 ohms you may.
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The amp is 4 ohm rated? Or the speaker is 4 ohms?
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Bad decision. Once again, it's not about watts. You've got a perfectly good amp, you just need a second speaker to get out of it what it can give. A second identical speaker will give you 6dB higher sensitivity. The result is the same as increasing power by a factor of four. It's not at all complicated, you just need to learn how gear works. Remember, you're the bass player. That makes you the smart one in the band. 😉
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What's the sensitivity of the 610? What's the sensitivity of a pair of the Mesa 112? What's the displacement limited power handling of both? There is an answer to your question, but it needs hard data to calculate, which probably isn't available. I would imagine that a pair of the Mesa would handle 300w, and stacked vertically they wouldn't necessarily be too low, though I'd probably tilt the upper cab up to better hear the mids.
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Unless you go to a horn loaded woofer, probably none. Getting more output isn't so much about watts as it is about speaker sensitivity. To get significantly more sensitivity you need to use two cabs, preferably identical. I can't say if you can get a matching cab for your existing cab.
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Cars get a major bass response boost from Cabin Gain, also known as Pressure Vessel gain. So do headphones. It's the reason why they give good bass when tight to the ears but it disappears when they're pulled away.
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A bit OT, but since you brought it up... It's not unusual for the low end of any sub or low frequency speaker to be hard to hear when standing close to it. Reflections off nearby walls and the ceiling create low frequency null zones. If you're standing in one of those null zones the bass will disappear. When you move away from the null zone the true output of the cab will be heard. This effect gave rise to the myth of wave propagation, that it takes a minimum distance from a source for the bass wave to be heard. But if that was true headphones wouldn't work, nor would car subwoofers.
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I've dealt with literally hundreds of soundmen who have no idea what electric bass is supposed to sound like, and these weren't pub gig friends of the band, they were mixing for top tier international touring acts. IME the bad outnumber the really good FOH engineers by at least 4:1. Most of the better soundmen I've worked with are also recording engineers or bass players themselves. Many of them are both.
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FRFR is what you want from a speaker if you use a modeling processor or amp to emulate the response of a variety of different speakers. The main benefit to that is if you're in the PA, which is ostensibly FRFR, and you feed it with the same signal. That way what's in the PA is the same as what's in your stage speaker...until a clueless sound man changes everything on your console channel to sound like what he likes instead of what you like.
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It could, as thermal power is limited mainly by the gauge of the coil. However, as you pointed out, to realize 126dB at 62Hz would require an xmax in the vicinity of 25mm with at least 96dB sensitvity. There's no such thing as a driver with 25mm xmax that has 96dB sensitivity. A 25mm xmax driver might have 86dB sensitivity, reducing maximum SPL by 10dB. Phil is being kind to say that they're trying to deceive. I'm more inclined to call them as I sees them. They're peddling a load of BS. The combination of 126dB continuous (dB SPL @ 1m) with frequency response: 62 Hz – 20 kHz (±3dB) from an eight inch woofer loaded cabinet of that size is impossible to realize, by a very wide margin.
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For Larry Hartke (if he visits here)
Bill Fitzmaurice replied to Zombie1965's topic in Amps and Cabs
The demise of Hartke was predictable when it was taken over by Samson. It was only a matter of time before the bean counters ruined a good brand. It's similar to what happened to Ampeg with LOUD, and what will happen to Turbosound with Behringer. -
https://billfitzmaurice.info/forum/
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You need a break out panel. My assumption is that you don't know what that is. Go to my forum and ask there in the Pro Sound Setup section. This wiring may be Greek to you but not to the PA gurus on my site. It's how most of them run their rigs, because it is conventional with large touring systems..
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+1. No matter what he was playing with and through Jaco always sounded like Jaco.
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There's a lot more to funk than EQ. Bootsy and Rocco aren't defined by their tone, they're defined by their chops. The thing you don't want to do is have too much low end, as that doesn't work well with staccato technique. With funk the bass isn't a background instrument, it's a lead instrument, so it should be mid prominent.
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The XLR are a means to send signal to the sub driver without using the speakons. They also could be used to link sub to sub, and main to main, assuming the mains panels look the same.
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If that results in one amp channel powering both speakers don't do that. If you don't split the lows to the subs and the rest to the mains with an electronic crossover the system simply won't work as it should. All you're risking is blown drivers, as well as bad sound. Ohmage is what you pay to Jack Bruce, Entwhistle, even Sir Paul. Speakers have impedance. You must bi-amp, either using a single two channel amp with one channel for the subs and one for the mains, or using a pair of two channel amps, one amp for the subs, one for the mains.
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The design isn't unusual, you're just not used to dealing with passive subs/mains that require bi-amping. I recommend this exact 4 pole speakon wiring in all my passive subs and mains. It's also the most commonly used arrangement in high end commercial passive PA.
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They don't do that. Using the speakons there's no connection between the drivers of the subs and the drivers of the mains.
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Every PA manufacturer should have that information contained with their owner's manual. AFAIK none do. I posted similar information on my forum in 2006, less than two months after I started it. https://billfitzmaurice.info/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=398
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Make sure of what poles are connected to what. Remember it requires two amps, or two channels of one amp.
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They're all parallel, no crossover. If the speakons don't work you may not have the right connection on the cable plug. Those are four pole. According to the diagram 2+2- are connected to the driver, 1+1- are pass through, so you can use a four conductor cable to send both the low and high frequency signals from a breakout panel on the amp rack to the subs and then just a two conductor cable from there to the mains.
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It's possible they have passives, but I'd open them up to be sure of it.