bloke_zero

I finally took the leap and ordered a EB, MM Cutlass - it arrived last week and I'm very pleased. After a bit of time with it including a little recording I can say it's a beautiful thing and sounds great. I was looking for passive P-style bass. I didn't want go Fender because none of the ones I tried were really speaking to me except a sunburst professional which was out of my range - these things need a bit mojo! I got a deal on an ex-display which had, apparently suffered a bit of a fall - chip on the headstock, a couple of small dents on the body - otherwise pretty immaculate. Pluses I love the neck - it's pretty close to the pre EB stingray I tried (in an amazing 70's brown) and really invites playing up the neck in a way I find the flatter radiused boards just don't I thought I didn't like the pick up - it doesn't have enough of the nasal cut through thing that I was after, but after some recording it sits effortlessly in the mix without much tweaking. I though I could just drop in a p-pickup but I'm going to sit with it for a while. A lot of attention to detail - sloped edge for your thumb on the pickup, case coveniently has 'cutlass' on it in case you forget where you've put it, pots feel right - smooth and solid - fit and finish is all really top notch. Cons Still expensive, and why did I buy a not a p-bass p-bass? I can't help myself sometimes. And before you start on 'ugly' - I like it - it has a nice look for me, slightly generic, but well considered and tight aesthetically - some how feels a bit 60's, which I like - future retro!

Fair point! I'm not a big fan of the MFD though - too steely sounding for me. I wasn't meaning to say that the pre EB MM wasn't good - just that the variation of wind made an impact on the sound - I've played pre EB stingrays that were up there for me. I have a Nordstrand MM and really like how it sounds - I'd buy one of his P pickups but - to come full circle - I thought why not see what the UK has to offer?

Well, fair enough - but fun to find out. I was reading about Ernie Ball taking over the MM factory and standardising things like the pickup winds - the Leo Fender factory had some ladies with a jury rigged tension winder making the pickups and the variation was great as well as quality - some were quiet, some had uneven frequncy output, some were better. EB standardised on what they felt to be the best, and - and set up the new machines accordingly. Is hand wound different from machine wound? So wind, wire type can have an effect. Magnets type can clearly have an effect - no one is saying a bongo sounds like a pre-cbs precision even without a preamp. It is the interaction of all these things that make it an art - I'm interested in hearing a pickup made by someone who is interested in this stuff. I agree I may be fetishising something that I may find makes no difference, but in my mind I'm trying to bring together a set of things into a bass that really sings, so... I have a rickenbaker lapsteel that my dad bought - has a handwound pickup from 1939 - it's very hard to say, when you hear it straight into a soundcard that it isn't something special.

Yes, I was kind of thinking of instead of the boutiquey US makers if there were people in the UK making stuff - it seems like in the US the home builder is pretty well served with custom bodies, necks, pickups etc, (I'm thinking Wamoth, USACG etc.) but it's a bit thinner in the UK. The pickup market well served though it seems! Thanks for all the suggestions!

I think you're discounting the drive of the obssessive idiot 🙂 I have a real thing about passive basses and eq. I am especially obsessive at the moment because I can't get into a room with some people crank the bass and just have a good time - I'm recording and trying to get good takes in an especially exposed context (effectively sampling myself - so any given line will be initially foregrounded and then repeated). During the recording process I've found EQ to be problematic and as @Woodinblack rightly opines "You can't eq something that isn't there in the first place" - so for me, at the moment it's important. Also, it's an aesthetic right? Simple, direct circuits, no digital, no fancy eq - just the straight up sound. That, In my limited experience, with some good technique that is what makes a good recording. (Yeah, I'll probably compress it and eq it, but I want the basic sound to be as strong, clear and articulate as possible.) Live is another matter - there I find shouting a lot and whooping to be the thing...

I spent ages researching a preamp for a MM thing I was building and put a John East in - it was a great sounding thing but I felt like I lost the character of the pickups a little and eventually took it out. The cons for taking it out were that it's a lot less flexible in terms of oceans of bass, loss of sweepable mid etc, but I felt like the passive sounded clearer. So much so that taking it out felt like the right choice rather than putting in a switch. It's hard to describe but if you've ever struggled with eq-ing a recording it's that feeling of aiming for a sound and boosting frequencies that sound good on their own but in context of a track sound a little mushy or ill defined. Recording engineers will generally recommend using EQ to cut not boost and that seems right to me (though I do love a baxandall tone stack!). I also feel like the best place for an active tone control is in an amp with a power supply rather than squeezed into the back cavity of a bass - but all of this its totally subjective!

Thanks for all the suggestions - I've had a look at all of them and there is a lot to explore! Anyone got any thoughts on "The neodymium version has a brighter, modern sounding, wilder tone." - I need to find some sound samples but my google-fu is weak today - just endless threads discussing alnico II, II, V and ceramics! I go straight into anAmpeg SCR-DI that has relatively low threshold before distorting - so too high an output is an issue for me.

I'm wondering about UK winders! I was looking at the Nordstrand NP4a with the angled pole pieces as I really like the musicman pickup I have from them, but I'm interested in who you rate in the UK? I guess the sound I'm looking for is what I'd call a modern P sound - something that Sam Wilkes gets (I know a lot of his sound is impeccable tecnique!) e.g. here: https://www.notreble.com/buzz/2017/12/08/knower-time-traveler/ Crisp, well articulated, defined top end but without loosing too much bottom. I had a google and there seem to be a few out there but I don't want to go by quality of website as an indicator of quality of pickup! Cheers

I was misled by the description then 😛 Looks like it's sold! Ok - who did it?!

Yes - I was really tempted by this: https://ashdownmusic.com/collections/b-stock/products/lodestone-artist-b-stock But I don't want active and it's really hard to tell what is going on with the finish from the photo's - sort of looks like it flaked off! Makes you wonder what'd happen if you could call them and make an offer on it? Can't help but think a wipedown with a cloth would have been a good move before taking pictures!

Nice - how does it play?

I'd live with it - there is a chinese saying something to do with 'raw silk/uncut wood' - I like seeing the grain and natural colour coming through. Are you going to add a pickguard? I'm guessing not - that would make a big difference.

I have a Nordstrand MM4.4 and I'm wondering about the pickup height. It is not in a stingray and the electronics are passive. I was reading this: https://reverb.com/news/pickup-height-an-easy-diy-tone-tweak And this jumped out at me: Which I was hearing something like with some recording I was doing. Which also had a little Dark Glass Microtubes with the treble switch activated (something like the ampeg ultra-high setting but with some overdrive). Standard MM stingray pup height is 6/32nds from the bottom of the E string to the pickup cover. Mine was more like 8/32nd. Now the actual question (for anyone who's made it through this far!) is could the Nordy magnets be messing with the strings even though set below the recommended height? I just moved the pickup down so it's more like 10/32nds (8mm) and it seems to help for sure. Just interested in the unseen waves affecting my world!

If I was in the market for a Jazz style I'd look at this: https://ashdownmusic.com/collections/b-stock/products/lodestone-primal-artist-b-stocl The black P-bass is sort of too ugly to contemplate.

I've been thinking a lot about cleaning up my technique and I never had a settled right hand muting technique, recently I had some time on my hands and I went with the Jaco, which I understood to be: Little finger E 3rd finger A And letting the playing fingers mute D when you got that far - I could be wrong! The thumb kind of floats between anchored on the pickup and I really struggled with the 3rd finger - it felt like it was getting crooked and in the way when I was playing the D string, but it feels much more natural now. I basically played a lot of scales, arpeggios and then re-learnt a few of the lines with that in mind. I choose that method because it feels more anchored but flexible - like you're in a kung-fu stance but with fingers if you know what I mean? And because it was really unnatural feeling and I liked the change! Great playing in the video!

I have a nice one from https://www.bassculture.de/bilder.html Stacked - lovely warm round tone.

Great video - I had no need to know all that but had to watch as the suspense vs calm and methodical approach was better than TV.

https://www.ebay.com/str/sppinternational/FERNANDES/_i.html?_storecat=25405136012 These guys have a selection with free international shipping - almost tempting!

The warman looks interesting: https://www.warmanguitars.co.uk/product/mm4-4-string-bass-humbucker-13-09kohm-4-wire-overwound/ Any idea where the capacitor chart he references is?

I have a Nordstrand MM4.4 Quad Coil - great sounding pickup.

Is that one of the Northwest ones? I have pretty much the same thing on my pbass/stingray cross - really like it - nice weight, looks good, feels good under the palm.

Well, really, that human beings like to copy, and copying can be a path to innovation.

I agree - I was thinking that about the Wilcock thread - https://www.wilcocklondon.com/

I agree, but if you extrapolated that out it would be a pretty good argument for doing nothing ever. I’m thinking specifically of covers band - providing a version of something classic and probably definitively ‘done already’. But that ignores the human need too emulate and from emulation to evolution and all the value that the peers of the emulators find in that process, and the occasional brilliant steps onward that can come out of that process. as for the innovators - heads ain’t ready, until they are!